Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
Status
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Seanjd said:
I'm as 'ordinary' as Ashley is, but unlike Ashley, I've at least done some research into which laws we control and which we don't. Being ignorant doesn't make you ordinary. He speaks for a large number of people who bought into the rhetoric without understanding the implications. He speaks for a large number of people who are being dragged to the right by fear-mongering 'politicians'.
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No Sean, he speaks for a small number of people who should learn to prepare before they go on a radio call in show. Your clear implication that a large number of Leave voters are ignorant isn't appreciated.

And for the record, a great many Remain voters were equally brainwashed by 'project fear'. Swings both ways.
 
Seanjd said:
I'm as 'ordinary' as Ashley is, but unlike Ashley, I've at least done some research into which laws we control and which we don't. Being ignorant doesn't make you ordinary. He speaks for a large number of people who bought into the rhetoric without understanding the implications. He speaks for a large number of people who are being dragged to the right by fear-mongering 'politicians'.
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No idea about his motivations / background. I'm using ordinary as a term for those who know little or nothing about E U law but have a vague feeling that it isn't a good thing for law makers to be remote. It's a little like my vague idea that using my toaster in the bath may have unfortunate consequences - despite my total lack of knowledge why that might be the case.

Many live by general principles.

I can't make any sensible comment on your last assertion. I'm happy to wait and see what consensus the sociologists / psephologists and the rest come to.
 
The Cowboy said:
No Sean, he speaks for a small number of people who should learn to prepare before they go on a radio call in show. Your clear implication that a large number of Leave voters are ignorant isn't appreciated.

And for the record, a great many Remain voters were equally brainwashed by 'project fear'. Swings both ways.
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You say that implying that lots of leave voters were ignorant isn't appreciated then go on on say that a great many remain voters were brainwashed. I'm
Not sure what you're getting at there.

I think many leave voters were ignorant to what a mess the country would and will be in post Brexit.
 
Seanjd said:
You say that implying that lots of leave voters were ignorant isn't appreciated then go on on say that a great many remain voters were brainwashed. I'm
Not sure what you're getting at there.

I think many leave voters were ignorant to what a mess the country would and will be in post Brexit.
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I await the mess. Let me know when it happens will you?
 
1966efc said:
No idea about his motivations / background. I'm using ordinary as a term for those who know little or nothing about E U law but have a vague feeling that it isn't a good thing for law makers to be remote. It's a little like my vague idea that using my toaster in the bath may have unfortunate consequences - despite my total lack of knowledge why that might be the case.

Many live by general principles
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That's not your best analogy to be fair.

If you know nothing about EU law, like Ashley, then you do some research before spouting nonesense.
 
Seanjd said:
That's not your best analogy to be fair. If you know nothing about EU law then you do some research before spouting nonesense.
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In your opinion - on both accounts.

I'd say it's perfectly reasonable to say it didn't oughta happen or whatever without being labelled as Alf Garnett. It would be utterly ridiculous for people like him to attempt to contribute to an academic debate, I agree. But some two bit radio show, no - for me, he was entitled to pipe up.
 
Seanjd said:
That's not your best analogy to be fair.

If you know nothing about EU law, like Ashley, then you do some research before spouting nonesense.
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And I agree with you. But you can't extrapolate that out to all Leave voters. You do realise some/many people weighed up the uncomfortable logistics with what they felt they stood to gain, and ticked the box accordingly?
 
1966efc said:
In your opinion - on both accounts.

I'd say it's perfectly reasonable to say it didn't oughta happen or whatever without being labelled as Alf Garnett. It would be utterly ridiculous for people like him to attempt to contribute to an academic debate, I agree. But some two bit radio show, no - for me, he was entitled to pipe up.
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Fair enough, naff show and all that. But it goes beyond this guy on LBC. His argument is an example of one which has been affected so much by what others have said, he genuinely doesn't have a clue how to think for himself. Which is symptomatic of this countries' lurch to the right, and what I am sure we will see across Europe, and what we have seen in America.
 
Seanjd said:
Fair enough, naff show and all that. But it goes beyond this guy on LBC. His argument is an example of one which has been affected so much by what others have said, he genuinely doesn't have a clue how to think for himself. Which is symptomatic of this countries' lurch to the right, and what I am sure we will see across Europe, and what we have seen in America.
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You ever thought socialism isn't all it's cracked up to be? It's not very popular, after all.
 
The Cowboy said:
And I agree with you. But you can't extrapolate that out to all Leave voters. You do realise some/many people weighed up the uncomfortable logistics with what they felt they stood to gain, and ticked the box accordingly?
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Of course they did, we have had this debate before, but I'm aware that some voters were informed and some voters weren't. In my point of view, as somebody who isn't a euro-fanatic but would rather live with the benefits of it than without, the public were not educated as to the benefits of the EU. Even the remain campaign seemed almost scared to highlight the good points of the EU as though they had admitted that its reputation was in such tatters by 2015 that there was no point, hence Osbornes stupid comments.
 
Seanjd said:
Fair enough, naff show and all that. But it goes beyond this guy on LBC. His argument is an example of one which has been affected so much by what others have said, he genuinely doesn't have a clue how to think for himself. Which is symptomatic of this countries' lurch to the right, and what I am sure we will see across Europe, and what we have seen in America.
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And I agree with you! Aren't we the turtle doves! Thing is, this whole thread is a prime example of what you excoriate: how much original let alone logical thought have you come across in it? Most of it is regurgitated opinion from the papers, Daily Politics etc. And yet I defend the right of those who participate to do so.

I've got to repeat, people have opinions based on little in all sorts of areas. If you want serious debate, you go to a particular sort of site, media outlet; if you're just blowing off steam, to another.
 
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