Erling Haland

[TheBigIguana]

I used Metz because it was just as relevant as Salzburg in the production discussion.

Who's the World XI player? Mane? Again, how's he "produced" by them. I'm not remotely pissed at what Salzburg get up to just find you chastising Everton's youth successes really bizarre when you're supposedly a fan of us. We've done it better than anyone in the league one could argue.

Anyone in the league??????

 

[TheBigIguana]

Where as signing young promising players isnt a coin flip?

Cos they all 100% make it, right?

It isn't just about the young players though. Has Mina gotten better? Be really honest when you answer this but, has Gomes improved? Given these guys weren't CL level when we signed them, that's a problem right?

 

[Nymzee]

Anyone in the league??????

Yeh? I mean this was under Koeman a couple of seasons back. Pretty sure we give youth a chance:

Everton have given more minutes to teenagers this season than any other team in the Premier League.

In total, players yet to reach their 20th birthday have amassed 6,132 minutes in the first 37 rounds of matches this campaign - more than 5,000 fewer than the 11,582 they played last season, according to figures from Youth Academies.

Despite facing accusations that he neglected young players during his tenure at Southampton, Ronald Koeman has given 2,140 minutes to the likes of Tom Davies, Dominic Calvert-Lewin and Mason Holgate since taking charge at Everton.

 

[Goat]

It isn't just about the young players though. Has Mina gotten better? Be really honest when you answer this but, has Gomes improved? Given these guys weren't CL level when we signed them, that's a problem right?

Yes I think Mina has improved, he seems to be improving all the time, whether he reaches elite level well im not sure, but for me he could play for us if we ever reached the CL. Gomes has played in the CL for Barca.

What is CL level for you?

Im sure theres some farmer who plays for FC Poland who has about 100 CL games, CL level isnt a thing.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Yeh? I mean this was under Koeman a couple of seasons back. Pretty sure we give youth a chance:

Everton have given more minutes to teenagers this season than any other team in the Premier League.

In total, players yet to reach their 20th birthday have amassed 6,132 minutes in the first 37 rounds of matches this campaign - more than 5,000 fewer than the 11,582 they played last season, according to figures from Youth Academies.

Despite facing accusations that he neglected young players during his tenure at Southampton, Ronald Koeman has given 2,140 minutes to the likes of Tom Davies, Dominic Calvert-Lewin and Mason Holgate since taking charge at Everton.

So one time three years ago we played more young players than anyone else. And that means we've done better than anyone else on the whole at creating a system for constant development. Ok.

 

[Nymzee]

So one time three years ago we played more young players than anyone else. And that means we've done better than anyone else on the whole at creating a system for constant development. Ok.

Again, and I'll stick the part in bold to point you in the right direction:

He's too smart to come here. It isn't a coincidence that the two clubs he's played for this season are both excellent at giving chances to and nurturing young talent.

So yes, I think a full season in which we have more teenagers collecting minutes shows we give youth a chance. It's almost like Anthony Gordon didn't make it onto the pitch just this season too.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Yes I think Mina has improved, he seems to be improving all the time, whether he reaches elite level well im not sure, but for me he could play for us if we ever reached the CL. Gomes has played in the CL for Barca.

What is CL level for you?

Im sure theres some farmer who plays for FC Poland who has about 100 CL games, CL level isnt a thing.

The level of player that teams in our league or the other good leagues that make the CL most years would use. Basically is he getting into the team for the "Big 6," Bayern, Dortmund, Juve, etc. I know that's lofty but that's where we want to compete right? Barcelona sold him because there answer was no and I imagine that would be the case for most teams. At best he's a rotation option for those sides. He's our best midfielder. Thus if he isn't getting better, we have a problem.

I like Mina but I don't feel like he's very different from the player who walked in the door at the start of last year.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Again, and I'll stick the part in bold to point you in the right direction:



So yes, I think a full season in which we have more teenagers collecting minutes shows we give youth a chance. It's almost like Anthony Gordon didn't make it onto the pitch just this season too.

