Current Affairs Syria...

[bluestevon]

I agree with this, the USA always wanted to be the big dog, then it did, but the Obamas of this world didn’t know or have the stomach to deal with it. Syria has been at war for 8 years. It only took 4 years to deal with WW1 and 6 years to sort out WW2........

We disagree on most things mate

The undeniable fact though is Americas foreign policy has always and probably will always be a shambles, because it is based on bringing 'freedom and democracy' to other countries, however only if that freedom and democracy lines up with America, otherwise it's not regarded as valid, hence overthrowing legitimate governments on numerous occasions, supplying arms to whoever is the current flavour of the month with them, and years later having to blow up those same arms when they regard their friend as a new enemy.

It's a dying empire, and like all dying empires it's a dangerous one, biggest threat to world peace isn't the Russians, or Chinese or even terrorism, it's an empire trying to hold onto what it once had, history shows that and America is following the same markers all falling empires do.

 

[bluestevon]

Psychopaths and Dictators rarely make sense. Do you subscribe to the Russian explanation that for both case ‘the Brits did it’......

I think they are as likely an answer to the assumption that both where Russian actions mate actually.

To blindly assume your own country is always on the 'side of good' and the moral compass is painfully naive.

Same country trained the Khmer rouge, lied about WMD to the people and parliament in order to invade a country against international law, has supplied numerous dictators (including Assad btw) with weapons, supported Pinochet and sheltered him.

Why do you believe it is impossible that on this occasion it may not be whiter than white?

BTW Putin a dictator? OK, as much a one as May or Trump IMO, difference being he is ACTUALLY very popular inside Russia, not because people are scared of him, but because the last guy who the west actually likes was Yeltsin - who is reviled inside Russia - as for many is Gorbachov btw, same now with the variety of 'opposition' candidates the west are trumpeting as being persecuted to keep power, the opposition isn't serious with or without persecution because frankly mate there is no desire amongst the people for change, life is better than it has been in 20 years and is improving by the year.

The will for change comes from the West not from within Russia, it'd be like RT sticking the EDL and Ukip leaders on tv as an example of how the rightful opposition in the UK is being opressed by the British dictatorship.


Oh for the record btw, the US and UK aren't democracies nowadays anyway, the are pure capitalist/venture capitalist societies now, big difference, a democracy wouldn't be scared to do an action due to fear of various lobby groups such as the pro Israeli one in the US, or the gun industry, or arms or drug manufacturers, or the oil industries etc

 

[peteblue]

I think they are as likely an answer to the assumption that both where Russian actions mate actually.

To blindly assume your own country is always on the 'side of good' and the moral compass is painfully naive.

Same country trained the Khmer rouge, lied about WMD to the people and parliament in order to invade a country against international law, has supplied numerous dictators (including Assad btw) with weapons, supported Pinochet and sheltered him.

Why do you believe it is impossible that on this occasion it may not be whiter than white?

BTW Putin a dictator? OK, as much a one as May or Trump IMO, difference being he is ACTUALLY very popular inside Russia, not because people are scared of him, but because the last guy who the west actually likes was Yeltsin - who is reviled inside Russia - as for many is Gorbachov btw, same now with the variety of 'opposition' candidates the west are trumpeting as being persecuted to keep power, the opposition isn't serious with or without persecution because frankly mate there is no desire amongst the people for change, life is better than it has been in 20 years and is improving by the year.

The will for change comes from the West not from within Russia, it'd be like RT sticking the EDL and Ukip leaders on tv as an example of how the rightful opposition in the UK is being opressed by the British dictatorship.


Oh for the record btw, the US and UK aren't democracies nowadays anyway, the are pure capitalist/venture capitalist societies now, big difference, a democracy wouldn't be scared to do an action due to fear of various lobby groups such as the pro Israeli one in the US, or the gun industry, or arms or drug manufacturers, or the oil industries etc

Well, by profession and experience, I have never blindly assumed anything in my life, but the Russian response in all of this has been a) deny it, then b) blame the U.K. of doing it. Now I wouldn’t mind if they did (b) to begin with, but to categorically deny it before blaming the U.K. is a bit childish and totally illogical. They have helped to prove the case against themselves by this nonsensical approach. They have been caught out, and just like a naughty child they have come up with all and sundry denials before blaming someone else, it’s stupid and plays only to the supporters of Russia, Corbyn, Abbott etc.......

