Current Affairs Shemima Begum

[NilSatisOptimum]

She’s a convenient scapegoat to appease the masses who want blood

Unpleasant little mindset.

 

[CharliePotato]

You are such a stupid man.

Why is he? His point is spot on.

 

[JLW]

She’s a convenient scapegoat to appease the masses who want blood

Scapegoat! She's being held responsible for her actions and intentions..
The only person who wanted blood was her, hence why she fled from the UK to Syria to join ISIS.

Yet the people who don't want her back to the country are the bad guys?

 

[CharliePotato]

100% right.

Would have been an outrage to let that scumbag in and a slap in the face of all those who died and where injusred at the Manchester area bombings and countless other attacks.

Let her rot.

 

[Kurt.]

Scapegoat! She's being held responsible for her actions and intentions..
The only person who wanted blood was her, hence why she fled from the UK to Syria to join ISIS.

Yet the people who don't want her back to the country are the bad guys?

Everyone’s focus is on her ... a convenient scapegoat for the government... nobody is asking about the hundreds of others who have done exactly as she had and are now back in the U.K.

 

[JimmyJeffers]

I knew I shouldn’t have looked in this thread

 

[JimmyJeffers]

Some severe erectile dysfunction in this thread

 

[JLW]

Everyone’s focus is on her ... a convenient scapegoat for the government... nobody is asking about the hundreds of others who have done exactly as she had and are now back in the U.K.

That doesn't make it right though.
Kurt you're making it sound like she's a victim, she knew exactly where she was going and why she was going there.

 

[Kurt.]

That doesn't make it right though.
Kurt you're making it sound like she's a victim, she knew exactly where she was going and why she was going there.

Mate if I had my way she’s be locked up forever.... but the government have got this wrong in my opinion. Like it or not she was born in the U.K. so should be subject to the same rights and protections as everybody else, by not doing so they are setting a dangerous precedent

 

[edge]

Last time I checked she was British, does she not get the chance to be listened to and her human rights protected ? I don’t like what she did as much as the next person but you can’t have rules that only apply when it suits your argument

Check again mate she isn't a British citizen any more, there are hundreds on that list not just her by the way

Wrong in my opinion. Nothing to do with the girl herself. She hasn't even shown any remorse for her actions and deserves no charity in my eyes. If we could I'd happily revoke the passports of any British person who goes off to join any terrorist organisation.

But this is a question of International law. It is illegal to leave an individual stateless and just because she has parents of Bangladeshi heritage doesn't change the fact she is British. If we're going to retain any semblance of credibility within the International community, and be in a position to criticise other nation states that do defy international Law, well we can't be law breakers ourselves. And by doing this we are leaving ourselves open to such accusations.

I also believe we could have a moral duty and responsibility here. If she is guilty of crimes she needs to be held responsible. That will not happen where she is now because there is no effective law in Syria.

I had a little look at the UN law this morning, as I like yourself thought it was just a UK law that came in 82 and amended in 91 and didn't really fit with in to my understanding of the understanding of stateless status (Which isn't much to be honest.)
When you look up the UN 1954 law covering this, and it's later add-on, it gives you a list of possible exclusions, there are not many but one of them is as a citizen she has to fall within the criteria of the home nation laws to qualify as a citizen, they can't stop it for political or race reasons for instance. But
She fell below the criteria expected of keeping her rights as a citizen the minute she left to join ISS under UK law that was in place, by the look of it.
The UN states she can also be made stateless for crimes against humanity and terrorism and as a self-confessed member /supporter of ISS she, it could be argued she falls under that banner as well.
Interesting subject really to pass a slow day at work, you can tell I have too much time on my hands.

 

[tsubaki]

That doesn't make it right though.
Kurt you're making it sound like she's a victim, she knew exactly where she was going and why she was going there.

She did, though obviously at this point it should be pointed out that she was a minor when that happened.

@Kurt. 's point is important though - to expand on it a bit, if Begum (and the others) had their citizenship stripped when they left, or when it was confirmed they were in IS territory supporting IS, or when the security services deemed them to be a threat then that would be one thing. Begum however never had her citizenship stripped until she'd left the collapsing IS state, turned up in a refugee camp with a child, gave an interview to one of the papers and caused embarassment to the government. It certainly very much appears as if they did it to prevent a fuss, not to protect the country.

I don't think anyone should have their citizenship stripped on that basis; as Kurt pointed out people who had done far worse but not caused a fuss didn't.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Some severe erectile dysfunction in this thread

No wonder I'm getting pop ups for Numan lol

 

[dead_soft]

The key to a great nation is one that protects its people and listens to its people.

1. She's a threat

2. The majority dont want her back

The opposite to a great nation I reckon is one ran by holier than thou elitists like yourself who'll happily put the lives of the every day Joe at risk by having people like this on our streets just so you can appear all uber liberal.

And as usual the out of touch upper middle class judges / parole boards / politicians don't have to worry about when these people have served their few years behind bars as they wont be rehomed/relocated to some middle class suburbs no they'll be relocated in a council estate to go and run down /ruin lives for the local working class plebs who supposedly these liberals "care" about..

She’s a working class Brit who was educated and groomed here so what you actually mean is you want a country that listens to those you deem the right citizens.
Not sure it’s elitism to want the country to afford due process to its own citizens.

You have gone off on a tangent that doesn’t really relate to whether it’s right or not.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Check again mate she isn't a British citizen any more, there are hundreds on that list not just her by the way

I had a little look at the UN law this morning, as I like yourself thought it was just a UK law that came in 82 and amended in 91 and didn't really fit with in to my understanding of the understanding of stateless status (Which isn't much to be honest.)
When you look up the UN 1954 law covering this, and it's later add-on, it gives you a list of possible exclusions, there are not many but one of them is as a citizen she has to fall within the criteria of the home nation laws to qualify as a citizen, they can't stop it for political or race reasons for instance. But
She fell below the criteria expected of keeping her rights as a citizen the minute she left to join ISS under UK law that was in place, by the look of it.
The UN states she can also be made stateless for crimes against humanity and terrorism and as a self-confessed member /supporter of ISS she, it could be argued she falls under that banner as well.
Interesting subject really to pass a slow day at work, you can tell I have too much time on my hands.

I'm no expert as you would imagine. When this first came about a couple of years ago I saw, not just one but a number of articles, where it mentioned that under International Law a nation was not allowed to removed somebodies citizenship if it rendered them stateless. I took those reports at face value.

 

[JimmyJeffers]

Mate if I had my way she’s be locked up forever.... but the government have got this wrong in my opinion. Like it or not she was born in the U.K. so should be subject to the same rights and protections as everybody else, by not doing so they are setting a dangerous precedent

It’s populist politics to appeal to the Facebook militia