Current Affairs London Protests

[tsubaki]

Well if you read the whole post the point is that POC experience institutionalised, and systemic racism. You do not get people in the UK missing out on jobs, being repeatedly stopped and searched because they are white. Further to this studies have shown police are 60+% more likely to use stronger force against people from a BAME background.

Precisely how are POC racist towards whites? Do you really think calling someone “white boy” or the like is akin to calling someone the “n” word?

Even further than that, let’s hypothetically say that POC were able to systemically and institutionally discriminate against white people in certain areas, would that mean two wrongs make a right? Or that we should invalidate all of the injustice they suffer?

TBF this is a good example of a post that justifies itself without being actually correct.

You are right that there isn’t that much evidence to say that white people are denied jobs based on their race in the UK. There is however absolutely loads of evidence to say that they are denied jobs based on class / economic status - so they *are* discriminated against. When you also look at police use of force (to use another of your examples) against working class whites the disparity reduces a lot as well.

In short yes, we should absolutely recognise racist behaviour, policies and beliefs, should call them out and deal with them to make a fairer society. We shouldn’t assume that is all that’s required though, in fact a lot of the things affecting black and other minority groups in the UK (ie: not being of the dominant class) are shared with most of the rest of us (a point Steve McQueen made over the weekend when talking about lack of BAME crew in his industry).

 

[zzr45]

Precisely how are POC racist towards whites? Do you really think calling someone “white boy” or the like is akin to calling someone the “n” word?

How are whites that aren't part of institutions racist towards POC? Why should anyone have to tolerate any discrimination based on the colour of their skin? If 'white boy' is used in a pejorative sense then it's completely akin to use of the n word, or if someone was referred to as black boy.

For someone that was just crying about context, you don't quite seem to grasp it.

 

[ChesterBlue]

TBF this is a good example of a post that justifies itself without being actually correct.

You are right that there isn’t that much evidence to say that white people are denied jobs based on their race in the UK. There is however absolutely loads of evidence to say that they are denied jobs based on class / economic status - so they *are* discriminated against. When you also look at police use of force (to use another of your examples) against working class whites the disparity reduces a lot as well.

In short yes, we should absolutely recognise racist behaviour, policies and beliefs, should call them out and deal with them to make a fairer society. We shouldn’t assume that is all that’s required though, in fact a lot of the things affecting black and other minority groups in the UK (ie: not being of the dominant class) are shared with most of the rest of us (a point Steve McQueen made over the weekend when talking about lack of BAME crew in his industry).

I think you’ve missed the point. Class issues also impact on POC, the difference is white people will not be specifically discriminated against due to their race, while being a POC will not exempt someone from being discriminated against due to their class / economic situation. If you don’t believe what I said is correct then please provide evidence to the contrary. Numerous studies have found the treatment of working class POC by the police to be harsher than against working class white people. Similarly if you don’t believe that the UK is institutionally racist why do ethnic minorities make up 14% of the British population, but 25% of prison populations? Why did the windrush scandal happen?

 

[ChesterBlue]

How are whites that aren't part of institutions racist towards POC? Why should anyone have to tolerate any discrimination based on the colour of their skin? If 'white boy' is used in a pejorative sense then it's completely akin to use of the n word, or if someone was referred to as black boy.

For someone that was just crying about context, you don't quite seem to grasp it.

I don’t remember black people enslaving massive amounts of white people, and using “White Boy” as a pejorative term to keep us dehumanised and oppressed. Which is where your argument here falls down completely. That, is why context is important.

 

[mill]

How are whites that aren't part of institutions racist towards POC? Why should anyone have to tolerate any discrimination based on the colour of their skin? If 'white boy' is used in a pejorative sense then it's completely akin to use of the n word, or if someone was referred to as black boy.

For someone that was just crying about context, you don't quite seem to grasp it.

Can we please just get something straight as I’ve seen people make this point over and over.

institutional racism is not ‘people who work in institutions are racist’.

That is not what the term is. It’s about power structures and processes favouring one race over others.

it is not individual racism within an institution.

