World war three has not broke out only on this thread
Current Affairs EU In or Out
- Thread starter micknick
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Toffeelover
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Well its forecast by the Remainers you knowlol
About to see a recession, cheers Brexiteers.
I'm sorry that you are uncomfortable with it, and it is no way meant to be insulting to you or anyone else.
1. Sorry about your great empire.
2. We helped end the war saving millions of European lives. Don't be ungrateful. Again, from my view a united Europe is much better than a divided Europe.
3. It probably will...but there will be a recession. I doubt very much an economy collapsing type one. If it gets bad, we would step in and assist as you do with allies. I'd rather not have American tax payers having to fund a UK bailout...let's hope it doesn't come to that.
4. Give me a break. We were helping you with money and materials from 1940. When it looked like Germany might actually win we stepped in as allies do and helped win the war. If anyone should be pissed off at us it should be Poland or Russia. They had devastating casualties in that war.
To your final point. WWII was really the turning point for the nation in terms of getting involved in HUGELY unpopular wars to prevent the spread of communism. I am not crying about the UK looking after itself as you say. I am frustrated that you are:
1. Destabilizing a peaceful union in Europe...sure there have been a few dust ups in the last couple of decades, but largely it's been a peaceful place.
2. Potentially need long term/short term aide from us if things go wrong.
3. Taking a step back as a nation in terms of acceptance. Those racially motivated attacks after the Brexit vote results, were done by voters that voted to leave, because they are narrow minded bigots and anytime that view wins the day it's not good for the world. Does that mean I think every voter who voted to leave is a narrow minded bigot? Absolutely not Pete. I find it puzzling that you as an intelligent person can't see that you voted for the same thing (for different reasons) as those people. It's not insulting. It's a fact...even if it makes you uncomfortable...the leave vote had some very unsavoury bedfellows that came along with it.
magicjuan
Player Valuation: £60m
So too the remain camp, this point of yours is an absolute nonsense.
Such a complicated vote should never have been down to a simple yes or no, I've made this point before and at least one poster here couldn't grasp it at all, but a yes/no didn't cover it, a third option should have been added and the mandate should have had a greater margin percentage, not 50% plus one. In a yes/no situation you will have no choice of the company you choose because it didn't follow traditional 'party lines'.
As for your Americanised history, the majority of the world sees it differently, much, much differently. You're not some big brother riding to the rescue, but a bully that applies 'compassion' for the price of adhering to the systems and values that underpins American business interests.
Well, I've said as much quite consistently before the vote happened (I think it gets lumped in under the world war 3 label). There are a lot of very bad politicians in a very real position to gain power at the moment, and I said that Brexit would provide them with wind in their sails. Sadly, that does appear to have happened, as each of those bad politicians has cheered the result.
Of course 'world war 3' hasn't happened yet, but we have the American election this autumn, the French one next spring and those will be the real markers. I would feel very sad if what has happened in Britain helps Trump and/or Le Pen gain power.
I've no doubt that there are a great many people with a great deal of discontent with how things are at the moment, but putting lunatics in charge of the asylum is no solution.
Yes...either a super majority (60%+) or a third option was the way to go. It is not a yes or no question....it is a multi layered question. You've nailed it 100%.
Also agreed 100% on the party lines bit...the way it was set up, you all were put in a very difficult place.
My Americanized history...well, frankly it is what we are taught. I do my best to try to go beyond the normal American with regards to world views and more importantly to me, how we are viewed on the world stage. And I suggest that some of your perceptions of my view of history are also viewed from a very different, and equally flawed textbook.
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
"When it looked like Germany was winning we stepped in as allies do".......you do realise that the USA didn't actually declare war on anybody until they declared war on you, you were attacked by Japan and then its partner Germany declared war on the USA.....but that's for another thread......
TheBlueGibbon
Player Valuation: £40m
The TUC have released a report into how migration can be better managed between now and the time Brexit actually occurs.
Nearly three quarters of people who voted to leave the EU said migration was one of their top three concerns, in a TUC poll taken days after the referendum.
85 per cent said that it’s essential to reduce the number of migrants coming to Britain. 44 per cent of Remain voters also wanted immigration reduced.
However, two thirds of voters agreed with the statement that ‘as long as the system is well managed, immigration can be good for Britain’, including a majority of Leave voters.
A TUC report published today, Managing migration better for Britain, looks at what the government could do now – before we leave the EU – to manage migration better and win more public support.
Some of these measures are policies the TUC has called for repeatedly. We hope politicians are now listening.
The idea of restoring the Migration Impact Fund is now widely shared. But our concern is that the fund should be considerably larger than it was under Gordon Brown, and should give local people a say over the funding of local services, like schools, hospitals and GP surgeries. It should also pay for the extra housing needs of a growing population.
We want to make sure that the economic benefits of migration that politicians and economists talk about actually filter through to the people who need better services and more homes.
We also want to press the case for an economy that prevents both exploitation of migrants and undercutting of the existing workforce.
