Current Affairs Donald Trump POS: Judgement cometh and that right soon

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No need to call them silly people. People want to clarify their opinion let them. Such protests can have an impact; it could possibly lead to a change of attitude of the domestic leaders towards the figure of protest. Maybe lessen the welcoming attitude or such.



Protests are good. At least that way you can somewhat see what's going on in your society and people believe in something. People don't protest about Zimbabwe because most people don't care. Change the UK voting system; of all the voting systems in the world it has to be one of the more ehm undemocratic ones. Won't happen because huge resistance to change.

Also why the sudden hate for protests, if I remember correctly you were all for protesting against the new vape laws.
Exactly. People don't care about a man literally killing anyone who stands against him, massively abuses his people to the point of starvation at times and is as evil as they come. But they do care that the fella off the apprentice is now president so let's all kick off about that.

This is my point. And how wouod protests against clinton be viewed if the boot was on the other foot? Genuine question that, if all the apparantly hackers and racists and bigots and stupid people got together to protest clinton, would it still be deemed sensible?
 
The democratic system is founded on discussion and disagreement.

Anyone saying protesters don't respect democracy have no idea what they're talking about. It doesn't matter whether you agree with the protesters. The have a fundamental right to complain and stand up and say they aren't happy.

Anything else is literally undemocratic.
Yes mate. Americans, English people don't, as they have zero involvement in the process.

All whilst their country is ran by someone not even voted for by her own party never mind the people of the country.
 
Yes mate. Americans, English people don't, as they have zero involvement in the process.

All whilst their country is ran by someone not even voted for by her own party never mind the people of the country.
It's a global world. America is the largest global player.

Trump affects you. Whether you want to admit it or not. Protesting him in your country is, at least, a warning to your politicians to not walk the same path.
 
It seems to be from an outside perspective that people aren't happy when the republicans win. When the Democrats win everything is fine and dandy and no issues at all. But when they lose its always a fix and even suggestions the Russians hacked the results and rigged it all.

There should be a case of put up and shut up now Trump has won. By all means express opinions and disagreement. Debate and whatever else about it, but don't protest it because you lost. Cry arse syndrome, because everything would have been fine and dandy if clinton had of won, there wouldn't be mass protests at that would there? It's hypocrisy in my eyes, protest when you lose and say silent when you win. Trump won, that should be the end of it, same as Cameron won and it was the end of it. I'm massively against the tories and yet I'm not planning protests against them, I'll use my vote against them come election time
Err, guess you missed the tea party protests that began in February 2009..
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

Were they just sore losers cryarsing? Or citizens expresding their displeasure at policies they disagreed with as is their constitutional right?
 
It's a global world. America is the largest global player.

Trump affects you. Whether you want to admit it or not. Protesting him in your country is, at least, a warning to your politicians to not walk the same path.
What path though? What he has done so far is what he said he would do. There isn't any shock factors so far, he wanted to build a wall and he is. He wanted to block immigration and he has. Point is he is doing exactly what he said whilst the entire United States of America elected him their leader.

He might affect me, but Ash from Liverpool who works in administration having a chant down by the docks one night is going to achieve nothing. Do you think Trump cares about it? I had no right to vote in that election so I'm not going to protest the result of it. If I had a vote, yes I'd vote clinton reluctantly, but I didn't. This is Americas issue and they can protest all they want to as it is their government and president. My thought on that is different sure but if Americans want to protest then that is fine for them to do. English people I believe should be turning their attentions to their own country before having a moan about another one. As I keep saying, Trump was democratically elected, may wasn't.
 
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Exactly. People don't care about a man literally killing anyone who stands against him, massively abuses his people to the point of starvation at times and is as evil as they come. But they do care that the fella off the apprentice is now president so let's all kick off about that.

This is my point. And how wouod protests against clinton be viewed if the boot was on the other foot? Genuine question that, if all the apparantly hackers and racists and bigots and stupid people got together to protest clinton, would it still be deemed sensible?

So basically your point is that there aren't enough protests? Also if Clinton was elected president you'd probably also see protesters.
 
What path though? What he has done so far is what he said he would do. There isn't any shock factors so far, he wanted to build a wall and he is. He wanted to block immigration and he has. Point is he is doing exactly what he said whilst the entire United States of America elected him their leader.

He might affect me, but Ash from Liverpool who works in administration having a chant down by the docks one night is going to achieve nothing. Do you think Trump cares about it? I had no right to vote in that election so I'm not going to protest the result of it. If I had a vote, yes I'd vote clinton reluctantly, but I didn't. This is Americas issue and they can protest all they want to as it is their government and president. My thought on that is different sure but if Americans want to protest then that is fine for them to do. English people I believe should be turning their attentions to their own country before having a moan about another one. As I keep saying, Trump was democratically elected, may wasn't.

