Current Affairs Labour and Anti Semitism.......

[NilSatisOptimum]

That's the problem - he isn't.

Plenty search news will show otherwise and from wide sources, some with agenda that current Israel government is the victim and Corbyn as the aggressor. That for me underlines the entire antisemitism row with labour, it's done to try and silence the critique of current Israeli Government with the caveat at times,, as a tool to brow beat Corbyn.


https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/blog/an-appeal-to-all-labour-mps/

 

[Tubey]

Plenty search news will show otherwise and from wide sources, some with agenda that current Israel government is the victim and Corbyn as the aggressor. That for me underlines the entire antisemitism row with labour, it's done to try and silence the critique of current Israeli Government with the caveat at times,, as a tool to brow beat Corbyn.


https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/blog/an-appeal-to-all-labour-mps/

Nah, you don't get what I mean - Corbyn himself is anti-Israel, but he hasn't reconciled that with the official stance of the Labour Party.

So he's in a no man's land of being personally anti-Israel but professionally not able to clarify his stance for all to see, hence why all this is happening as there's confusion over what Labour say and what Labour do.

Of course, this seems a very difficult concept for Corbyn fans to grasp and they prefer the "it's a conspiraceeee" line instead.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Nah, you don't get what I mean - Corbyn himself is anti-Israel, but he hasn't reconciled that with the official stance of the Labour Party.

So he's in a no man's land of being personally anti-Israel but professionally not able to clarify his stance for all to see, hence why all this is happening as there's confusion over what Labour say and what Labour do.

Of course, this seems a very difficult concept for Corbyn fans to grasp and they prefer the "it's a conspiraceeee" line instead.

No conspiracy just the poorly informed spouting off and opponent's taking cheap shots and hiding behind antisemitism. Which is a shame because the latter in my opinion lessons seriousness of Antisemitism.
Besides Corbyn supports Two state solution, indeed he is anti ultra nationalist Israel Government, who would not be? So not sure where your coming from, poorly informed or opponent?

 

[Connor]

https://www.opendemocracy.net/uk/sh...these-disgraceful-slurs-against-jeremy-corbyn

Enough of these disgraceful slurs against Jeremy Corbyn
Even the author of the IHRA definition of anti-semitism has spoken against it.

Author of the IHRA definition says Corbyn isn't an anti-semite yet Pete on the internet argues differently.

Hmm.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Also the commons house select committee on home affairs must be antiemitic, it's also included caveats to IHRA definition.

"It is not antisemitic to criticise the Government of Israel, without additional evidence to suggest antisemitic intent.
It is not antisemitic to hold the Israeli Government to the same standards as other liberal democracies, or to take a particular interest in the Israeli Government’s policies or actions, without additional evidence to suggest antisemitic intent."

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617/cmselect/cmhaff/136/13605.htm#_idTextAnchor014

 

[Tubey]

From the co-ordinated Jewish newspaper stance today:

Labour has diluted the IHRA definition, accepted in full by the government and more than 130 local councils, deleting and amending four key examples of anti-Semitism relating to Israel.

Under its adapted guidelines, a Labour Party member is free to claim Israel's existence is a racist endeavour and compare Israeli policies to those of Nazi Germany, unless "intent" - whatever that means - can be proved. 'Dirty Jew' is wrong, 'Zionist bitch' fair game?

In so doing, Labour makes a distinction between racial anti-Semitism targeting Jews (unacceptable) and political anti-Semitism targeting Israel (acceptable).

The reason for this move? Had the full IHRA definition with examples relating to Israel been approved, hundreds, if not thousands, of Labour and Momentum members would need to be expelled.


^^

That absolutely nails it.

Being anti-Israel isn't automatically being an anti-semite of course, and even I personally think the definition needs amending in light of the apartheid actions of Netanyahu and co. lately. But you have to do it in a smart way - you can't just take things out of the definition that allows people to use Israel as an excuse to be anti-semitic.

It's the easiest excuse in the book now - be anti-semitic, spout vile abuse and then just claim you were anti-Israel and not anti-semitic to get away with it.

That's why Labour currently has this massive problem, because the truth is that Corbyn and his fans require those clauses to be removed because they are staunchly anti-Israel, and instead of doing it coherently and coming out to say that the party is now anti-Israel, they've tried to do it on the sly and have been called out on it.

Corbyn is 100% at fault on this one and its' madness to claim otherwise.

