Steve Walsh - with the benefit of hindsight

[Ian]

Wow

Remember when we used to get Man U rejects? Laughing doesn't seem adequate, somehow.

 

[FTY]

Hope we’re living in the timeline where Gibson, Adeniran & Bowler go on to be world beaters and Walshy’s remembered as a hero

 

[davek]

What part of Walsh signings/Koeman signings dont you get?

This is not Walsh v Brands.

Anyway, I'm putting this in the Brands thread an away from here as it's off topic in a summer transfer window thread.

Its already here, OMG, daves a mod?????????

But yeah, its not Walsh v Brands, it wouldnt even be fair.

I do love the way you will put all the rubbish players to Koeman and give Walsh all the decent 1s.

Its actually more impressive then i thought, bar Klassen (Koeman) anyone who has been sold has made a significant profit.

Tell me which one you think is a Koeman signing.

None of them.

Gueye never played a championship game mate. That's just sensationalism to make Walsh look better. If he didn't join us, West Ham wanted him.

He was down there when he signed him, I mean.

 

[davek]

Walsh gave one season wonder Sandro Ramirez £90k on a 5 year contract who we now can’t shift

Big Dog Marcel has just bent Juventus over a table for one of Europe’s hottest talents, then brought said youngster down to earth with a manageable salary

Walsh made mistakes, but are more than covered by the cash gained from sales of Walsh players.

 

[Neiler]

There will be a lot of black and white revisionism with Walsh. As with most things it's never quite black and white.

That being said he had two major faults for me, which were linked. The first was he didn't close enough deals, the 2nd that he didn't control the process and essentially subordinate the manager (so essentially insist on his players).

He was very keen on Bailey, Gray (from Leicester at 12 million) Mendy (who's just gone to Madrid), Isak. Regarding young players he liked both the Sessegnon twins, Brooks, Adawairo (City player) as well as Hirst and Zizkee as younger players. Had we have added the above players, instead of those Koeman insisted upon we'd have had a squad worth far more money and with the right coach one that could have developed.

Fair is fair, some we were linked with Belfodil & Gabbiadini who we were heavily linked with have flopped so we dodged a bullet there. Likewise I have little doubt Sandro was his pick and that was a poor buy.

However Gana was an excellent signing, Keane & Pickford while not faultless have proven to be decent enough and the younger players signed, Lookman, Vlasic, Onyekuru, Gibson etc will all prove to be smart buys. If he'd have trusted his approach more he'd have probably done much better.

The wider issue lay above Walsh though. You got a guy in as DOF who was essentially a scout and couldn't close deals. You stuck him into an infrastructure that couldn't close deals and worked in a slow, meticulous and cautious way. Then you had a domineering manager who wanted success quickly and an owner who was briefing the press it would be like City. It's an impossible situation. His skill at Leicester was finding diamonds at a knockdown price and over time feeding them in. It was never the job we needed.

If I am honest, it's not the job United want either. He will do very poorly there, not because he has no skill, but because the role doesn't suit him.

David Brooks springs to mind as well, what a gem that lad is.

 

[davek]

Koeman was very much old boys club, he looked after a lot of Dutch ulumni and former clubs, i bet if you delved a bit deeper you could see corralations with agents etc.

it was a poor mix, Walsh with an eye but a powder puff personality, Koeman, with zero eye but a strubborn self rightousness.

What i will say about Walsh is he could also shift players for fees, he did some cracking work in clearing deadwood in minimum windows, Cleverly, Oviedo, Pienaar, McGeady also clearling the decks of some long term high earners etc all for real money. I see them as worse players then what Brands has to shift. I just cant see there not being a market some where for Mirallas, McCarthy, Besic, Bolaise and Schenderlin, Niasse and Tosun.

The window is still open however so all shifting sands.

Good point on the shifting out aspect of Walsh's time here.

Look at the stars he unearthed for Leicester. Kante, Mahhrez and Vardy alone prove his genius at scouting.

 

[vintage-toffees]

Some of Walsh’s signings weren’t actually Walsh signings they happened on his watch but he got over ruled on a few koeman was solely behind the signing of a few klaassen and Martina were down to koeman as was Schneiderlin he also wanted Memphis DePay but Walsh managed to get that one knocked back

 

[Groucho]

Good point on the shifting out aspect of Walsh's time here.

Look at the stars he unearthed for Leicester. Kante, Mahhrez and Vardy alone prove his genius at scouting.

I have to be honest, I’m starting to think that (while I massively prefer, nay worship, Brands) perhaps the dud signings were more Koeman.