Ash, I agree with you to a point. There are things happening in this country which pretty might go under the radar. Let's get out and protest that huge amounts of employment centres are closing.
 
The democratic system is founded on discussion and disagreement.

Anyone saying protesters don't respect democracy have no idea what they're talking about. It doesn't matter whether you agree with the protesters. The have a fundamental right to complain and stand up and say they aren't happy.

Anything else is literally undemocratic.

Agreed 100%.
 
What path though? What he has done so far is what he said he would do. There isn't any shock factors so far, he wanted to build a wall and he is. He wanted to block immigration and he has. Point is he is doing exactly what he said whilst the entire United States of America elected him their leader.

No shock factors?
This is lifted from FB
Heather Richardson
21 hrs ·


I don't like to talk about politics on Facebook-- political history is my job, after all, and you are my friends-- but there is an important non-partisan point to make today.

What Bannon is doing, most dramatically with last night's ban on immigration from seven predominantly Muslim countries-- is creating what is known as a "shock event." Such an event is unexpected and confusing and throws a society into chaos. People scramble to react to the event, usually along some fault line that those responsible for the event can widen by claiming that they alone know how to restore order. When opponents speak out, the authors of the shock event call them enemies. As society reels and tempers run high, those responsible for the shock event perform a sleight of hand to achieve their real goal, a goal they know to be hugely unpopular, but from which everyone has been distracted as they fight over the initial event. There is no longer concerted opposition to the real goal; opposition divides along the partisan lines established by the shock event.

Last night's Executive Order has all the hallmarks of a shock event. It was not reviewed by any governmental agencies or lawyers before it was released, and counterterrorism experts insist they did not ask for it. People charged with enforcing it got no instructions about how to do so. Courts immediately have declared parts of it unconstitutional, but border police in some airports are refusing to stop enforcing it.

Predictably, chaos has followed and tempers are hot.

My point today is this: unless you are the person setting it up, it is in no one's interest to play the shock event game. It is designed explicitly to divide people who might otherwise come together so they cannot stand against something its authors think they won't like. I don't know what Bannon is up to-- although I have some guesses-- but because I know Bannon's ideas well, I am positive that there is not a single person whom I consider a friend on either side of the aisle-- and my friends range pretty widely-- who will benefit from whatever it is. If the shock event strategy works, though, many of you will blame each other, rather than Bannon, for the fallout. And the country will have been tricked into accepting their real goal.

But because shock events destabilize a society, they can also be used positively. We do not have to respond along old fault lines. We could just as easily reorganize into a different pattern that threatens the people who sparked the event. A successful shock event depends on speed and chaos because it requires knee-jerk reactions so that people divide along established lines. This, for example, is how Confederate leaders railroaded the initial southern states out of the Union. If people realize they are being played, though, they can reach across old lines and reorganize to challenge the leaders who are pulling the strings. This was Lincoln's strategy when he joined together Whigs, Democrats, Free-Soilers, anti-Nebraska voters, and nativists into the new Republican Party to stand against the Slave Power. Five years before, such a coalition would have been unimaginable. Members of those groups agreed on very little other than that they wanted all Americans to have equal economic opportunity. Once they began to work together to promote a fair economic system, though, they found much common ground. They ended up rededicating the nation to a "government of the people, by the people, and for the people."

Confederate leaders and Lincoln both knew about the political potential of a shock event. As we are in the midst of one, it seems worth noting that Lincoln seemed to have the better idea about how to use it.
 
Err, guess you missed the tea party protests that began in February 2009..
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

Were they just sore losers cryarsing? Or citizens expresding their displeasure at policies they disagreed with as is their constitutional right?
Cry arsing yes if they lost at the election. No different which side protests everything they didn't want

But my point is there is a difference between protesting with a voice and protesting simply because it didn't end up the way you wanted. Protest against Trump's policies yes, protest he got the job? No. It is hard to describe on a forum what I mean, I fully support people making their voice heard when they disagree with actual context and reason. For example protesting against the wall, by all means do that. You disagree with that policy then speak up, but it's the general we don't want Trump protest that I'm getting at, United and intelligent protest at actual government actions is the right way to go about things. Doing the we don't want Trump protests isn't.
 
What path though? What he has done so far is what he said he would do. There isn't any shock factors so far, he wanted to build a wall and he is. He wanted to block immigration and he has. Point is he is doing exactly what he said whilst the entire United States of America elected him their leader.

