Healthcare

[Tennessee Blue Mike]

I am witnessing the decline of a great nation by bumbling idiots in the senate and congress with a open checkbook with no budget to tie them to. Government isn't the answer it's the problem. "We the people" were did that go. National this national that what a great shame. National healthcare will bankrupt this nation along with Al Gore's Global warming cap and trade what a joke.

Obama, Bernanke & Geithner are shaping this nation to Hyperinflation count on it. Read about Weimer Germany and the cause and effect of running the printing presses on overdrive.

 

[TX Tiburon]

My significant other is a trauma nurse and we've had this discussion more than I care to count but we've both come to the agreement that if anyone is going to fix what needs to be fixed, it won't be the government...of any country, on any planet.

Government is politics and politics belong nowhere near a hospital bed.

Wise and succinct.

 

[Tennessee Blue Mike]

Wise and succinct.

Very wise.

 

[Dylan]

Whether the care is paid for by the public or private insurance is not relevant. The question is.... will it cost less if government takes control. Personally, I don't see how it can.

Time and again, the government has proven itself to be terribly inefficient and wasteful. It may seem that healthcare will cost less when the government pays but taxes will have to increase to pay for it. So, in effect, we will be paying higher taxes to “free” healthcare. Back to square one at best, if the government can run as efficiently as private insurance. One could buy their own private insurance with the tax savings.

Some say that the government will drive down the cost of healthcare. But that is not their track record. Government is exceptional at spending other peoples’ money, but not at saving it. Medicare and Medicaid are both programs going broke yet we are now launching ourselves headlong toward another government run program. Shouldn’t we demand that our representative fix the current government health problems (as well as Social Security) before taking on such a complex and crucial issue? I say prove you can fix the smaller issues before creating bigger ones. How can we have confidence that Washington has the answer to this one but can't fix smaller, less complex issues?

Let me ask you a question. Where are these tax increases coming from? I know the answer, but I want to know if you do before I launch headlong into a proper reply.

 

[TX Tiburon]

Technically, tax increase come from politician. It's just that "we the people" foot the bill. But since that response is so simplistic I will brace myself for your response.

I suppose that there are two alternative to raising taxes:
1. increase the debt - but I don't see how we can continue to spend the money of future generations.
2. reduce expenses - (see the last paragraph in my original diatribe)

Theoretically, government could provide the same service as the private sector for the same price but I just don't like Washington's track record.

Alright Dylan, set me straight.

 

[Dylan]

No, I meant where the tax increase is. What is the proposed tax increase.

 

[Hayee]

NHS NHS NHS

 

[Tennessee Blue Mike]

The tax increase will be very suttle and mainly unnoticed by the masses for a while it will simply be the total erosion of the greenback. The dollar will keep falling causing commidities such as oil, gold, copper,etc. to skyrocket like they have been doing the past twelve months. Inflation tiger will strip the middle class of their wealth while giving the government more power over employment and managing key industries. We are basically a socialist nation when national healthcare takes root.

 

[TX Tiburon]

Well... the tax increase comes in covering an estimated 30 million extra people with some additional healthcare that don't currently have today. The healthcare system will be expected to swallow that much additional demand without additional physicians, supplies, hospital beds, etc. Part of the proposal is to severely cap reimbursement to physicians.

Additional demand for the same amount of supply equals higher prices. Fundamental economics. The very physicians that will be understaffed for the new demand will be asked to see more patients but be paid less per patient. This will disincent potential, future physicians from seeking medical degrees. Increased demand without increased supply can only put pressure on prices to rise. It's like a force of nature.

Now our fearless leaders won't suggest that their proposal leads to higher costs. That would not serve their self-aggrandizing purposes. The plan is to allow us to pay for 3-4 years before the healthcare benefits kicks in. Then they measure 10 years of tax income versus 6 years of expense and claim that the 10 year analysis shows that the proposal pays for itself.

Problem 1 - if the proposal really paid for itself, then why do we have to pay 3-4 years before the benefits kick in. Why not wait on collecting payments until the benefits begin. Answer - because the incoming funds don't really offset the expenses on a one-to-one basis.

Problem 2 - very rarely, if ever, do government estimates of expense fit with future reality. Expense growth is typically underestimate. Medicare estimates where missed by a mile.

So that's my 2-cents. But we can all have our opinions.

 

[shketo]

NHS NHS NHS

Too bloody true. Long live the NHS!

I was under the impression that healthcare reform in the USA had bugger all to do with the health of the american people. American motor manufacturers found unit costs were higher in the USA than their other plants over the border in Canada. The reason was that the workforce was healthier because of universal healthcare. I think the Americans call that a "no-brainer". People need to be fit if you are going to work the bejaysus out of them in the pursuit of profit and the American Dream. Thats what I heard anyway.

I do find some of the objections to Obama's reform bewildering. Screaming about socialism while the government gives billions to banks and has bottomless pockets when spending on defence. Huh?