Walsh got us Pickford (England’s goalie), Gana, Onyekuru (admittedly he should’ve looked into his permit first but he’s a good player), Siggurdsson, Keane, Vlasic and Sandro (a dud no question).

Koeman got us Bolasie, Rooney (w/ BK), Klaassen, Martina, Schneiderlin.

Personally I think Walsh’s reputation has been damaged by Koeman although I much prefer Brands. Koeman’s signings are mixed at best.

 

[davek]

And that’s why Walsh ultimately failed, because he failed to ensure the manager had a cohesive plan. A DoF has to provide the overview to recruitment and ensure it serves the long term interests of the club and not just the short term interests of the manager.
It wasn’t the quality of his recruits that betrayed him, it was his weakness as a senior manager.
On the plus side his failure allowed us to recruit Brands and now everything’s sweet.

That's already been conceded mate. [I've swtiched this from the Brands to the Walsh thread, btw]

 

[PhilM]

I have to be honest, I’m starting to think that (while I massively prefer, nay worship, Brands) perhaps the dud signings were more Koeman.

Walsh got us Pickford (England’s goalie), Gana, Onyekuru (admittedly he should’ve looked into his permit first but he’s a good player), Siggurdsson, Keane, Vlasic and Sandro (a dud no question).

Koeman got us Bolasie, Rooney (w/ BK), Klaassen, Martina, Schneiderlin.

Personally I think Walsh’s reputation has been damaged by Koeman although I much prefer Brands. Koeman’s signings are mixed at best.

You're being very, very polite there.

 

[davek]

I have to be honest, I’m starting to think that (while I massively prefer, nay worship, Brands) perhaps the dud signings were more Koeman.

Walsh got us Pickford (England’s goalie), Gana, Onyekuru (admittedly he should’ve looked into his permit first but he’s a good player), Siggurdsson, Keane, Vlasic and Sandro (a dud no question).

Koeman got us Bolasie, Rooney (w/ BK), Klaassen, Martina, Schneiderlin.

Personally I think Walsh’s reputation has been damaged by Koeman although I much prefer Brands. Koeman’s signings are mixed at best.

This.

He didn't have the stature for what was required here. However, he needs to be disentangled from Koemageddon. As a scout he was generally spot on.

It's just laziness that has some people pointing at Walsh and leaving the real culprit one side. It also allows them to maximize Brands' effectiveness.

If Steve Walsh had been called Stefan Van Walsche a certan poster on here would have had the username of StefansGoat.

 

[vintage-toffees]

Some of Walsh’s signings weren’t actually Walsh signings they happened on homies watch
But koeman was behind the signings of a few klaa

I have to be honest, I’m starting to think that (while I massively prefer, nay worship, Brands) perhaps the dud signings were more Koeman.

Walsh got us Pickford (England’s goalie), Gana, Onyekuru (admittedly he should’ve looked into his permit first but he’s a good player), Siggurdsson, Keane, Vlasic and Sandro (a dud no question).

Koeman got us Bolasie, Rooney (w/ BK), Klaassen, Martina, Schneiderlin.

Personally I think Walsh’s reputation has been damaged by Koeman although I much prefer Brands. Koeman’s signings are mixed at best.

As I posted earlier 100% of those I named were down to koeman and solely koeman

 

[dublinbluenose]

Walsh was DOF so had ultimate say over signings, he cant be absolved because some players are deemed to be Koeman signings. He was a rubbish DOF.

 

[Groucho]

This.

He didn't have the stature for what was required here. However, he needs to be disentangled from Koemageddon. As a scout he was generally spot on.

It's just laziness that has some people pointing at Walsh and leaving the real culprit one side. It also allows them to maximize Brands' effectiveness.

If Steve Walsh had been called Stefan Van Walsche a certan poster on here would have had the username of StefansGoat.

He was not a Dof. He’d have been better being head of scouting.

Brands is ace though for me.

 

[Goat]

This.

He didn't have the stature for what was required here. However, he needs to be disentangled from Koemageddon. As a scout he was generally spot on.

It's just laziness that has some people pointing at Walsh and leaving the real culprit one side. It also allows them to maximize Brands' effectiveness.

If Steve Walsh had been called Stefan Van Walsche a certan poster on here would have had the username of StefansGoat.

Steve Walsh, aided considerably by Ronald Koeman and Sam Allardyce wasted VAST sums of money on utter tosh.

They also bought some very good players.

Happy now?

Meanwhile, Marcel Brands, aided slightly by Marco Silva has only bought BALLERS.

8 more glorious days.