Current Affairs How old were you when you grew up and stopped voting Labour?

When did you join the real world?

  • Younger than 20

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • 20-25

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • 25-30

    Votes: 6 40.0%
  • 30-35

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 35-40

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • 40+

    Votes: 2 13.3%

  • Total voters
    15
  • Poll closed .
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What's exclusive about the word treachery? I'm puzzled.

It just seems a very melodramatic word, and indeed a melodramatic action, especially by a leader who has spent his entire political career dissenting within his own party. Given how many times he has gone against the party whip (428 times wasn't it?), you'd imagine his 'treachery' would have seen him booted out long ago if the same principles applied.
 
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He's restated that anti-semitism is something alien to the LP, and that he wont tolerate anyone associating themselves with Labour conflating their (rightful) opposition to the racist Israeli state with abuse of someone's ethnicity or religious practice.

The BBC and the rest of the boxed off media are determined to use the non-issue to assist the neo-liberal right in the LP who still want to unseat him...after two leadership elections. That's where the bias.

As said. it wont be long before the Umunnas and Benns and Nandys and all the other centre-right failures will be fronting their own new political party and merging it with the other pathetic political force of the centre ground, the Lib-Dems. An SDP MkII is on its way as sure as eggs are eggs. Cant wait.

Wouldn't you be better off staking your ground here Dave? http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/

They follow your philosophy more closely than the Labour party do, being anti-globalisation, anti-EU and so on.
 
“Jeremy Corbyn has apologised for the pain caused by anti-Semitism in 'pockets' of his party.

Mr Corbyn was criticised by several leading Labour MPs after he defended a controversial mural and his party has been gripped by accusations of anti-Semitism since he became leader.

He has now said that he is 'sincerely sorry for the pain which has been caused' by anti-Semitism which occurred in 'pockets within the Labour Party'.”


In other news.....

Adolf Hitler has apologised for the pain caused by anti-Semitism in 'pockets' of his party.

Mr Hitler was criticised by several leading politicians after he defended a controversial concentration camp and his party has been gripped by accusations of anti-Semitism since he became leader.

He has now said that he is 'sincerely sorry for the pain which has been caused' by anti-Semitism which occurred in 'pockets within the Nazi Party'.


So that’s ok then.........
comparing corbyn with hitler and the labour party with the nazi party, thats a low blow even for a right wing tory.
 
He's restated that anti-semitism is something alien to the LP, and that he wont tolerate anyone associating themselves with Labour conflating their (rightful) opposition to the racist Israeli state with abuse of someone's ethnicity or religious practice.

The BBC and the rest of the boxed off media are determined to use the non-issue to assist the neo-liberal right in the LP who still want to unseat him...after two leadership elections. That's where the bias.

As said. it wont be long before the Umunnas and Benns and Nandys and all the other centre-right failures will be fronting their own new political party and merging it with the other pathetic political force of the centre ground, the Lib-Dems. An SDP MkII is on its way as sure as eggs are eggs. Cant wait.

I think you may be right about an SDP Mk2. The extremes within Labour now seem to be too extreme to accommodate within a single party. However I don’t really see any political heavyweights within the right of the party who would have the charisma to lead it. For many of these people it’s just a well paid job and a stepping stone to further well paid jobs......
 
It’s like reading something from the 60’s.......

As an aside Pete, I was doing some research today and was reading this on the general divide between parts of the UK - http://www.centreforcities.org/reader/cities-outlook-2018/future-work-cities/

They make three recommendations (below):

This should take three main approaches:
Prepare:

Give younger generations entering the labour market the right set of skills and knowledge to succeed in the jobs of the future.

The basis for the estimation for which occupations will become more or less important is founded on the expectation that interpersonal skills, cognitive skills (such as originality and fluency of ideas) and judgment and decision making will become ever more important. This will require teaching both in schools and at further education colleges to adjust to help their students develop such skills.

A major related concern is that schools in a number of areas are failing to provide quality education based on today’s curriculum, even before further improvements to what is taught are considered. Weaker economies such as Hull and Middlesbrough have very few schools deemed as high performing according to the Education Policy Institute,9 meaning pupils in these places face the dual challenge of not being given the core skills required to get a high-skilled job as they enter a labour market where higher-skilled opportunities are limited.

Adjust:
The current workforce should be given adequate resources to adjust to changes in the labour market.

People currently in the labour market need to be able to adapt as the demand for skills changes. This will require continuous training and upskilling.

The unveiling of the National Retraining Scheme in the most recent Industrial Strategy suggests a move in this direction. At this stage the policy applies only to digital and construction jobs, but as such a scheme is rolled out there should be a shift towards developing the idea of lifelong learning. One way to do this would be to allocate each worker a number of hours a year to devote to training, to encourage workers to further their skillset in light of an ever changing labour market. This would require greater funding of the further education sector.

Compensate:
Individuals least able to adapt need to be given adequate compensation for their job loss but should also be given retraining.

As part of any wave of change, not everyone will be better off, at least in the short-term. This means that there will still be a requirement to provide a safety net for people if their job disappears.

But this should be done in conjunction with improved access to and requirement for training, to give individuals the ability to continue to work, as well as helping to shift the skills base of a city to improve its chances of attracting in higher-skilled business investment. Cities and the national government must ensure people who are worse off as a result of future job losses receive adequate support. But unlike the past, this support cannot only come in the form of welfare payments.

Interestingly, none of them required us to leave the EU.
 
It’s not going away is it.......

Here is the full text of the open letter to the Labour Party by the Board of Deputies of British Jews and the Jewish Leadership Council.