I think people are failing to grasp that idea.

the electoral college in the US is a neat example of institutional racism. It doesn’t mean the delegates themselves are racist. It means the structure and process favours one set of people over others.

 

[ChesterBlue]

How are whites that aren't part of institutions racist towards POC? Why should anyone have to tolerate any discrimination based on the colour of their skin? If 'white boy' is used in a pejorative sense then it's completely akin to use of the n word, or if someone was referred to as black boy.

For someone that was just crying about context, you don't quite seem to grasp it.

I don’t remember black people enslaving massive amounts of white people, and using “White Boy” as a pejorative term to keep us dehumanised and oppressed. Which is where your argument here falls down completely. That, is why context is important.

Further to this, do you seriously believe casual racism isn’t a thing? That people don’t refer to certain takeaways, and shops as racial slurs? That certain preconceptions are made of people down to skin colour?

 

[Papa Shango]

Further to this, do you seriously believe casual racism isn’t a thing? That people don’t refer to certain takeaways, and shops as racial slurs? That certain preconceptions are made of people down to skin colour?

I think casual racism is more of a problem than the full fledged stuff. At least with a full on racist bigot you know what you are dealing with and can act accordingly.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

I don’t remember black people enslaving massive amounts of white people, and using “White Boy” as a pejorative term to keep us dehumanised and oppressed. Which is where your argument here falls down completely. That, is why context is important.

Tbf and for balance, slavery was an African practice when the Europeans arrived. Tribalism saw conquered tribes enslaved. So not enslaving white people but most certainly enslaving Africans and eventually selling them to white traders.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

Cant wait for the pubs to open.

Give folk something to do

Country has gone insane

 

[ChesterBlue]

I think casual racism is more of a problem than the full fledged stuff. At least with a full on racist bigot you know what you are dealing with and can act accordingly.

Precisely, for example I remember going for a drink with my exes brother (who was black) and a group of lads chatting to us, shaking my hand, but trying to hi-five him. Seems something really small, but you start to pick up on a lot of that kind of small thing, and it starts to make the person receiving it very uncomfortable

 

[ChesterBlue]

Cant wait for the pubs to open.

Give folk something to do

Country has gone insane

I’m with you on that. At least Everton are back to get me away from these threads lol

 

[tsubaki]

I think you’ve missed the point. Class issues also impact on POC, the difference is white people will not be specifically discriminated against due to their race, while being a POC will not exempt someone from being discriminated against due to their class / economic situation. If you don’t believe what I said is correct then please provide evidence to the contrary. Numerous studies have found the treatment of working class POC by the police to be harsher than against working class white people. Similarly if you don’t believe that the UK is institutionally racist why do ethnic minorities make up 14% of the British population, but 25% of prison populations? Why did the windrush scandal happen?

It’s not really missing the point - people will still be being discriminated against even if we get rid of racism (which we absolutely need to). In fact you might find that (class) is where the majority of discrimination people suffer stems from.

The Windrush Scandal absolutely impacted mainly on people of colour, but in terms of what it actually was (government making arbitrary and unfair decisions that impacted on people needlessly) it actually has a lot of similarities with many other scandals down the years that they’ve overseen - blood transfusions, CJD, the Post Office managers getting convicted of theft because of computer errors thing, football stadiums being deathtraps, thalidomide, Aberfan etc and now the response to this pandemic.

 

[catcherintherye]

Sam Kriss is back and jumping on an opportunity again I see.

What is Sam up to?

 

[coollino]

What is Sam up to?

A new blog post and seemingly trying to reinvent himself again.

White skin, black squares

Can I purify my soul in the smelter of a burning police precinct?

samkriss.com

 

[tsubaki]

Tbf and for balance, slavery was an African practice when the Europeans arrived. Tribalism saw conquered tribes enslaved. So not enslaving white people but most certainly enslaving Africans and eventually selling them to white traders.

It was not; as said before slavery of one sort or another has existed everywhere for as long as recorded history goes back.

Slavery as the Europeans practiced it after 1520 or so (ie: importing people to a new continent to use them for agricultural labour and keeping them as a permanent underclass) however was something developed by the Europeans themselves; the local Africans did not do that.