 

[RobC]

Corbyn has loads of Muslim supporters, has been a campaigner for Palestine for yonks and Momentum is full of the same sort, what did people really expect ? He is portrayed as a man of principle so why not adopt the IHRA definition ? Probably because they would be up to their ears in disciplinary cases if the IHRA definition was used.

 

[Number_25]

From the co-ordinated Jewish newspaper stance today:

Labour has diluted the IHRA definition, accepted in full by the government and more than 130 local councils, deleting and amending four key examples of anti-Semitism relating to Israel.

Under its adapted guidelines, a Labour Party member is free to claim Israel's existence is a racist endeavour and compare Israeli policies to those of Nazi Germany, unless "intent" - whatever that means - can be proved. 'Dirty Jew' is wrong, 'Zionist bitch' fair game?

In so doing, Labour makes a distinction between racial anti-Semitism targeting Jews (unacceptable) and political anti-Semitism targeting Israel (acceptable).

The reason for this move? Had the full IHRA definition with examples relating to Israel been approved, hundreds, if not thousands, of Labour and Momentum members would need to be expelled.


^^

That absolutely nails it.

Being anti-Israel isn't automatically being an anti-semite of course, and even I personally think the definition needs amending in light of the apartheid actions of Netanyahu and co. lately. But you have to do it in a smart way - you can't just take things out of the definition that allows people to use Israel as an excuse to be anti-semitic.

It's the easiest excuse in the book now - be anti-semitic, spout vile abuse and then just claim you were anti-Israel and not anti-semitic to get away with it.

That's why Labour currently has this massive problem, because the truth is that Corbyn and his fans require those clauses to be removed because they are staunchly anti-Israel, and instead of doing it coherently and coming out to say that the party is now anti-Israel, they've tried to do it on the sly and have been called out on it.

Corbyn is 100% at fault on this one and its' madness to claim otherwise.

Was standing up to apartheid South Africa anti-South African?

Give me one example of anti-Semitism that isn't covered by Labour's implementation of the IHRA definition. Go on.

 

[Number_25]

Corbyn has loads of Muslim supporters, has been a campaigner for Palestine for yonks and Momentum is full of the same sort, what did people really expect ? He is portrayed as a man of principle so why not adopt the IHRA definition ? Probably because they would be up to their ears in disciplinary cases if the IHRA definition was used.

What the [Poor language removed] does being a Muslim have to do with anything?

 

[RobC]

What the [Poor language removed] does being a Muslim have to do with anything?

I worked in IT for over 30 years and the ones I have worked with had no time for Jews/Israel and did not mind telling you.

 

[Number_25]

I worked in IT for over 30 years and the ones I have worked with had no time for Jews/Israel and did not mind telling you.

This conflation between Jews and the state of Israel has to stop, it's extremely dangerous and leads into exactly this sort of mentality. I lived in the KSA and saw how damaging that conflation is.

Personally speaking, I don't believe that the two-state solution is at all workable and would like to see more of an effort to work toward the formation of a single Israeli-Palestinian state in which people from all creed can live together ~ but that is not the view of Jeremy Corbyn.

I know this for a fact because I've spoken to him directly about it on several occasions.

Now, give me one example of anti-Semitism that Labour's implementation of the IHRA definition allows for.

 

[RobC]

This conflation between Jews and the state of Israel has to stop, it's extremely dangerous and leads into exactly this sort of mentality. I lived in the KSA and saw how damaging that conflation is.

Personally speaking, I don't believe that the two-state solution is at all workable and would like to see more of an effort to work toward the formation of a single Israeli-Palestinian state in which people from all creed can live together ~ but that is not the view of Jeremy Corbyn.

I know this for a fact because I've spoken to him directly about it on several occasions.

Now, give me one example of anti-Semitism that Labour's implementation of the IHRA definition allows for.

There have been loads in the press so do you own googling.

 

[Number_25]

There have been loads in the press so do you own googling.

I'm asking for you to detail some.

 

[RobC]

I cant be arsed, is that OK with you ?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Politics can be a hot enough topic as it is, but religion and politics is especially sensitive. Can I remind everyone just to keep things cool and to be respectful of other people who are ultimately Evertonians as well.

As a warning, I learned how to use the threadban feature on this new software this morning so I'm tempted to use it. On the off chance this might take down the entire site, please don't make me