Current Affairs The Labour Party

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Even that scab Neil Kinnock doesn't know what they are now.

I can tell him: they're a right wing liberal-democratic party probably not even as progressive as the U.S. Democratic Party these days.

Just look at the language from them on immigration and big business and patriotism.

They really should have the decency to drop the word 'Labour' from their name. It's misleading to say the least. They are a party that's been transformed into corporate Britain's best bet to continue with their ambitions to privatise the whole of the UKs social and economic life.

Anyone who votes for them doesn't get the right to criticise them thereafter when it all goes tits up. That's because they've been told by the Starmer cult exactly what they won't be getting.

Vote for them and you face that.
I voted for Corbyn s Labour (not Corbyn) despite it being significantly economically disadvantageous for me because I believed it would transform society get us closer to the world I grew up in, which had much less division and inequality. I'll probably vote for Starmer's Labour to get rid of the worst government in my lifetime and because I trust Rachel Reeves on the economy and I need to make my pension pot grow in the next 10 years so I can live in relative comfort. Very different aims, but nobody is offering to change society now, which is sad because the world is in a mess.
 
I voted for Corbyn s Labour (not Corbyn) despite it being significantly economically disadvantageous for me because I believed it would transform society get us closer to the world I grew up in, which had much less division and inequality. I'll probably vote for Starmer's Labour to get rid of the worst government in my lifetime and because I trust Rachel Reeves on the economy and I need to make my pension pot grow in the next 10 years so I can live in relative comfort. Very different aims, but nobody is offering to change society now, which is sad because the world is in a mess.
I respect all that, apart from the Reeves bit.

She's promising growth, from what exactly? The cutting of planning red tape for 'entrepreneurship' to flourish and some hoped for trickle down benefits for the rest of society resulting from that?

It's fantasy stuff.

There is nothing to recommend voting for Starmer's lot beyond the momentary satisfaction of ousting the Tory Party.
 
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I respect all that, apart from the Reeves bit.

She's promising growth, from what exactly? The cutting of planning red tape for 'entrepreneurship' to flourish and some hoped for trickle down benefits for the rest of society resulting from that?

It's fantasy stuff.

There is nothing to recommend voting for Starmer's lot beyond the momentary satisfaction of ousting the Tory Party.
What would be your manifesto Dave?
 
I respect all that, apart from the Reeves bit.

She's promising growth, from what exactly? The cutting of planning red tape for 'entrepreneurship' to flourish and some hoped for trickle down benefits for the rest of society resulting from that?

It's fantasy stuff.

There is nothing to recommend voting for Starmer's lot beyond the momentary satisfaction of ousting the Tory Party.

….public services will be better, I have no doubt about that and removal of planning restrictions does make infrastructure projects easier (which improves growth).

Thing will be better with Labour.
 
She's Jo Cox's sister, and only got into politics to honour her sister's memory.
Is the bill really that bad? Seems like most licensing organisations etc feel it would save lives and have a positive effect on road safety.

I'd be interested in reading more on the research behind the legisaltion rather than just hammering it because white van man gets angry
 
….public services will be better, I have no doubt about that and removal of planning restrictions does make infrastructure projects easier (which improves growth).

Thing will be better with Labour.
Removing planning restrictions (or any protections) to enable corporations to own heavily subsidised infrastructure doesn't get my juices flowing. Also sounds vaguely familiar.
 
I don't think you need to 'like' a party specifically, we're talking about voting for them to take power, not joining them as a member. It's of more importance to consider which is going to be able to govern the country more effectively.

And in that, for me, the main distinction between the two, stripping away any of the "are they too Right/Left wing" stuff, is that the Tories are still stuck down a Brexit cul-de-sac in which they can't reverse from without internal party politics getting in the way - the backseat drivers of the ERG etc howling treachery at any attempt to roll back some of the damaging decisions that have been taken this past political generation. They aren't operating in reality and have only got plans to double down and make things even worse (see: Rwanda).

Labour are unencumbered by all that and so have got more leeway to make changes with the EU. Starmer may rule a lot of this stuff out now, but when sitting in No 10 with a stonking majority, it may be more appealing. And if it eases a lot of the economic pressure and gets people feeling like things are moving in the right direction again, he may not suffer much of an electoral hit for going back on what he'd said before.

Starmer's Labour aren't anywhere near my dream political party (and I'm not at all convinced by him personally), but I understand that in terms of where my vote has to go this year they're the only sensible choice (constituency allowing). But then I'm not afraid of voting for people who may win an election and take power, and then having to be responsible for my vote. Some people apparently can't handle that sort of charge.
 
Oh yeah, the other thing that could happen with a Labour government is that we get a strong movement from the Left who challenge Starmer's leadership down the line, and take control of the country with a more Socialist outlook in mind, much the same way that the Tory nutters hid behind Cameron's "hug a hoodie" centrists before they deposed him via Brexit and started proposing all manner of damage.

Clearly, this isn't going to happen if Sunak stays in No 10, despite what the GB News idiots say about him being 'virtually a Socialist' because he's not as mad as Truss.

What it would also need is for the Left of Labour to remain in the party. They need to be there advocating for change, instead of running away with their tails between their legs & leaving the party on the cusp of it taking power to "keep their hands clean".
 
Is the bill really that bad? Seems like most licensing organisations etc feel it would save lives and have a positive effect on road safety.

I'd be interested in reading more on the research behind the legisaltion rather than just hammering it because white van man gets angry
I don't know. I was just answering the question "where do they find people like Kim Leadbetter?"
 
Nothing. Yet. But they were two pivotal moments that have brought us to this juncture with your backing. What do you like about this 'Labour' party Bruce?
I'd say that perhaps the bigger thing was the hysteria about tuition fees among the well to do middle classes, as that sank Clegg and the LDs ability to temper the Tories in government, leaving Cameron with the only people to pander to was the right of his party, hence why he promised the referendum in the next election.
 
What would be your manifesto Dave?
Oh that's an easy one to answer:

  • Create a nationalised energy company
  • End outsourcing in the NHS and local government
  • Increase income tax for the top 5% of earners
  • Defend freedom of movement for EU citizens
  • Scrap tuition fees
  • End the two-child limit on tax credit
  • Scrap Universal Credit
  • Scrap private schools' charitable status
  • Commit £28B investment to help build a green economy
  • Fully implement the New Deal for Workers

....in other words, I'd carry out all the policies Starmer won his Labour leadership election on but has binned in a series of u-turns.
 
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