Gracias, comrade.
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Gracias, comrade.
Yikes, this was getting hot and heavy. Not what I envisioned when I joined a couple days back! It's somewhat personal though as I must suffer through my mom's calls to Cuba that end in tears where my uncle describes his ailments & pains (he's 90) amongst other things and then people trying to tell of the wonderous Cuban health care system...
I will promise to stay clear of any more Cuba-talk from here on out!Toffee-talk for me from now on!
By all means mate, continue it. I'd just suggest more indepth discussion in the Ale House forum
sotnas
Player Valuation: £10m
By all means mate, continue it. I'd just suggest more indepth discussion in the Ale House forum
So you're giving us fuel to burn the room next door...
Yikes, this was getting hot and heavy. Not what I envisioned when I joined a couple days back! It's somewhat personal though as I must suffer through my mom's calls to Cuba that end in tears where my uncle describes his ailments & pains (he's 90) amongst other things and then people trying to tell of the wonderous Cuban health care system...
I will promise to stay clear of any more Cuba-talk from here on out!
No it's ok mate, continue with it. If GrandOldTeam permits of course?
I'm sorry to hear of your uncle's suffering, I really am but 90 years old in a supposed backwards country? Wow, must be poor healthcare then?
I've had first hand experience of the Cuban healthcare system and it's not as bad as you're assuming mate.
S
SoCalMike
Guest
So, how's it looking for Landon making a permanent move?
Chico, do you mean the same U.N. that punishes Israel for it's aggressions countering terrorism while omitting the fact that 2000+ missles come raining down on that country? Please, let's not get political here, look if I ever have the pleasure attend an Everton match I'll look for the blue Che Guevara shirts amongst the crowd, most likely I'll be running into you then...
sotnas
Player Valuation: £10m
Getting soft, aren't we?b)
The US media have done an incredible job on you mate with all due respect. It's the UN and you shouldn't flout it's rulings. I have both Israeli and Palestinian friends so could argue either.
The problem with the Cuba thing is that you're shooting from one side of the fence, without experiencing how things really are there. I'm lucky enough to have many Cuban friends.
Good call on the blue Guevara shirts though. Partisan: what do you think?
By all means mate, continue it. I'd just suggest more indepth discussion in the Ale House forum
This Chico-jacked thread is brought to by Partisan sponsor:
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This Chico-jacked thread is brought to by Partisan sponsor:
Breakfast of Champion Fussballers everywhere.
Good work comrade.
S
SoCalMike
Guest
Originally wrote this as a PM to chicoazul, but since I'm a noobie member I couldn't send it. Instead, I'll post it here:
Not sure what 'D-dog debate tactics' quite means, but Cuba is a bit of a sore point to me. My family was ripped in half due to Castro. My father was finishing up at Havana Medical School, just finishing his internship when the revolution happened. Because he was 4-yr roomate with the son of the mayor of Havana at that time, when he went to leave they destroyed his medical school records. He literally came to the U.S. with nothing.
My mother was briefly jailed because my uncle (another one, not the one I was referring to that is still in Cuba) had tried to assassinate a young castro when he was jailed in the Isle of Pines during the mid-'50s. He was literally Batista's bodyguard and right-hand man, and was sent to kill Castro by poisoning his food. The cook though was a sympathizer with Castro and tipped him off to not eat his food that night. When Castro took power one of the first things he did was send a group of sympathizers to his house to execute him, but he had fled to the Venezuelan embassy knowing that they'd be after him. I fear my mother would have also been executed, but fortunately she was friends with a high police official that recognized her and saw her locked up and told her to flee.
I often question my mom about Cuba, because I'm curious if they are biased since the trauma that they obviously suffered when the revolution happened. I know that they are very biased, so many of their interpretations of things I take with a grain of salt. My relatives though are currently living there, they detail in email after email the hardships they endure, from not having enough to eat, to their electricity constantly going out, to their lack of such basics as soap, toilet paper, toothpaste, etc...
