Current Affairs The Labour Party

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catcherintherye said:
For the standards Corbyn sets himself it was very good. Look he's no Tony Blair and never will be, but he spoke well. He's very good in campaigning mode, and few people worry about him at moments like this. It's the rest pf the time there are pressures!
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Fair enough. I thought his delivery was a long way off of a Blair, and the call and response thing with the audience just came across as super weird. More evangelical church leader than prime minister.
 
catcherintherye said:
This is how he did well at the last election though. He spoke of core issues, and was accused of preaching to the converted. So either these issues have a wider appeal than we first imagined or preaching to the converted is actually quite a good strategy when you have a very large membership base (it's always worked well for the Catholic church too!).
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I honestly think it's more that May was that bad. She alienated her own base with the pension threat, ran from TV debates and then sulked her way around the country.

I think the 'preaching to the converted' thing is true and you'll pick up some additional votes from those on the fringe of already accepting that ideology, but there was no mainstream, widespread acceptance of Corbyn - hence why he ultimately lost the election.

Doing what he's doing now - throwing out mad promises left, right and centre - isn't going to broaden his appeal.

He went up against the worst electioneering Prime Minister ever in my view after years of austerity and still couldn't win. How he has a chance now is honestly beyond me.
 
Tubey said:
I honestly think it's more that May was that bad. She alienated her own base with the pension threat, ran from TV debates and then sulked her way around the country.

I think the 'preaching to the converted' thing is true and you'll pick up some additional votes from those on the fringe of already accepting that ideology, but there was no mainstream, widespread acceptance of Corbyn - hence why he ultimately lost the election.

Doing what he's doing now - throwing out mad promises left, right and centre - isn't going to broaden his appeal.

He went up against the worst electioneering Prime Minister ever in my view after years of austerity and still couldn't win. How he has a chance now is honestly beyond me.
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Plus both Lib Dems and Brexit Party were nowhere last time out, and that won't be the case now.
 
Tubey said:
I honestly think it's more that May was that bad. She alienated her own base with the pension threat, ran from TV debates and then sulked her way around the country.

I think the 'preaching to the converted' thing is true and you'll pick up some additional votes from those on the fringe of already accepting that ideology, but there was no mainstream, widespread acceptance of Corbyn - hence why he ultimately lost the election.

Doing what he's doing now - throwing out mad promises left, right and centre - isn't going to broaden his appeal.

He went up against the worst electioneering Prime Minister ever in my view after years of austerity and still couldn't win. How he has a chance now is honestly beyond me.
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There's 2 things I'd say mate. The first is, nobody said this about May at the time. Everyone felt she was stronger than Thatcher and Blair going into the election, and when I started trying to point out Corbyn was actually doing ok and she was flouncing they just repeated that I was deluded, Corbyn only talking to his base, I was in a bubble etc etc. May wasn't as bad as people say, a lot of the Tories problems were structural and as a result of poor strategy. Johnson bouncing around hospitals and going on about the public sector is also really poor strategy.

As for Corbyn, yes most of the promises are highly ambitious. If you look at yougov and other sites though, they have broad appeal. I'll ask you though,do you honestly think Corbyn has any chance whatsoever of winning if he fights a fairly mainstream, orthodox campaign that aims to win over left tories and liberal democrats by mediating his message? In a context of Brexit, polarisation all over the continent, Clinton being dubbed, CHUK (who promised to do that flopping) etc. I mean even peak Blair would struggle now in my view. Corbyn has no chance. He's an elderly bloke who's a principle and decent back bencher but lacks any kind of credibility of that.

His only chance is to be seen to be true to himself, it's one weapon he has, he;s seen as authentic and principled and to break such principles now would be damaging. Yes there are problems created down the line, and that will be difficult to manage. My own view is that if he wins, people will be left very underwhelmed by Corbyn, and a lot of time will be spent trying to explain that away and stop demoralisation (which if you read a lot of my posts on here even you can see I spend a fair bit of time trying to do).

I can't blame him for fighting a radical campaign though. Thats good strategy for him and the current situation.
 
Don't underestimate Corbyn and his appeal to those affected by austerity.

Not to mention how he's engaged the younger vote. More so than any politician in my lifetime.

He's got a very good chance, especially if the SNP are willing to get involved with them. The tories are very worried imo.
 
catcherintherye said:
There's 2 things I'd say mate. The first is, nobody said this about May at the time. Everyone felt she was stronger than Thatcher and Blair going into the election, and when I started trying to point out Corbyn was actually doing ok and she was flouncing they just repeated that I was deluded, Corbyn only talking to his base, I was in a bubble etc etc. May wasn't as bad as people say, a lot of the Tories problems were structural and as a result of poor strategy. Johnson bouncing around hospitals and going on about the public sector is also really poor strategy.

As for Corbyn, yes most of the promises are highly ambitious. If you look at yougov and other sites though, they have broad appeal. I'll ask you though,do you honestly think Corbyn has any chance whatsoever of winning if he fights a fairly mainstream, orthodox campaign that aims to win over left tories and liberal democrats by mediating his message? In a context of Brexit, polarisation all over the continent, Clinton being dubbed, CHUK (who promised to do that flopping) etc. I mean even peak Blair would struggle now in my view. Corbyn has no chance. He's an elderly bloke who's a principle and decent back bencher but lacks any kind of credibility of that.

His only chance is to be seen to be true to himself, it's one weapon he has, he;s seen as authentic and principled and to break such principles now would be damaging. Yes there are problems created down the line, and that will be difficult to manage. My own view is that if he wins, people will be left very underwhelmed by Corbyn, and a lot of time will be spent trying to explain that away and stop demoralisation (which if you read a lot of my posts on here even you can see I spend a fair bit of time trying to do).

I can't blame him for fighting a radical campaign though. Thats good strategy for him and the current situation.
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It's true that May was quite highly regarded at the start of the election campaign, but she soon showed herself to be totally lacking in charisma, a poor campaigner and afraid to face ordinary people. Remember her squawking "Nothing has changed! Nothing has changed!" to general scorn?
 
NilSatisOptimum said:
Thought you meant Abe Lincoln so I thought I would ask before being led down another Liberal rabid wabbit hole, and I was right. So Abe the Japanese leader does not have unsavoury views?
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I wasn't passing comment on his governing style, or indeed that of Macron and Merkel, merely saying that he will need to get on with other political leaders around the world (and indeed commercial leaders too). I can see him opening the local garden fete rather more than I can attending Davos.
 
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