He might affect me, but Ash from Liverpool who works in administration having a chant down by the docks one night is going to achieve nothing. Do you think Trump cares about it? I had no right to vote in that election so I'm not going to protest the result of it. If I had a vote, yes I'd vote clinton reluctantly, but I didn't. This is Americas issue and they can protest all they want to as it is their government and president. My thought on that is different sure but if Americans want to protest then that is fine for them to do. English people I believe should be turning their attentions to their own country before having a moan about another one. As I keep saying, Trump was democratically elected, may wasn't.
Yeah...but this is bigger than that. It's really not an American issue. It affects British citizens. It affects citizens from all over the world.

Ash from Liverpool might achieve nothing, but when combined with John from Leicester, Gabriel from Puerto Vallarta, Jennifer from Santa Clara, Haruto from Kyoto, and literally millions of other voices, things can happen.

We have been weaned away from power for a long time, comfort keeping us paralyzed from marching for the rights of the under privileged. But it doesn't have to be so. We can stand up, disagree, and try to improve the world.

If we disagree, we shouldn't just throw our hands up and say, well - you won, you get to do whatever you want. That's not how democracy works, or has ever worked. We continue to argue, debate, disagree, and cajole. We work for what we believe and work to make the world a better place.

When faced with something I find utterly opposed to that...you're damn right I'm going to protest. I'm going to make my voice heard. I'm going to know that I did something for what I believed, and showed my kids that you stand up to power, not back down in face of it. I refuse to bend to authority simply because of the tautology that authority is right because it's authority.

He won. With 50 million votes in a country of 318 million - that's not a mandate. My fellow citizens do not stand united behind Trump. And even if they did - that doesn't make it right.

To scoff at protesters because it's meaningless....man, I'm actually a nihilist and I find that a bleak world view.
 
Err, guess you missed the tea party protests that began in February 2009..
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

Were they just sore losers cryarsing? Or citizens expresding their displeasure at policies they disagreed with as is their constitutional right?

Some were, most weren't. Some had an agenda of their own. All cleaned up before they left.

I like that. That's a big way they made their point.

9-12-posr-rally2.jpg


It all comes down to the kind of impression the protest leaves when it is over. If it is just an exercise in making the protesters feel better, it can lead to outcomes that work against the intent of many who turn out. In the end, it comes down to whether and how it gets reported. There are lots of folks on the right side of things comparing and contrasting the Women's March with the subsequent March for Life through their own media networks. They understand that the old line media is lost for the foreseeable future.

As they used to ask in the hollers of West Virginia, which side are you on? That's the question. From time to time, it comes down to this, and that's where we are. This is just getting started, too.
 
So basically your point is that there aren't enough protests? Also if Clinton was elected president you'd probably also see protesters.
Not like this though, and certainly not overseas.

I'm saying people should use their voice on issues that matter more in this world. So many worse things happen in different countries that as you say, no one cares about. Trump wins and everyone protests, a leader in a country elsewhere in the world abuses their people and people stay silent about it. I don't agree with that thought process. Why doesn't people care about the people of these other countries? Why don't people speak up for them?


Ash, I agree with you to a point. There are things happening in this country which pretty might go under the radar. Let's get out and protest that huge amounts of employment centres are closing.

Or like the NHS being run into the ground? Or homeless funding halving, or the many other actual significant issues in this country that people moan about and don't do anything to speak up over.

No shock factors?
This is lifted from FB
Heather Richardson
21 hrs ·


I don't like to talk about politics on Facebook-- political history is my job, after all, and you are my friends-- but there is an important non-partisan point to make today.

What Bannon is doing, most dramatically with last night's ban on immigration from seven predominantly Muslim countries-- is creating what is known as a "shock event." Such an event is unexpected and confusing and throws a society into chaos. People scramble to react to the event, usually along some fault line that those responsible for the event can widen by claiming that they alone know how to restore order. When opponents speak out, the authors of the shock event call them enemies. As society reels and tempers run high, those responsible for the shock event perform a sleight of hand to achieve their real goal, a goal they know to be hugely unpopular, but from which everyone has been distracted as they fight over the initial event. There is no longer concerted opposition to the real goal; opposition divides along the partisan lines established by the shock event.

Last night's Executive Order has all the hallmarks of a shock event. It was not reviewed by any governmental agencies or lawyers before it was released, and counterterrorism experts insist they did not ask for it. People charged with enforcing it got no instructions about how to do so. Courts immediately have declared parts of it unconstitutional, but border police in some airports are refusing to stop enforcing it.

Predictably, chaos has followed and tempers are hot.

My point today is this: unless you are the person setting it up, it is in no one's interest to play the shock event game. It is designed explicitly to divide people who might otherwise come together so they cannot stand against something its authors think they won't like. I don't know what Bannon is up to-- although I have some guesses-- but because I know Bannon's ideas well, I am positive that there is not a single person whom I consider a friend on either side of the aisle-- and my friends range pretty widely-- who will benefit from whatever it is. If the shock event strategy works, though, many of you will blame each other, rather than Bannon, for the fallout. And the country will have been tricked into accepting their real goal.