Anyways, I truly didn't expect to be going into all of this here on an Everton forum lol, I have tried to learn as much as I can about Cuba's history and past but find that some of the documentaries that are out there, and writings are wrong. My family has lived through it, and although they may be deeply affected enough to slant their views against Castro they still can describe how life was before as opposed to how life is currently is in Cuba.
No hard feelings though, I'd love to share a beer sometime and maybe discuss other things than Cuba or politics
chicoazul said:Cheers dude, and the great thing is you're picturing the exact same things in your head as me.
He's nailed the hospital standards though, they're a bit awful, so I'm trying to swerve around that but it helps that he's never seen them.
I'm learning D-dog debate tactics here.
GrandOldTeam said:Moved it all here;
http://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/ale-house/26243-cuba-discussion-moved-donovan-thread.html
Interesting to read, please carry it on there
Not sure what 'D-dog debate tactics' quite means, but Cuba is a bit of a sore point to me. My family was ripped in half due to Castro. My father was finishing up at Havana Medical School, just finishing his internship when the revolution happened. Because he was 4-yr roomate with the son of the mayor of Havana at that time, when he went to leave they destroyed his medical school records. He literally came to the U.S. with nothing.
My mother was briefly jailed because my uncle (another one, not the one I was referring to that is still in Cuba) had tried to assassinate a young castro when he was jailed in the Isle of Pines during the mid-'50s. He was literally Batista's bodyguard and right-hand man, and was sent to kill Castro by poisoning his food. The cook though was a sympathizer with Castro and tipped him off to not eat his food that night. When Castro took power one of the first things he did was send a group of sympathizers to his house to execute him, but he had fled to the Venezuelan embassy knowing that they'd be after him. I fear my mother would have also been executed, but fortunately she was friends with a high police official that recognized her and saw her locked up and told her to flee.
I often question my mom about Cuba, because I'm curious if they are biased since the trauma that they obviously suffered when the revolution happened. I know that they are very biased, so many of their interpretations of things I take with a grain of salt. My relatives though are currently living there, they detail in email after email the hardships they endure, from not having enough to eat, to their electricity constantly going out, to their lack of such basics as soap, toilet paper, toothpaste, etc...
Anyways, I truly didn't expect to be going into all of this here on an Everton forum lol, I have tried to learn as much as I can about Cuba's history and past but find that some of the documentaries that are out there, and writings are wrong. My family has lived through it, and although they may be deeply affected enough to slant their views against Castro they still can describe how life was before as opposed to how life is currently is in Cuba.
No hard feelings though, I'd love to share a beer sometime and maybe discuss other things than Cuba or politics
Great post mate. And you have every right to debate it due to the wonderful family history there, and granted that will make you have your views.
I've spent quite a lot of time there too (Cuba requires trading law compliance experience from foreigners, lucky me) so have my side on it too. I've been lucky to travel and visit every single province and had many mad nights fuelled by nothing more than a bottle of rum and some friends. The biggest compliment I can give it is that the people are as beautiful as the country, and the island is the most stunning I've visited. I went into it open eyed and took it for what it was - as with every system there are pros and cons.
I've met quite a few Cuban Americans all over Latin America and had similar debates when they found out I had spent time there. It's easy for me to debate it but then I'm similarly handicapped as I don't have the memories and history of a family to put into what is already a very raw issue both in an out of the country.
Who knows what the future holds but all I want is for the nicest set of people I've met to have a happy future, not that the present is bad at all. Like I mentioned, I found a similar set of outstandingly warm people in America so it's just a crying shame that all this exists. The mood in Cuba when Obama came in was that maybe things could move but that's the over optimism of most. The process needs to start little by little and irrelevant of politics, Cuba is what it is and just seeks acceptance for it, it bears no hostility to Americans which most people find surprising. I've bumped into many Americans travelling in Havana who have come via somewhere else and they're always made to feel welcome.
Politics eh? Look forward to that rum, and you can screw Bacardi!
I've spent quite a lot of time there too (Cuba requires trading law compliance experience from foreigners, lucky me) so have my side on it too. I've been lucky to travel and visit every single province and had many mad nights fuelled by nothing more than a bottle of rum and some friends. The biggest compliment I can give it is that the people are as beautiful as the country, and the island is the most stunning I've visited. I went into it open eyed and took it for what it was - as with every system there are pros and cons.