Bad bosses will use any opportunity to divide working people if they can make a fast buck out of it. That’s what’s behind the lower rate for young people of the so-called National Living Wage, and it’s what they tried when women entered the labour force in greater numbers.
The appropriate response is to ensure equal pay for people doing the same job in the same place, closing the loopholes that allow exploitation and undercutting, and toughening up the enforcement of such rules.
Restoring collective bargaining where unions can recruit, and introducing modern wages councils where that doesn’t happen also have a part to play.
The TUC is also advocating a bigger Border Force, with a remit to prevent trafficking and exploitation, to take the strain of enforcing migration laws off employers, landlords, education and health professionals.
As the Byron Burgers experience shows, turning private people into part of the Border Force leads to all sorts of abuses, as well as giving people roles they are uncomfortable with and unprepared for.
There are a lot of proposals in the paper which would help manage migration better, for migrants as well as the local population.
One that is more urgent than most is to guarantee that people from other EU countries who have been living and working in the UK should be allowed to stay. Immediately after the referendum, our polling showed that 64 per cent of voters wanted to recognise their commitment to the UK, and only 28 per cent of Leave voters disagreed.
Making the migration system work better would not only improve people’s working lives and communities, it would rebuild trust. Three quarters of Leave voters felt that the Remain campaign dismissed legitimate concerns about immigration, but so too did nearly a third of Remain voters.
Engaging with the TUC’s proposals for managing migration would be an important way for politicians to demonstrate that they get it, and are taking people’s views seriously.
That’s more urgent than deciding what our relationship with the EU should be after Brexit: we’ve got to start bringing people together.
https://leftfootforward.org/2016/08/what-does-a-left-wing-migration-policy-look-like/
Nearly three quarters of people who voted to leave the EU said migration was one of their top three concerns, in a TUC poll taken days after the referendum.
85 per cent said that it’s essential to reduce the number of migrants coming to Britain. 44 per cent of Remain voters also wanted immigration reduced.
However, two thirds of voters agreed with the statement that ‘as long as the system is well managed, immigration can be good for Britain’, including a majority of Leave voters.
A TUC report published today, Managing migration better for Britain, looks at what the government could do now – before we leave the EU – to manage migration better and win more public support.
Some of these measures are policies the TUC has called for repeatedly. We hope politicians are now listening.
The idea of restoring the Migration Impact Fund is now widely shared. But our concern is that the fund should be considerably larger than it was under Gordon Brown, and should give local people a say over the funding of local services, like schools, hospitals and GP surgeries. It should also pay for the extra housing needs of a growing population.
We want to make sure that the economic benefits of migration that politicians and economists talk about actually filter through to the people who need better services and more homes.
We also want to press the case for an economy that prevents both exploitation of migrants and undercutting of the existing workforce.
Bad bosses will use any opportunity to divide working people if they can make a fast buck out of it. That’s what’s behind the lower rate for young people of the so-called National Living Wage, and it’s what they tried when women entered the labour force in greater numbers.
The appropriate response is to ensure equal pay for people doing the same job in the same place, closing the loopholes that allow exploitation and undercutting, and toughening up the enforcement of such rules.
Restoring collective bargaining where unions can recruit, and introducing modern wages councils where that doesn’t happen also have a part to play.
The TUC is also advocating a bigger Border Force, with a remit to prevent trafficking and exploitation, to take the strain of enforcing migration laws off employers, landlords, education and health professionals.
As the Byron Burgers experience shows, turning private people into part of the Border Force leads to all sorts of abuses, as well as giving people roles they are uncomfortable with and unprepared for.
There are a lot of proposals in the paper which would help manage migration better, for migrants as well as the local population.
One that is more urgent than most is to guarantee that people from other EU countries who have been living and working in the UK should be allowed to stay. Immediately after the referendum, our polling showed that 64 per cent of voters wanted to recognise their commitment to the UK, and only 28 per cent of Leave voters disagreed.
Making the migration system work better would not only improve people’s working lives and communities, it would rebuild trust. Three quarters of Leave voters felt that the Remain campaign dismissed legitimate concerns about immigration, but so too did nearly a third of Remain voters.
Engaging with the TUC’s proposals for managing migration would be an important way for politicians to demonstrate that they get it, and are taking people’s views seriously.
That’s more urgent than deciding what our relationship with the EU should be after Brexit: we’ve got to start bringing people together.
https://leftfootforward.org/2016/08/what-does-a-left-wing-migration-policy-look-like/
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Nice to see that they have finally woken up. I wonder if this report would have seen the light of day if we had voted to remain.........
It's good that at last the conversation is being had, although I don't necessarily agree with their conclusions. It would be nice if greater emphasis was given to education, especially retraining those whose livelihood has been disrupted for whatever reason.
If its that good why does the USA not join the EU GOD SAVE AMERICA
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
It's a conversation well overdue. It's a shame that it's taken the best part of 20 years to get past the raising of the immigration issue as 'racist' and 'xenophobic'. Proper debate over admission and actions to integrate those that do come in, coupled with helping citizens who are being left behind or feel shut out, is in the best interests of everyone.......
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Hahaha........a fair point......
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