But because shock events destabilize a society, they can also be used positively. We do not have to respond along old fault lines. We could just as easily reorganize into a different pattern that threatens the people who sparked the event. A successful shock event depends on speed and chaos because it requires knee-jerk reactions so that people divide along established lines. This, for example, is how Confederate leaders railroaded the initial southern states out of the Union. If people realize they are being played, though, they can reach across old lines and reorganize to challenge the leaders who are pulling the strings. This was Lincoln's strategy when he joined together Whigs, Democrats, Free-Soilers, anti-Nebraska voters, and nativists into the new Republican Party to stand against the Slave Power. Five years before, such a coalition would have been unimaginable. Members of those groups agreed on very little other than that they wanted all Americans to have equal economic opportunity. Once they began to work together to promote a fair economic system, though, they found much common ground. They ended up rededicating the nation to a "government of the people, by the people, and for the people."

Confederate leaders and Lincoln both knew about the political potential of a shock event. As we are in the midst of one, it seems worth noting that Lincoln seemed to have the better idea about how to use it.

And that is a example of people going 'I didn't think he would actually do it'. The whole immigration thing that has happened was poorly executed yes. They clearly didn't think it through and the end result is actually quite bad in all honesty for the ripple effects it causes. But he did say he was going to close borders, and he is doing just that. He kept his word on that promise, so going back to the original point, the man democratically elected to president is doing what he said he was going to do and to be fair that is quite decent of him to follow through on his promise. Whether he is right to do it or not is a different story but the USA voted that policy in essentially, so it happening is what the country wanted
 
No shock factors?
This is lifted from FB
Heather Richardson
21 hrs ·


I don't like to talk about politics on Facebook-- political history is my job, after all, and you are my friends-- but there is an important non-partisan point to make today.

What Bannon is doing, most dramatically with last night's ban on immigration from seven predominantly Muslim countries-- is creating what is known as a "shock event." Such an event is unexpected and confusing and throws a society into chaos. People scramble to react to the event, usually along some fault line that those responsible for the event can widen by claiming that they alone know how to restore order. When opponents speak out, the authors of the shock event call them enemies. As society reels and tempers run high, those responsible for the shock event perform a sleight of hand to achieve their real goal, a goal they know to be hugely unpopular, but from which everyone has been distracted as they fight over the initial event. There is no longer concerted opposition to the real goal; opposition divides along the partisan lines established by the shock event.

Last night's Executive Order has all the hallmarks of a shock event. It was not reviewed by any governmental agencies or lawyers before it was released, and counterterrorism experts insist they did not ask for it. People charged with enforcing it got no instructions about how to do so. Courts immediately have declared parts of it unconstitutional, but border police in some airports are refusing to stop enforcing it.

Predictably, chaos has followed and tempers are hot.

My point today is this: unless you are the person setting it up, it is in no one's interest to play the shock event game. It is designed explicitly to divide people who might otherwise come together so they cannot stand against something its authors think they won't like. I don't know what Bannon is up to-- although I have some guesses-- but because I know Bannon's ideas well, I am positive that there is not a single person whom I consider a friend on either side of the aisle-- and my friends range pretty widely-- who will benefit from whatever it is. If the shock event strategy works, though, many of you will blame each other, rather than Bannon, for the fallout. And the country will have been tricked into accepting their real goal.

But because shock events destabilize a society, they can also be used positively. We do not have to respond along old fault lines. We could just as easily reorganize into a different pattern that threatens the people who sparked the event. A successful shock event depends on speed and chaos because it requires knee-jerk reactions so that people divide along established lines. This, for example, is how Confederate leaders railroaded the initial southern states out of the Union. If people realize they are being played, though, they can reach across old lines and reorganize to challenge the leaders who are pulling the strings. This was Lincoln's strategy when he joined together Whigs, Democrats, Free-Soilers, anti-Nebraska voters, and nativists into the new Republican Party to stand against the Slave Power. Five years before, such a coalition would have been unimaginable. Members of those groups agreed on very little other than that they wanted all Americans to have equal economic opportunity. Once they began to work together to promote a fair economic system, though, they found much common ground. They ended up rededicating the nation to a "government of the people, by the people, and for the people."

Confederate leaders and Lincoln both knew about the political potential of a shock event. As we are in the midst of one, it seems worth noting that Lincoln seemed to have the better idea about how to use it.
I can't argue with any of this. This is a densepack strategy of outrage clustering. The outrages arrive so fast, one on top of another, that the opposition is reduced to screaming in the streets rather than raising a coherent opposition. That's exactly what's happening.

Bannon has Alinsky's playbook in his hip pocket. The left isn't used to dealing with that from the right. These comments are very aware of what's up.
 
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