Current Affairs Donald Trump POS: Judgement cometh and that right soon

[DanEFC92]

Milo is honest lol

 

[SteveSC]

Me personally I just hope for more open honest dialogue, and more people identifying with neither side. We are individuals after all, it's not normal for everyone to have the same opinion on something.

...but then again centrism isn't as newsworthy as good-vs-evil.

I fear American politics will never get to this because of loyalty. The old school conservatives in the traditional red states who don't identify with the new modern alt right will always have blind loyalty to the Republican party. They will continue to ignore the news and always vote for their guys regardless of what they did. While the modern ones will vote for the new age divisive ones the ones like Moore. The traditional liberals will always side with the current democratic ideologies and ignore the Sanders types or anyone who wants to shift the party.

Their needs to be a shift on both side but that means getting rid of the constant name calling and fake news sh**. Both sides need condemn the childish behavior and denounce any racist behavior. They would have to simply stop being it us against them.

The only problem i see with that is the current administration will never allow that to happen. The left will simply not support the guy in office he is not capable and the republican party knows this as well but because they control everything they are happy to ignore it.

There will be a war on both sides if it continues. Bannon has made that clear that he will help fight out the old guard on the right and now the revelations on the left will force their hand also.

The issue is then getting the rest of your supporters online with this if needed to change. Not that i agree Bannon tactics are the answer and people should reject him.

 

[SteveSC]

Milo is honest lol

An Englishman with Greek parent/s and only a work visa in the US is the sane voice of the right haha!! I let that slide in my rebuttal haha!! No actual connection to the US and seemingly only interested in being a real life troll.

 

[dholliday]

Firstly why is inclusiveness divisive? Why do conservatives rail against inclusive policies.

It sounds like you can't compute the point I made.

The modern Left aren't inclusive because they push identity politics which almost all reasonable commentators say is divisive.

Milo is honest lol

He is when he's being serious. He trolls and makes bad abusive jokes to get attention.

I fear American politics will never get to this because of loyalty. The old school conservatives in the traditional red states who don't identify with the new modern alt right will always have blind loyalty to the Republican party. They will continue to ignore the news and always vote for their guys regardless of what they did. While the modern ones will vote for the new age divisive ones the ones like Moore. The traditional liberals will always side with the current democratic ideologies and ignore the Sanders types or anyone who wants to shift the party.

Their needs to be a shift on both side but that means getting rid of the constant name calling and fake news sh**. Both sides need condemn the childish behavior and denounce any racist behavior. They would have to simply stop being it us against them.

The only problem i see with that is the current administration will never allow that to happen. The left will simply not support the guy in office he is not capable and the republican party knows this as well but because they control everything they are happy to ignore it.

There will be a war on both sides if it continues. Bannon has made that clear that he will help fight out the old guard on the right and now the revelations on the left will force their hand also.

The issue is then getting the rest of your supporters online with this if needed to change. Not that i agree Bannon tactics are the answer and people should reject him.

Solid analysis that, mate.

 

[ilikecheese]

That depends on what you mean by "past". Some on the left would tweak around the edges, and some would burn it all down. Perhaps all this fear you perceive is of the state of nature that can be brought on by giving up the familiar beliefs and traditions of the recent past that have provided today's ease of living as opposed to earlier and much poorer cultures. Most of us have lost sight of how desperately poor most folks were before the advent of the rigors and afflictions of capitalism and modern technology. The world of 1914 was admittedly hidebound and traditional. Then they got to experience change.

I guess that's kinda the thing though. We are living in a time of vast wealth. Yet when I listen to conservative radio it's a dumpster fire the days we are living in.

I mean just in my adult lifetime the progress that has been made in our society with regards to the LGBT community has been massive as an example. Inclusiveness is a good thing in the land of the free where all men are created equal.

Conservatives are still fighting back on that progress. A lot don't view it as progress...and I don't understand why.

 

[SteveSC]

I guess that's kinda the thing though. We are living in a time of vast wealth. Yet when I listen to conservative radio it's a dumpster fire the days we are living in.

I mean just in my adult lifetime the progress that has been made in our society with regards to the LGBT community has been massive as an example. Inclusiveness is a good thing in the land of the free where all men are created equal.

Conservatives are still fighting back on that progress. A lot don't view it as progress...and I don't understand why.

Don't forget the guys on the right who are clearly bigots and anti LGBT continually get voted in to office. Why? Are conservatives so sticky about the bible and old school ways that they would vote for this. Is that progression as a nation and as a people? Why the right want to remain in the 50's is beyond me.

 

[ilikecheese]

It sounds like you can't compute the point I made.

The modern Left aren't inclusive because they push identity politics which almost all reasonable commentators say is divisive.




He is when he's being serious. He trolls and makes bad abusive jokes to get attention.




Solid analysis that, mate.

No I can't compute it apparently. I honestly can't. Please give me an example of these 'identity politics' that are meant to divide.

 

[dholliday]

I mean just in my adult lifetime the progress that has been made in our society with regards to the LGBT community has been massive as an example. Inclusiveness is a good thing in the land of the free where all men are created equal.

Conservatives are still fighting back on that progress. A lot don't view it as progress...and I don't understand why.