“Today, leaders of British Jewry tell Jeremy Corbyn that enough is enough. We have had enough of hearing that Jeremy Corbyn "opposes anti-Semitism", whilst the mainstream majority of British Jews, and their concerns, are ignored by him and those he leads.

There is a repeated institutional failure to properly address Jewish concerns and to tackle anti-Semitism, with the Chakrabarti Report being the most glaring example of this.

Jeremy Corbyn did not invent this form of politics, but he has had a lifetime within it, and now personifies its problems and dangers. He issues empty statements about opposing anti-Semitism, but does nothing to understand or address it. We conclude that he cannot seriously contemplate anti-Semitism, because he is so ideologically fixed within a far left worldview that is instinctively hostile to mainstream Jewish communities.

When Jews complain about an obviously anti-Semitic mural in Tower Hamlets, Corbyn of course supports the artist. Hizbollah commits terrorist atrocities against Jews, but Corbyn calls them his friends and attends pro-Hizbollah rallies in London. Exactly the same goes for Hamas. Raed Salah says Jews kill Christian children to drink their blood. Corbyn opposes his extradition and invites him for tea at the House of Commons. These are not the only cases. He is repeatedly found alongside people with blatantly anti-Semitic views, but claims never to hear or read them.

Again and again, Jeremy Corbyn has sided with anti-Semites rather than Jews. At best, this derives from the far left's obsessive hatred of Zionism, Zionists and Israel. At worst, it suggests a conspiratorial worldview in which mainstream Jewish communities are believed to be a hostile entity, a class enemy.

When Jeremy Corbyn was elected leader of the Labour Party, Jews expressed sincere and profound fears as to how such politics would impact upon their wellbeing. Our concerns were never taken seriously. Three years on, the party and British Jews are reaping the consequences.

Routine statements against anti-Semitism "and all forms of racism" get nowhere near dealing with the problem, because what distinguishes anti-Semitism from other forms of racism is the power that Jews are alleged to hold, and how they are charged with conspiring together against what is good.

This is not only historic, or about what Jeremy Corbyn did before being party leader. It is also utterly contemporary. There is literally not a single day in which Labour Party spaces, either online or in meetings, do not repeat the same fundamental anti-Semitic slanders against Jews. We are told that our concerns are faked, and done at the command of Israel and/or Zionism (whatever that means); that anti-Semitism is merely "criticism of Israel"; that we call any and all criticism of Israel "anti-Semitic"; that the Rothschilds run the world; that Isis terrorism is a fake front for Israel; that Zionists are the new Nazis; and that Zionists collaborate with Nazis.

Rightly or wrongly, Jeremy Corbyn is now the figurehead for an anti-Semitic political culture, based on obsessive hatred of Israel, conspiracy theories and fake news that is doing dreadful harm to British Jews and to the British Labour Party.

Jeremy Corbyn is the only person with the power to demand that it stops. Enough is enough.”
 
That's kind of the point. The EU is largely irrelevant to the challenges faced by people in these towns. They've been sold the myth that they are by politicians who would rather you pin the blame on others than look at their own failings.

Indeed, and as I’ve said many times before, leaving the EU means they have no one else to blame and fewer excuses.......

Meanwhile the rest of that article still underplays AI in terms of jobs affected I believe, but we have a separate thread for this........
 
Indeed, and as I’ve said many times before, leaving the EU means they have no one else to blame and fewer excuses.......

Meanwhile the rest of that article still underplays AI in terms of jobs affected I believe, but we have a separate thread for this........

On the first point, leaving something that is beneficial to many so that people you want to return power to can be accountable for the power they already had seems like throwing the baby out with the bath water.

On the second, there is tremendous variance on how technology might affect jobs, but where there is almost universal consensus is that it will affect routine jobs more than complex jobs. That's no different to pretty much any technology ever invented. In that sense there is no real difference between globalisation and technology in that you have a situation whereby A Third Party (whether people overseas or a new technology) can do your job better than you can. The challenge is how you can adapt, and the government has all the power it needs to help people to adapt.
 
It just seems a very melodramatic word, and indeed a melodramatic action, especially by a leader who has spent his entire political career dissenting within his own party. Given how many times he has gone against the party whip (428 times wasn't it?), you'd imagine his 'treachery' would have seen him booted out long ago if the same principles applied.
He was disciplined for it. That's the way it works. Anyone who speaks out for their principles accepts those consequences. I really cant see the validity of that oft stated "contradiction", there isn't one there. And now, in turn, those standing up for their Blairite principles in the LP and who cross swords and flout adopted policy need to take their medicine in the same way that Corbyn had to....or leave. Their choice.
 
Wouldn't you be better off staking your ground here Dave? http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/

They follow your philosophy more closely than the Labour party do, being anti-globalisation, anti-EU and so on.
No, I'm a democratic socialist. I dont believe in vanguardism. The LP is a social democratic party and the Corbyn leadership and Momentum are bringing that party back to its roots. If the neo-liberals who infiltrated the party in the 90s to make it just another creature of the market feel like they're now marginalised they should do what Jenkins, Williams, Rodgers and Owen had the courage to do in the 80s and get out and form their own centre ground party.

I cant see the objection to the reinvigorated LP under Corbyn's leadership: after all, wasn't the long held gripe that "politicians and political parties are all the same now and there's no choice"?

Well there is one now...and the replacement of (and exodus of) Blairites that will hopefully continue apace will make that choice all the more substantial.

All power to our more varied political spectrum I say.
 
I think you may be right about an SDP Mk2. The extremes within Labour now seem to be too extreme to accommodate within a single party. However I don’t really see any political heavyweights within the right of the party who would have the charisma to lead it. For many of these people it’s just a well paid job and a stepping stone to further well paid jobs......

I completely agree...which is why expulsion or deselection might have to be used.
 
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