Current Affairs EU In or Out

[Harryflashman]

Ok:

"Impose laws on 28 states"

Laws aren't imposed on 28 states, they're decided by 28 states.

"Democracy only works if you know who your representatives are"

Why would anyone in this country not know who their MEP or their Prime Minister is?

"Who are all these eurocrats and who are they answerable to?"

They're answerable to the European Council, who consist of the heads of each member state.

"The general MEPs have no power schtick"

That's not true, MEPs can approve, amend or reject pretty much all EU legislation. They also decide on the EU budget. The suggestion that they are less powerful than the House of Lords is a lie.

"European Commission meetings are held in secret and we have no idea what goes on in them"

Except both the agenda and the minutes from the meetings are all published:

http://ec.europa.eu/transparency/regdoc/?fuseaction=gridyear

"The tour of the Commission building..."

Those kind of facilities are in place in a great many workplaces these days. It's hardly like they're working in Versailles!

"10,000 officials earn more than the prime minister..."

As do 500 or so council officials, not to mention the various heads of the NHS and so on.

"The EU buy support from people"

I've done some work with them and am completely neutral.

Really good response

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Serious effort to be completely ignored...

The sad thing is, apart from the 5 minutes watching it that I'll never get back, actually holding some of these statements to account would take perhaps another 5 minutes of research. It's not that hard, yet it's seemingly hard enough.

 

[orly]

He introduces it with others involved all leading Brexiteers - I stated if you read my post that Jeremy Paxman did a far better documentary on its two parliaments.....
I suggest you take it up with whoever produced that show TV channel etc - if that's your gripe it looks ancient to me, Paxmans was done just before the referendum in 2016......

Very disappointing. Kelvin Mackenzie.

 

[orchard]

The sad thing is, apart from the 5 minutes watching it that I'll never get back, actually holding some of these statements to account would take perhaps another 5 minutes of research. It's not that hard, yet it's seemingly hard enough.

The time all adds up and you know he will just chat chod and ignore it.

 

[edge]

It’s not remain is it ? I wanted to remain and I’ve been told by @Joey66 maybe 50 times that I lost and I need to get over it . So in a binary vote leave/remain we’re leaving , in what I think is a terrible deal so I’m really unhappy but you’re leaving .

17.4m people voted for leave and almost everyone of them probably had a different idea in mind , so how can a government satisfy everyone ? We certainly aren’t staying , Which is what I wanted.

As regards the decision to leave a lot of people campaigned to leave without a single one of them coming up with an idea how to achieve it . So yeah I’m going to blame the ones who promised the unachievable.

We will end up not leaving,
its only unachievable if there is no will by the government /establishment to implement the vote.
People for a lot of reasons wanted out, not half in/out , to most that meant totally free from the EU and its governance but with a trade deal that benefited both sides
are you honestly saying its impossible to get a trade deal between the UK and the EU like every other country in the world does?
We have had 11 referendums since the seventies and every one of them have been respected by government, but this one , and that's totally down to remainers not accepting the vote and trying to overturn it at every step.

 

[COYBL25]

You are the best advert for stopping brexit

He`s in the process of trying to finding a second hand dinghy that doesn`t leak, so he can sail around the Channel, waving a Union Jack around and resplendent in a yellow hi viz jacket.

 

[Harryflashman]

We will end up not leaving,
its only unachievable if there is no will by the government /establishment to implement the vote.
People for a lot of reasons wanted out, not half in/out , to most that meant totally free from the EU and its governance but with a trade deal that benefited both sides
are you honestly saying its impossible to get a trade deal between the UK and the EU like every other country in the world does?
We have had 11 referendums since the seventies and every one of them have been respected by government, but this one , and that's totally down to remainers not accepting the vote and trying to overturn it at every step.

No , sorry mate . What I mean was unachievable were the promises made . We were told that everything was incredibly simple “easiest deal in history “ that trade deals would be done within days etc all that was obviously not possible . The Irish border situation is a different conversation with current red lines I’m not sure it can be resolved.

As regards leaving , of course it’s a mess but this deal is certainly leaving because it’s absolutely not remaining so it has to be leaving . Now it won’t get through, so what happens next I agree is the issue but trying to make something out of this dogs breakfast is far from easy .

 

[Old Blue 2]

Ok:

"Impose laws on 28 states"

Laws aren't imposed on 28 states, they're decided by 28 states.

"Democracy only works if you know who your representatives are"

Why would anyone in this country not know who their MEP or their Prime Minister is?

"Who are all these eurocrats and who are they answerable to?"

They're answerable to the European Council, who consist of the heads of each member state.

"The general MEPs have no power schtick"

That's not true, MEPs can approve, amend or reject pretty much all EU legislation. They also decide on the EU budget. The suggestion that they are less powerful than the House of Lords is a lie.

"European Commission meetings are held in secret and we have no idea what goes on in them"

Except both the agenda and the minutes from the meetings are all published:

http://ec.europa.eu/transparency/regdoc/?fuseaction=gridyear

"The tour of the Commission building..."

Those kind of facilities are in place in a great many workplaces these days. It's hardly like they're working in Versailles!

"10,000 officials earn more than the prime minister..."

As do 500 or so council officials, not to mention the various heads of the NHS and so on.

"The EU buy support from people"

I've done some work with them and am completely neutral.

Thank you, Bruce, for the reasoned reply I was seeking. Appreciated.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

The time all adds up and you know he will just chat chod and ignore it.

Of course, or he'll use the fact that I've done some work for the EC as a reason to discount it. Such is life.

We will end up not leaving,
its only unachievable if there is no will by the government /establishment to implement the vote.
People for a lot of reasons wanted out, not half in/out , to most that meant totally free from the EU and its governance but with a trade deal that benefited both sides
are you honestly saying its impossible to get a trade deal between the UK and the EU like every other country in the world does?
We have had 11 referendums since the seventies and every one of them have been respected by government, but this one , and that's totally down to remainers not accepting the vote and trying to overturn it at every step.

May's deal does take Britain out of the EU. It removes ECJ jurisdiction and ends free movement, whilst maintaining most of the trade stuff. Considering ECJ and free movement were two of the major things people wanted OUT from, I do question just how much people really understand either what May has delivered or indeed what it is they want Brexit to be.

 

[davids]

Howled laughing at the Tory Brexiteer (no idea of name) who thinks Norway 2:0 is the way forward.Obviously unaware that they still have freedom of movement and are part of Schengen.

 

[Harryflashman]

May's deal does take Britain out of the EU. It removes ECJ jurisdiction and ends free movement, whilst maintaining most of the trade stuff. Considering ECJ and free movement were two of the major things people wanted OUT from, I do question just how much people really understand either what May has delivered or indeed what it is they want Brexit to be.

It’s certainly not remaining that’s for sure . It’s a bad deal but that doesn’t equal remain , I’m not sure how the two things have become entwined .

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Thank you, Bruce, for the reasoned reply I was seeking. Appreciated.

Not very detailed responses, granted, but the information is largely out there.

 

[longers]

Here’s my highbrow contribution to the thread for today

 

[Joey66]

Very disappointing. Kelvin Mackenzie.

He was in the clip someone else posted what's your point - he is still in the media I turn him off when he spears on my TV , I suggest you do the same - he is obnoxious on most subjects ......

 

[Joey66]

It might be delayed at Dover I'm afraid.

Plenty on Amazon oh bythe way the Mayor of Calais is letting all trucks lorries through as she does not want them backing up in her domain no extra checks again project fear......