I've met quite a few Cuban Americans all over Latin America and had similar debates when they found out I had spent time there. It's easy for me to debate it but then I'm similarly handicapped as I don't have the memories and history of a family to put into what is already a very raw issue both in an out of the country.
Who knows what the future holds but all I want is for the nicest set of people I've met to have a happy future, not that the present is bad at all. Like I mentioned, I found a similar set of outstandingly warm people in America so it's just a crying shame that all this exists. The mood in Cuba when Obama came in was that maybe things could move but that's the over optimism of most. The process needs to start little by little and irrelevant of politics, Cuba is what it is and just seeks acceptance for it, it bears no hostility to Americans which most people find surprising. I've bumped into many Americans travelling in Havana who have come via somewhere else and they're always made to feel welcome.
Politics eh? Look forward to that rum, and you can screw Bacardi!
S
SoCalMike
Guest
Yeah, I thought the one thing Obama could help do is normalize relations with Cuba. It looks like each country made some types of minor advancements, but then retreated on those and it's back to square one. Well, there are some direct flights from L.A. to Cuba that have resumed, but that is about it that I've seen.
My mom is wanting to go back to see her brother and I'm very torn about going. I so want to see the country I've heard so much about, but have never been. Even my son has gone, my sister was born there but I've never visited and I do so want to meet my relatives. My grandfather though refused to go and ended up dying without ever seeing his son again, I have inherited some of his Andalusian Spanish hot-bloodedness and had promised to him I would never go as long as the regime stayed in power. But I'm torn.
It's good to know though that the spirit of the Cuban people remains, that they still relish the simple things of sitting on their veranda's sipping rum with the cool ocean breeze on starry nights. It sounds like you enjoyed your travels there, perhaps one day we can swap stories of our visits. One day, perhaps soon...
I'll drink to that!
My mom is wanting to go back to see her brother and I'm very torn about going. I so want to see the country I've heard so much about, but have never been. Even my son has gone, my sister was born there but I've never visited and I do so want to meet my relatives. My grandfather though refused to go and ended up dying without ever seeing his son again, I have inherited some of his Andalusian Spanish hot-bloodedness and had promised to him I would never go as long as the regime stayed in power. But I'm torn.
It's good to know though that the spirit of the Cuban people remains, that they still relish the simple things of sitting on their veranda's sipping rum with the cool ocean breeze on starry nights. It sounds like you enjoyed your travels there, perhaps one day we can swap stories of our visits. One day, perhaps soon...
I'll drink to that!
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Yeah, I thought the one thing Obama could help do is normalize relations with Cuba. It looks like each country made some types of minor advancements, but then retreated on those and it's back to square one. Well, there are some direct flights from L.A. to Cuba that have resumed, but that is about it that I've seen.
My mom is wanting to go back to see her brother and I'm very torn about going. I so want to see the country I've heard so much about, but have never been. Even my son has gone, my sister was born there but I've never visited and I do so want to meet my relatives. My grandfather though refused to go and ended up dying without ever seeing his son again, I have inherited some of his Andalusian Spanish hot-bloodedness and had promised to him I would never go as long as the regime stayed in power. But I'm torn.
It's good to know though that the spirit of the Cuban people remains, that they still relish the simple things of sitting on their veranda's sipping rum with the cool ocean breeze on starry nights. It sounds like you enjoyed your travels there, perhaps one day we can swap stories of our visits. One day, perhaps soon...
I'll drink to that!
I would love to pal. I'll hold you to that.
Obviously it's a personal thing and the respecting the wishes of your family are to be paramount but you should definitely go and visit, if the politics isn't for you then that's fine but it would enlighten you a bit although I can understand why your family would have those views, it must have been horrendous to split the family like that. More and more Cuban Americans go for a visit, the Obama administration is making that easier. What part of Cuba are your family from?
The Cuban revolution was built upon resolve and togetherness. You'll find this in massive amounts there, along with some of the best genuine hospitality I've come across. You'll love it and no doubt understand it better than an gringo ever could.
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