Current Affairs EU In or Out

[The binman chronicles]

The votes tonight are probably for the best, carry on with article 50 but parliament should scrutinise the government's plan. Seems all fair enough. Even as a remain supporter (or remoaner) I didn't think the government should stop the process of leaving the EU due to the referendum result, however I will still admit i'm hoping on a wildcard to throw a spanner into the works later on down the line!

I still don't get some of the Brexiteers on here though, you know what the EU gives you, it's all quantifiable. By leaving we are stepping into the unknown, so unless you are a bunch of gamblers i don't get it. Even gamblers usually know how much they are betting and any potential windfalls/loses will be incurred. It's all pie in the sky theorem with this, based on the figures of Boris/Nigel and Michael bloody Gove!

I like to know the facts before making life changing decisions and I haven't heard many to do with brexit, or at least real ones anyhow.

I would save any gloating until after we exit the EU and then if it turns out to be better for the country then bravo, I will thank you for your higher wisdom.

 

[Joey66]

I agree, but that process and value is accelerating out of necessity - it will be interesting to see the role they play assuming Article 50 requires legislation and subsequently.

If Scotland ever lose another referendum they will be straight there if common sense is not prevailed the Judges today were discussing politics the exact thing they told the solicitors barristers they did not want to get involved in!

 

[The Esk]

The people voted both sides told propaganda lies the vote has to be accepted

That's the point it doesn't have to be accepted at all as it was determined on totally false premises.

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

Just can't get past pictures like this when it comes to the house of Lords.

 

[Joey66]

I agree, but that process and value is accelerating out of necessity - it will be interesting to see the role they play assuming Article 50 requires legislation and subsequently.

What ever they come up with it will not supersede tonight's decision very strange way to waste money all around IMO!

 

[The Cowboy]

Just can't get past pictures like this when it comes to the house of Lords.

Never has the word 'cretins' been so apt.

 

[Joey66]

That's the point it doesn't have to be accepted at all as it was determined on totally false premises.

On both sides so the Remainers ca not moan they thought it was in the bag they underestimated the people in s democracy Esk!

 

[Joey66]

Never has the word 'cretins' been so apt.

It should be elected every GE under PRoportional representation!

 

[peteblue]

The votes tonight are probably for the best, carry on with article 50 but parliament should scrutinise the government's plan. Seems all fair enough. Even as a remain supporter (or remoaner) I didn't think the government should stop the process of leaving the EU due to the referendum result, however I will still admit i'm hoping on a wildcard to throw a spanner into the works later on down the line!

I still don't get some of the Brexiteers on here though, you know what the EU gives you, it's all quantifiable. By leaving we are stepping into the unknown, so unless you are a bunch of gamblers i don't get it. Even gamblers usually know how much they are betting and any potential windfalls/loses will be incurred. It's all pie in the sky theorem with this, based on the figures of Boris/Nigel and Michael bloody Gove!

I like to know the facts before making life changing decisions and I haven't heard many to do with brexit, or at least real ones anyhow.

I would save any gloating until after we exit the EU and then if it turns out to be better for the country then bravo, I will thank you for your higher wisdom.

Here's something else the Eu is giving Europe.....

"In a letter sent to Martin Schulz, the panicked head of the European Council urged the legislature to compromise with national governments to unblock visa liberalisation – currently stopping the former Soviet states from gaining easy access to Europe.

The deal would allow a staggering 45million Ukrainians and five million Georgians to travel to Europe's Schengen zone without applying in advance for visas."......it will never end.....

 

[Joey66]

Here's something else the Eu is giving Europe.....

"In a letter sent to Martin Schulz, the panicked head of the European Council urged the legislature to compromise with national governments to unblock visa liberalisation – currently stopping the former Soviet states from gaining easy access to Europe.

The deal would allow a staggering 45million Ukrainians and five million Georgians to travel to Europe's Schengen zone without applying in advance for visas."......it will never end.....

Probably trying to flood our country "..............

 

[The binman chronicles]

Here's something else the Eu is giving Europe.....

"In a letter sent to Martin Schulz, the panicked head of the European Council urged the legislature to compromise with national governments to unblock visa liberalisation – currently stopping the former Soviet states from gaining easy access to Europe.

The deal would allow a staggering 45million Ukrainians and five million Georgians to travel to Europe's Schengen zone without applying in advance for visas."......it will never end.....

You'll never hear me say the EU is perfect and there is a hell of a lot a would change, I would however rather be inside pissing out than outside being pissed on.

Hopefully the situations in Italy, the Netherlands and France will help convert it back to being a trade block rather than being an authoritarian superstate. If that is the case and we can join without having total free movement and adhering to stupid courts I will be more than happy.

 

[peteblue]

You'll never hear me say the EU is perfect and there is a hell of a lot a would change, I would however rather be inside pissing out than outside being pissed on.

Hopefully the situations in Italy, the Netherlands and France will help convert it back to being a trade block rather than being an authoritarian superstate. If that is the case and we can join without having total free movement and adhering to stupid courts I will be more than happy.

I totally agree. If it were a trading block this thread would not even exist and would represent what we actually voted to join all those years ago.......

 

[joey_macmo]

Probably trying to flood our country "..............

I doubt it somehow Joey

 

[joey_macmo]

You'll never hear me say the EU is perfect and there is a hell of a lot a would change, I would however rather be inside pissing out than outside being pissed on.

Hopefully the situations in Italy, the Netherlands and France will help convert it back to being a trade block rather than being an authoritarian superstate. If that is the case and we can join without having total free movement and adhering to stupid courts I will be more than happy.

It's a scheme that has been delayed and delayed by the EU already, it's for the Schengen zone and is for visit visas no residency.

A perfect example of what the Esk is talking about with regards to The Papers

 

[Old Blue 2]

If you really believe I am objecting just on the grounds of the decision I despair.

Sure I don't want Brexit because it is economic suicide, but I have argued consistently about due process, the truth and those that are running the agenda who do not have the interests of the "man on the Clapham Omnibus".

The truth is that the referendum was offered on a false premise, the arguments were on a false premise, and the narrative since entirely false.

All of the above has been driven by and for a very narrow elite.

However going forward the most important aspect is that the people now charged (to be ratified by an Act of Parliament assuming the Supreme Court say so) actually have a clue as to what they are doing and the reasons for doing it. To date they have shown no evidence that know what they want, why they want it and how they're going to achieve it.

Esk,
Over many, many, pages you have stated your position quite clearly.

Your position in a nutshell is that you do not accept the democratic view of the people of this country, and you do not accept the democratic vote of Parliament. I think that leaves your views and opinions in tatters, really.

As I have pointed out several times in this thread (not just about you, but others also), you cannot claim as fact something which is your own personal opinion, yet here you go again "...Sure I don't want Brexit because it is economic suicide..." You cannot state with any certainty whatsoever that it is economic suicide. NOBODY can state that at the moment, because notwithstanding any kind of predictions, no one can say what the future will hold.

And here you claim 'truth': "...The truth is that the referendum was offered on a false premise, the arguments were on a false premise, and the narrative since entirely false..." Can you say without any shadow of a doubt that every single thing on all sides was false? I'll answer that for you - no you can't.

And what about this? "...All of the above has been driven by and for a very narrow elite..." Thank you for saying I am part of an elite. Well, yes I am, but I'm not going to tell you in open forum...