Current Affairs EU In or Out

[roydo]

You are not comparing like for like, HMV have been going under for years because of Amazon and streaming and the more salient point is the Tory government wanted to give Nissan 10s of millions £s in state aid because of both parties concerns over Brexit. So even the government concludes the same.

Wasnt trying to compare them at all.

I was making the point that blaming Nissan on Brexit is as daft as saying HMV being saved was a result of Brexit.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Wasnt trying to compare them at all.

I was making the point that blaming Nissan on Brexit is as daft as saying HMV being saved was a result of Brexit.

But it's not daft to suggest Nissan decision is because of Brexit. The Tory government has also concluded this with the state aid monies it was ready to offer Nissan because of referendum result. And back then when it was offered the context, of no deal and just talk of leaving and it will be easy a path of gold they said!

 

[roydo]

But it's not daft to suggest Nissan decision is because of Brexit. The Tory government has also concluded this with the state aid monies it was ready to offer Nissan because of referendum result. And back then when it was offered the context was of no deal and just talk of leaving and it will be easy and a path of gold.

I perhaps didnt make myself clear, and/or you didnt see some posts a day or so ago from me about Nissan/Brexit/Blame.

It was in the context, in these fevered days, of folk on both sides seizing on a story and rushing to claim that story as a triumph or disaster, and all down to Brexit.

I said that until the details come out, it is unwise to file Nissan under "Brexit Disaster", but that folk will do just that. Which some have done.

I know no more than you why the CEO of Nissan made the decision to move some bits back to Japan, but my suggestion was that new trade deal between Japan and the EU gives them a very convenient fig leaf to curry domestic favour. Or it could be 100% Brexit. But as they are part French owned, why didnt they move to France?

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

I know no more than you why the CEO of Nissan made the decision to move some bits back to Japan, but my suggestion was that new trade deal between Japan and the EU gives them a very convenient fig leaf to curry domestic favour. Or it could be 100% Brexit. But as they are part French owned, why didnt they move to France?

They will wind down operations because moving an entire functional production line for whatever reason, even for Brexit, is very very costly, more so than Sony or Panasonic headquaters being moved as we type again because of Brexit.

As for CEO of Nissan, the one May rushed to offer state aid too, he is in prison?!

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...e-carlos-ghosn-meets-theresa-may-brexit-talks

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/23/business/carlos-ghosn-jail-christmas-new-years-eve/index.html

 

[roydo]

They will wind down operations because moving an entire functional production line for whatever reason, even for Brexit, is very very costly, more so than Sony or Panasonic headquaters being moved as we type again because of Brexit.

As for CEO of Nissan, the one May rushed to offer state aid too, he is in prison?!

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...e-carlos-ghosn-meets-theresa-may-brexit-talks

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/23/business/carlos-ghosn-jail-christmas-new-years-eve/index.html

I think you have missed my point, or I havnt put it across very well.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

But as they are part French owned, why didnt they move to France?

They will wind down operations because moving an entire functional production line for whatever reason, even for Brexit, is very very costly, more so than Sony or Panasonic headquaters being moved as we type again because of Brexit.

And maybe other vehicle lines of renault nissan and mitsubishi partnership have or will be moved to French production lines, so in essence from UK to Japan then France...

 

[Sarnia Kevin]

I perhaps didnt make myself clear, and/or you didnt see some posts a day or so ago from me about Nissan/Brexit/Blame.

It was in the context, in these fevered days, of folk on both sides seizing on a story and rushing to claim that story as a triumph or disaster, and all down to Brexit.

I said that until the details come out, it is unwise to file Nissan under "Brexit Disaster", but that folk will do just that. Which some have done.

I know no more than you why the CEO of Nissan made the decision to move some bits back to Japan, but my suggestion was that new trade deal between Japan and the EU gives them a very convenient fig leaf to curry domestic favour. Or it could be 100% Brexit. But as they are part French owned, why didnt they move to France?

Because of the high social/production costs in France perhaps? Qui sait?

 

[Jebus_lives]

Yep, I agree. Said a few times, and as one who would rather remain, blaming Brexit for every negative story is pointless. And dangerous. There will be some bad stuff that will be a direct result of it, but equally, it can also be a convenient fig leaf at times.


Like today, HMV has been bought by some Canadian company, saving 1500 jobs. Down to Brexit? Nah. Similar thing with Nissan.

While I agree with the reasoning here, Nissan was used as a shining example of British industry thriving in the event of Brexit. 'X-Trail being built proving confidence in Brexit' and 'protect Fear claim Nissan will scale back UK operations couldn't be further from the truth'.

Now the narrative is 'well Brexit probably HAS contributed to the decision to leave, but lots of other things as well...'

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

 

[peteblue]

They will wind down operations because moving an entire functional production line for whatever reason, even for Brexit, is very very costly, more so than Sony or Panasonic headquaters being moved as we type again because of Brexit.

As for CEO of Nissan, the one May rushed to offer state aid too, he is in prison?!

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...e-carlos-ghosn-meets-theresa-may-brexit-talks

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/23/business/carlos-ghosn-jail-christmas-new-years-eve/index.html

They are not winding down an entire production line. The current workforce will remain the same, producing the same cars. They are just putting the new car on an existing line in Japan because they now have a freetrade deal with the EU, which has nothing to do with Brexit. Which bit do you not understand....

 

[dublinbluenose]

Some of May's comments in Belfast today quite interesting. Definitely a softening of the drop the backstop from last week.

 

[peteblue]

Some of May's comments in Belfast today quite interesting. Definitely a softening of the drop the backstop from last week.

It’s a pincer movement. May is saying she will not put a hard border in and is being reasonable. The EU and Germany are telling Varadkar there will be a hard border if there is no deal and therefore putting pressure on him to drop ‘the backstop’. It will all come together now. No one will lose face but the ‘backstop’ will be quietly dropped and a legal definition will be put in place.....job done, Deal done......

 

[dublinbluenose]

It’s a pincer movement. May is saying she will not put a hard border in and is being reasonable. The EU and Germany are telling Varadkar there will be a hard border if there is no deal and therefore putting pressure on him to drop ‘the backstop’. It will all come together now. No one will lose face but the ‘backstop’ will be quietly dropped and a legal definition will be put in place.....job done, Deal done......

Always with the WW2 overtones

 

[peteblue]

Always with the WW2 overtones

If I’d said ‘double envelopment’ you wouldn’t have had a clue......

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

They are not winding down an entire production line. The current workforce will remain the same, producing the same cars. They are just putting the new car on an existing line in Japan because they now have a freetrade deal with the EU, which has nothing to do with Brexit. Which bit do you not understand....

Medium to long term future is no longer guaranteed at Nissan Sunderland...

And Brexit and EU is about trade. How do you know Nissan operations were not part of free trade negotiations between EU and Japan I suspect they were along with many others. And that is the whole point of trade deals, the signatures of trade deals will treat each other favourably and those outside (competitors) less so. So were you party to these discussions and subsequent trade deal?