It's not as simple as you make it sound. Conservatives aren't fighting back on base freedoms (tho' I'm sure some are, like the strict religious and neo-cons) they're fighting back against the overweighted focus on identity: in the case of LGBTQI+ or however many letters it has now, it's the focus on trying to tell society what makes a man and what makes a woman.

This debate is interesting, Shapiro gets threatened by a beefy man claiming to be a woman because Shapiro will not accept he is female:



It's broadly this liberal-fascism which modern conservatives, and even traditional liberals, feel uncomfortable with.

 

[dholliday]

No I can't compute it apparently. I honestly can't. Please give me an example of these 'identity politics' that are meant to divide.

There are tens-of-thousands of further examples online in your favourite newspapers: The Guardian, Independent, Huff Post and the rest. Go to any article with a heavy focus on identity politics (e.g. there should be more black CEO's/women suffer a pay gap) and sort via most-recommended comments. There is a critical pattern there.

Also, note how writers with black or brown skin are often only allowed to write about race (mostly about how they are discriminated against), whereas their white peers can write about all manner of topics. See the same pattern when an article or interview is about a person with dark skin. Is this 'inclusive' or divisive?

This is a regressive form of racism which is celebrated by the Left, for they do not compute it as such.

 

[toffy]

Don't forget the guys on the right who are clearly bigots and anti LGBT continually get voted in to office. Why? Are conservatives so sticky about the bible and old school ways that they would vote for this. Is that progression as a nation and as a people? Why the right want to remain in the 50's is beyond me.

There is more to being voted in then ones stance on a certain issue. Some may well be against what you mention, however their stance on other issues may be what is appealing to some voters.

 

[SteveSC]

There is more to being voted in then ones stance on a certain issue. Some may well be against what you mention, however their stance on other issues may be what is appealing to some voters.

So you agree with bigots as long as they tackle issues? And people say America has a chance to change haha!! Never if people like you think bigots should be accepted.

Look at any of the blowhard bigots like Moore and you will see their entire platform is generally the same old rhetoric keep your jobs, get rid of illegal immigrants. That's what he ran on.

Look up just about any of the other guys Bannon supported and its similar.

And you guys wonder why the left are angry?

 

[ilikecheese]

It's not as simple as you make it sound. Conservatives aren't fighting back on base freedoms (tho' I'm sure some are, like the strict religious and neo-cons) they're fighting back against the overweighted focus on identity: in the case of LGBTQI+ or however many letters it has now, it's the focus on trying to tell society what makes a man and what makes a woman.

This debate is interesting, Shapiro gets threatened by a beefy man claiming to be a woman because Shapiro will not accept he is female:



It's broadly this liberal-fascism which modern conservatives, and even traditional liberals, feel uncomfortable with.

But why even be arsed if a person identifies as a different gender? The important thing is are they afforded the same rights as me? When I look at the trans debate from 10000 feet it's the exact same debate this country had with gays and black people...some folks still hold onto their prejudices, but thankfully most in society have accepted this change in the way we think. It took a lot of blood sweat and tears, but we're getting there.

Muslims are next, and if this country truly believes in it's ideals we will move on from that discussion as well.

 

[ilikecheese]

There are tens-of-thousands of further examples online in your favourite newspapers: The Guardian, Independent, Huff Post and the rest. Go to any article with a heavy focus on identity politics (e.g. there should be more black CEO's/women suffer a pay gap) and sort via most-recommended comments. There is a critical pattern there.

Also, note how writers with black or brown skin are often only allowed to write about race (mostly about how they are discriminated against), whereas their white peers can write about all manner of topics. See the same pattern when an article or interview is about a person with dark skin. Is this 'inclusive' or divisive?

This is a regressive form of racism which is celebrated by the Left, for they do not compute it as such.

Regressive racism? It wasn't long ago that black folks weren't allowed to right any articles.

Does the gender pay gap exist? Yes it does. Why not work to fix that...why is that divisive?

Should more black folks be CEO's? I have no idea. I haven't studied that. That said if qualified people are being overlooked simply because of the color of their skin then yeah...that's a problem that needs to be addressed. Doesn't seem divisive to me.

Perhaps the way the articles are written could be divisive. But the subjects certainly aren't.

 

[ilikecheese]

Regressive racism? It wasn't long ago that black folks weren't allowed to right any articles.

Does the gender pay gap exist? Yes it does. Why not work to fix that...why is that divisive?

Should more black folks be CEO's? I have no idea. I haven't studied that. That said if qualified people are being overlooked simply because of the color of their skin then yeah...that's a problem that needs to be addressed. Doesn't seem divisive to me.

Perhaps the way the articles are written could be divisive. But the subjects certainly aren't.

*write

 

[dholliday]

But why even be arsed if a person identifies as a different gender? The important thing is are they afforded the same rights as me?

But the debate isn't about rights, for those rights have been won. The debate is about pushing new definitions of identity on to the rest of society, and its possible consequences.

Are you arsed if a person believes in a flat Earth? Are you arsed if someone disagrees with that person? Are you arsed if the Flat-earther becomes influential in some way, say as a newspaper editor or even President? At some point, you have to be arsed if you want to be engaged in what society & identity means.

Ben Shapiro has the right to challenge the idea in the way that he did without being physically threatened. Especially knowing that post-op trans people are more at risk from depression and suicidal tendencies than the average person.