Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
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Bruce Wayne said:
I was thinking a bit about culture today (as you do), and the notion of national identity. Mathematically, if you have just 20 variables, whether that's shaking hands vs bowing or taking shoes off when you go into a house vs not, with those 20 simple variables alone you get over 1 million possible combinations.

That's not to say that national cultures don't exist, but when these have been studied there has been an awful lot of heterogeneity (or variety if you prefer). So when we say Britain is one way, America another and China a third, whilst they may be broadly right, in reality there is a pretty wide spread within any one country, and therefore a lot of overlap between countries that on average may be far apart.

What makes all of this interesting is that guys like Geert Hofstede have studied this not only in countries but in companies too. He found that there is usually significant homogeneity within companies, or in other words, we choose to work with those that are like us, and this similarity was greater than any similarities based on nationality.

All of which begs the question, for me at least, if we choose like-minded cultures with regards to employment, is it
not at least possible that migrants choosing to move to Britain are choosing along similar lines, and that whilst their native lands are on average different culturally, those that choose to move here are more aligned than we think.

I also thought a bit about the notion of sovereignty and law making. I was thinking of a couple of things that in Europe there has been convergence around a standard, namely the side of the road we drive on, and the type of plug we use. Relatively simple things.

The driving is a fairly obvious one in that there are clear road borders between the countries of Europe, so you can't drive on the left in country A and then as you cross over a border into country B you switch lanes. It'd be chaos. Sweden accepted this in the 60s and with more travel between countries, they converged on the standard in Europe of driving on the right.

The only reason we have maintained our driving on the left is because we're an island and therefore our border is not one that's crossed directly by car. I'm fairly sure that train tracks would have to be standardised however for the Eurostar to run correctly.

Now, the way some people talk, you'd think Sweden had given up some of their sovereign powers to make their own rules, or they were forgoing some of their culture to cowtow to European hegemony, but the reality is it's simply common sense to do this, not only for end users but also for manufacturers who no longer have to make cars for left and right sided steering wheels, or electrical devices with multiple different plugs.

I suspect the vast majority of the so called loss to our sovereignty is of a similar nature, but of course as so few appear able to name the laws that we'll be regaining control over it really is difficult to say.
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That will stop when we blow the channel tunnel up Bruce{joke}lol
you seem very motivated on car journeys today Bruce?
 
Pienaar's gloves said:
@Joey66 An independent assessment of political parties immediately prior to the last election.

uk2015.png


Tories in the centre?
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Well, if that's correct - look at where the 'centre' is if labour are meant to be representative of the 'left'.
 
Pienaar's gloves said:
Not sure of your point.

Labour have since been take over by a socialist leader.

The Tories have a continuity candidate.
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How about the majority of labour party telling us to stay in the EU - along with the tories, etc?

People got fed up of being told what's good for them by people with few differences in policy. Self-serving politicians were as much a factor in people sticking two fingers up at the establishment as other factors like immigration, poltical union, etc.

How do you think Trump's got as far as he has?

And by the way, Corbyn was Labour party leader when the vote was taken...
 
Quite an interesting article thanks.
This quote fairly describes one of my issues/inherent contradictions abounding, which doesn't just apply to the House, it's more systemic:

The point was well made by Stephen Phillips, a pro-leave Conservative MP:

“I and many others did not exercise our vote in the referendum so as to restore the sovereignty of this parliament only to see what we regarded as the tyranny of the European Union replaced by that of a government that apparently wishes to ignore the views of the house on the most important issue facing the nation.”



The Esk said:
I find myself in the unusual position of agreeing with Matthew Scott of The Telegraph. He focuses on 'Conservatives' but much of what he says applies to a wider audience.

It's lengthy but well worth the read:

Why all Conservatives should want Parliament to have the final say on Article 50

The legal battle over whether Article 50 should be triggered by the Prime Minister wielding the Royal Prerogative (as the Government wants) or by an Act of Parliament (as the Remainer litigants contend is necessary) is proving to be a much tougher fight than many had predicted.
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