Do you know what the word "and" means?

 

[Nymzee]

Do you know what the word "and" means?

What other word could you even use there? Or?

Just face it, you claimed Everton don't give youth a chance and you were wrong.

 

[TheBigIguana]

What other word could you even use there? Or?

Just face it, you claimed Everton don't give youth a chance and you were wrong.

I said giving them chances AND nurturing their talent. We have at times given them chances. I say at times because we did have the second Koeman season that turned into Big Sam. But nurturing the talent? Making the players better? I don't think we do that well and I'm not going to be dishonest and say we do because they're my club. I can support the team while being honest about it and we need to do better with player development full stop.

 

[Nymzee]

I said giving them chances AND nurturing their talent. We have at times given them chances. I say at times because we did have the second Koeman season that turned into Big Sam. But nurturing the talent? Making the players better? I don't think we do that well and I'm not going to be dishonest and say we do because they're my club. I can support the team while being honest about it and we need to do better with player development full stop.

Yeh we don't nurture talent whatsoever...

- We didn't nurture Rooney from darling teen till we sold him for £35m to United.
- We didn't nurture Barkley till we were forced to sell an England international for £15m after a horrendous injury.
- We didn't nurture Lukaku on an initial loan before eventually selling him on for maybe £90m in total.
- We didn't nurture Barnsley's £3m John Stones before eventually selling him to England's best team for £50m.
- We aren't currently nurturing DCL (£1.5m), Holgate (£1.25m), Davies (free) and Richarlison (£35m) who all, if sold, will go for a whole lot more than those fees.
2 of those being in the top 5 strikers in the league for goals under 25.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Yeh we don't nurture talent whatsoever...

- We didn't nurture Rooney from darling teen till we sold him for £35m to United.
- We didn't nurture Barkley till we were forced to sell an England international for £15m after a horrendous injury.
- We didn't nurture Lukaku on an initial loan before eventually selling him on for maybe £90m in total.
- We didn't nurture Barnsley's £3m John Stones before eventually selling him to the England's best team for £50m.
- We aren't currently nurturing DCL (£1.5m), Holgate (£1.25m), Davies (free) and Richarlison (£35m) who all, if sold, will go for a whole lot more than those fees. 2 of those being in the top 5 strikers in the league for goals under 25.

That's 7 players in the last decade! That isn't that good!

 

[Nymzee]

That's 7 players in the last decade! That isn't that good!

I think that certainly shows more than Mr 1-season in Salzburg Erling Haaland and Mr 2-seasons in Salzburg Sadio Mane, don't you?

 

[TheBigIguana]

I think that certainly shows more than Mr 1-season in Salzburg Erling Haaland and Mr 2-seasons in Salzburg Sadio Mane, don't you?

This is where the comparison starts to become silly. Because there is no real way for Salzburg to keep players. It is like how we couldn't keep Stones or Rom and see them to the end of their growth because City and United are too tempting except there's about 50 clubs that could fill that role.

FWIW I think that our player development is a big problem and so I'm very rarely going to side with us on the issue. I just think we stink at it and it is the number one thing holding us back.

I mean we have 7 in a decade. At some point Spurs had 7 of those type of player in their XI every week. That's how they elevated their club and we would be wise to see that as a path we could maybe emulate.

 

[Nymzee]

This is where the comparison starts to become silly. Because there is no real way for Salzburg to keep players. It is like how we couldn't keep Stones or Rom and see them to the end of their growth because City and United are too tempting except there's about 50 clubs that could fill that role.

FWIW I think that our player development is a big problem and so I'm very rarely going to side with us on the issue. I just think we stink at it and it is the number one thing holding us back.

I mean we have 7 in a decade. At some point Spurs had 7 of those type of player in their XI every week. That's how they elevated their club and we would be wise to see that as a path we could maybe emulate.

Why should that distort your theory? Surely you're saying neither of us can keep them which just backs up my previous list of players?