Yes on a controlled system - no free movement one of the EU enshrined tablets of stone!
Current Affairs EU In or Out
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peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
I see Germany are getting a bit twitchy about Trump and his tariffs, especially as he keeps telling the EU that if they retaliate he will hit cars......
“Germany and its allies must now safeguard the free trade order and avoid being divided by Trump's offer to exempt some allies such as Mexico, Canada and Australia from the proposed tariffs, Zypries said.
"It is important for Europe to show collectively that there can be countermeasures and that there won't be cracks in the alliance of free traders," the minister said.
I love the way Germany talks about free trade and free traders, while sitting behind the most protectionist wall on the planet, and ensuring that the EU collective does its bidding. It knows that its only hope of gaining exemption is via the EU because of its massive trade imbalance with the USA. If ‘free trade’ was so important to them, why the problem in doing a deal with the U.K.. It’s duplicitous self serving cynicism, just like our own duplicitous self serving cynicism, should be called out for what it is.........
“Germany and its allies must now safeguard the free trade order and avoid being divided by Trump's offer to exempt some allies such as Mexico, Canada and Australia from the proposed tariffs, Zypries said.
"It is important for Europe to show collectively that there can be countermeasures and that there won't be cracks in the alliance of free traders," the minister said.
I love the way Germany talks about free trade and free traders, while sitting behind the most protectionist wall on the planet, and ensuring that the EU collective does its bidding. It knows that its only hope of gaining exemption is via the EU because of its massive trade imbalance with the USA. If ‘free trade’ was so important to them, why the problem in doing a deal with the U.K.. It’s duplicitous self serving cynicism, just like our own duplicitous self serving cynicism, should be called out for what it is.........
So you'd advocate controlling the birth rate of the nation as well on the same Malthusian logic?
Plus the immigration Bruce,??
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
There are 26 countries in the world that we currently have a free movement agreement with.
So there are about, god knows, a 100(?) other that we do have controls over.
Where do you reckon the problem, in your mind apparently, is?
Work permit, and Visa control like other big countries outside the EU use - you try to move to Australia, Canada , and the USA!
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
Quite. But you say a city the size of Hull pitches up every year, when we have controls over non EU countries. EU immigration accounts for a small % of our overall immigration. And their, (EU) contribution to the UK economy is positive.
So not sure why you think the "problem" will be sorted by leaving the EU.
But we voted OUT, so I should get over it I guess.
Charlie Sweet
Player Valuation: £35m
Wow - there's no need to get angry here mate. A debate does involve questions being answered. We're discussing the £350m bus. I have no issue accepting that figure is correct in a very abstract sense given it has no effective meaning to the man in the street given it ignores both the rebate and the net benefit (or cost) of wider EU membership.
I believe the bus message sought to convey the idea that a vote to leave could directly translate to £350m more going into the NHS each week. I think it really was as simple and as blunt as that. What do you think?
I am genuinely intrigued to know how you think the message was intended to play out and where any subtleties or caveats played out.
In tandem perhaps I am very happy to answer your question.
I think the doomsday economic scenario predicted on the announcement of a No vote was based on the assumption of Article 50 being executed more or less immediately. Of course it wasn't and instead we had the circus of a Tory leadership election and a general election. So there was no immediate cliff edge but let's not forget that the Governor of the Bank of England was forced to announce a historic level of market intervention following the Referendum with £250 billion of guarantees.
But let's not kid ourselves that the Brexit vote hasn't already been damaging to the UK.
Before the EU Referendum we were in a very strong economic position. Take a look at the the IMF World Economic Outlook figures from Jan 2016:
Rank 1 = UK - 2014 (2.9%), 2015 (2.2%), 2016 (2.2%), 2017 (2.2%) UK 4-year average 2.4%
Rank 2 = Germany - 2014 (1.6%), 2015 (1.5%), 2016 (1.7%), 2017 (1.7%) Germany 4-year average 1.6%
Rank 3 = Euro Area - 2014 (0.9%), 2015 (1.5%), 2016 (1.7%), 2017 (1.7%) Euro Area 4-year average 1.5%
Rank 4 = France - 2014 (0.2%), 2015 (1.1%), 2016 (1.3%), 2017 (1.5%) France 4-year average 1.0%
We were miles ahead of Germany and the rest of Europe.
http://www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO/Issues/2016/12/31/Subdued-Demand-Diminished-Prospects
Fast-forward two years and this is what the Brexit vote has done for us:
Rank 1 = Germany - 2016 (1.9%), 2017 (2.5%), 2018 (2.3%), 2019 (2.0%) Germany 4-year average 2.2%
Rank 2 = Euro Area - 2016 (1.8%), 2017 (2.4%), 2018 (2.2%), 2019 (2.0%) Euro Area 4-year average 2.1%
Rank 3 = France - 2016 (1.2%), 2017 (1.8%), 2018 (1.9%), 2019 (1.9%) France 4-year average 1.7%
Rank 4 = UK - 2016 (1.9%), 2017 (1.7%), 2018 (1.5%), 2019 (1.5%). UK 4-year average 1.6%
We are now the sick man of Europe and we haven't even got to grips with the implications of a Hard Brexit.
http://www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO/Issues/2018/01/11/world-economic-outlook-update-january-2018
Of course I've no doubt that @Joey66 will mock me for doing some research and @peteblue will look to dismiss economic statistics as irrelevant in any case but what says you? Do you not accept the economic performance and outlook has taken a pounding from the Brexit vote?
No we will have the same controls as other countries I mentioned- immigration definitely - but stipulated work visa and short stay visas from all over the world - As a country though we have to make a big move to stop our skill shortages, and make it harder for easy top professionals migration - e.g. Doctors / Nurses who thin here pay back their training if the flit for top salaries immediately- my son for instance any it paid exams if he leaves within 12 months his company take all the cost of his training back out of his 3 months notice!
You need mocking - tell me how much does it cost us on being in the single market ?
The EU make a fortune out of us on tarrifs outside the EU when we trade - stopping imports or us having a larger export market - we should have walked after article 50 was signed as they will drag thes negotions on for ever!
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Hahahaha......I see the Chancellor will have an additional £10Bn to play with because of the increased U.K. performance, apparently the forecasts were wrong. Economic statistics are not irrelevant, those that have already occurred can be included, forecasts are just that, someone’s forecasts. Now let me see you do the numbers for 2014-2017 actuals and do the comparison........
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Hahaha, even using your own numbers, did you happen to notice that every single forecast for the years 2016 and 2017 were wrong for every country......you really couldn’t make this up, but someone obviously did......
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peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Just look at the numbers he used, not one single forecast was correct, but of course all the future ones will be.......
I'd be more worried about all the old farts clogging up our health system not being able to be treated because they can't get any doctors and nurses to be honest.
"Sorry Josephine, can you wait 5 years whilst we train up a native? In the meantime try singing Rule Britannia twice a day..."
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