 

[magicjuan]

The irony of America as a failing empire is that it has been brought about by globalist capitalism that has no need to tie itself to one particular nafion, rather it ties itself to 'like minded' people within structures and systems within natkon states.
The control of the flow of money superceded any democratic process and is powerful enough to foment trouble spots and inflame hostilities. There are puppets controlling puppets controlling puppets controlling puppets ad infinitum...

 

[bluestevon]

Well, by profession and experience, I have never blindly assumed anything in my life, but the Russian response in all of this has been a) deny it, then b) blame the U.K. of doing it. Now I wouldn’t mind if they did (b) to begin with, but to categorically deny it before blaming the U.K. is a bit childish and totally illogical. They have helped to prove the case against themselves by this nonsensical approach. They have been caught out, and just like a naughty child they have come up with all and sundry denials before blaming someone else, it’s stupid and plays only to the supporters of Russia, Corbyn, Abbott etc.......

and how would you deem the UK's response of apportioning blame prior to any semblance of an investigation being thoroughly done mate?

Including the foreign secretary lying about what he had been told regarding the origin of the chemical?

Seems to me your thinking is this, and forgive me for thinking you are indeed blindly assuming the following.

UK before any investigation blames Russia, Russia instantly denies then blames the UK, = undeniable proof of Russian guilt.

Obviously you are referring to the Syria matter here in large, here is a counter to what you say proves Russian guilt, innocent person is accused by another of doing something - he would deny it yes?, then he finds out the person accusing him did the thing - what would he then say - yup he'd say to the accuser that he was guilty.

Just a bit of History that i am sure you are aware of already

A television documentary has reported that British soldiers have been training the Communist Khmer Rouge guerrillas of Cambodia. The Government has denied the claim, but opposition legislators said they would press it for an explanation.
That was Oct 1990

The Foreign Office response was to lie. "Britain does not give military aid in any form to the Cambodian factions," stated a parliamentary reply. The then prime minister, Thatcher, wrote to Neil Kinnock: "I confirm that there is no British government involvement of any kind in training, equipping or co-operating with Khmer Rouge forces or those allied to them." On 25 June 1991, after two years of denials, the government finally admitted that the SAS had been secretly training the "resistance" since 1983. A report by Asia Watch filled in the detail: the SAS had taught "the use of improvised explosive devices, booby traps and the manufacture and use of time-delay devices". The author of the report, Rae McGrath (who shared a joint Nobel Peace Prize for the international campaign on landmines), wrote in the Guardian that "the SAS training was a criminally irresponsible and cynical policy".
From the new statesman in 2000

Tar Russia with the brush of the past actions, then at least hold that same candle of history up to the country you believe couldn't possibly lie in such a manner

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

The Kremlin are off their tits, the stuff they come out with, seems to be working on a few in here though.

 

[peteblue]

The Kremlin are off their tits, the stuff they come out with, seems to be working on a few in here though.

This really.........

 

[peteblue]

 

[bluestevon]

View attachment 45605

Go on then mate, simple question, what you think happens if the UK launch missiles at targets in Syria and Russian soldiers die?

Will you be as nonchalant then?

 

[magicjuan]

This really.........

Not really though is it?

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

America saying Assad has used chemical weapons 50 times in the last 7 years, every country at the UN have voted for chemical weapons inspections in Syria 6 times, and 6 times Russia has used it's veto to stop the inspections.

Says it all really, it's about time the West stood up to Russia, they take the pee whenever they can, enough is enough.

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

Not really though is it?

Yeah it really is, the russian sympathizers in this thread astonish me.

 

[peteblue]

Go on then mate, simple question, what you think happens if the UK launch missiles at targets in Syria and Russian soldiers die?

Will you be as nonchalant then?

Surely there would be no Russian soldiers near a Chemical weapons plant, they are after all illegal......

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

Go on then mate, simple question, what you think happens if the UK launch missiles at targets in Syria and Russian soldiers die?

Will you be as nonchalant then?

Why are people so scared of Russia?, they have a 10th of the firepower of Nato, it would be absolute lunacy for them to take on Nato.

 

[peteblue]

Yeah it really is, the russian sympathizers in this thread astonish me.

Oh, you’ve seen nothing yet, have a look at the ‘critically ill man is a former Russian agent’ thread.....now they are real sympathisers and apologists.......