*Puts kiwi hat back on - well done to the lads
The Aussies can do a batting collapse with the best of them just lately and their bowlers are not the demons thrry were 5yrs ago neither
Cricket
- Thread starter summerisle
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The Aussies can do a batting collapse with the best of them just lately and their bowlers are not the demons thrry were 5yrs ago neither
In fairness though I didn't suggest building an attack around him. I think his bowling style and speeds would suit playing away more, particularly on the hard Aussie pitches. You want to keep him and Archer fresh so some rotation and maybe both together at Perth works. As has been noted, he's actually a pretty competent lower order bat as well.
The big issue is with the batting. I think they are in real trouble, as they've made a big investment in the likes of Pope, Crawley, Sibley, Lawrence etc and are just not getting much back. I do get the Malan and Bairstow shouts but I also think, those lads have played and failed in Australia already. Is Dawid Malan going to be getting any better at 34? Is Johnny Bairstow at 32? It is going to be quite an admission to have to go back to those players but there's no doubtthe door has been opened by the younger players who just haven't settled down.
My view is try to stick with them but not Sibley. I saw Bumble in the Mail today, and he rightly stated that Sibley hasn't got any scoring shots, but is also not watertight in defence. I'd say with the added bounce in Australia those flaws in his technique will become exacerbated. He is going to have lads bowling 85+ mph, in the channel outside off stump bouncing steeply. To me his technique is just not right. Indeed I have reservations about Burns off the back foot too but I mean honestly how long have you got in terms of trying to rebuild?
I think Lawrence, Crawley and Pope it is not so much an issue of technique but mentality. You kind of hope that clicks into place quicker. I've seen innings all 3 have played and thought "he looks a nice player" but that being said, Pope has played 19 tests and has an average of 31.5. I don't think there are many guys who go on to be great test players if they haven't got it right after 20 tests. So it is a concern.
Even Archer has big question marks against him for me. He's played 6 games in the last 2 years with 12 wickets. Anderson has 40 wickets from 12 games, despite being rotated to keep him fresh. Broad similarly has been rotated a fair bit and yet has 47 wickets from 13 games. Neither Wood nor Archer have shown they can replicate the kind of output of two quick bowlers who should ordinarily be putting their slippers on.
The fact that we're turning to guys like Malan and Bairstow is hugely worrying as we're relying on people who have failed consistently to miraculously come good. I'm just not sure the County game is preparing players for international cricket any more. I've been an Essex follower since the Gooch era, and much of our recent success has been built on pitches that suit trundlers like Porter and Harmer's spin. Neither of those two is ever going to play for England so it seems pointless. In 9 games the team has amassed just 5 hundreds and you can't really claim that's due to facing world class bowlers. We just have an utter dearth of batting in the county game.
Yes I agree with almost all of that.
I think Archer lost his way a bit last summer, but he looks (like Wood) like he will be a real handful on Australian pitches. I don't think England have used him sensibly, and had a spell bowling him into the ground. There is also thins thing with England where they seem to want someone to be "the enforcer". Broad did it for a bit. Wood has done it recently. Archer and Stokes have also been expected to do it. I don't understand it. All of the above look a lot better when they try and pitch the ball up, swing it and bowl to hit off stump. Just because you bowl quickly doesn't mean you need to bowl short.
As for the batsman, yes exactly. The County game is a big problem really. It's not getting people ready for test match cricket, and this is why players get elevated into test cricket early as in honesty there is a limited amount you can learn in the county game. Say what you want about Bracey and Lawrence, but on an A tour to Australia recently they scored massive runs and were part of 1 of the 1st England teams to win an A tour in Australia. So they are amongst the most talented players in that age group, but they are just not prepared to play top level cricket from the county game. I suppose part of the answer would be for these lads to go and play club and first class cricket abroad, but with the advent of the IPL at the like, you just don't get that time. So players like Bracey and Lawrence/Crawley are learning on the job. Crawley has played just over 50 first class games. Bracey has 47. Is it really enough?
And I should add that while I'm not sold on Wood and Archer yet, our bowling (spin aside) is really the least of our problems. It's the batting that is the real issue as we just don't get big scores any more, especially when Joe Root doesn't get a big one. I don't know what the answer is. Instinctively your point makes sense, but then you have someone like AB de Villiers who made just 27 FC games in his entire career. The connection was broken somewhat when you had Vaughan and Trescothick having excellent test careers despite (until that point) very modest county careers. You wonder if that's why selectors are looking at limited overs matches or just gut feel to judge players, and it's perhaps why we're looking at Malan despite an average of just 38 in the county game. That he averages just 27 after 15 test matches seems irrelevant. The sad reality seems to be that in the long-form of the game the cupboard is incredibly bare.
Yes that's a fair actually and the counter point. I do sense that Australia and New Zealand to name 2 use their first class system to prepare players better than we do.
We have gambled on a number of younger players from the FC game, and few have come off. You look at Hameeb, Jennings, Ducket as some of the others who have played a few games, got found out and gone back to County cricket.
Even Burns, who scores mountains of runs in the 1st class game looks unlikely to score big on bouncy wickets. But then he doesnt play much on bouncy wickets in the county game. That's my prediction for the year though, Burns to be woefully found out in Australia.
Aye, we've burned through so many batsman in the last decade as the likes of Cook, KP, and Bell have retired, and we haven't really replaced any of them. You look at the CC last year and Sibley had comfortably the best average of those who had played a decent number of games. Then you had Sam Hain, who while the right age only averages 35 so is surely not the answer, and Sam Northeast, who is 31 and also averages under 40 over his career. After that, the only players to average over 40 (playing over 15 games) were Ballance and Cook. Who on earth do you turn to when you have just 5 English players averaging over 40 across the whole season, and 3 of them are over 30?
Dan Lawrence averaged 38 with 1 hundred in 22 matches. Zak Crawley was 34 with 2 hundreds and a top score of 111 from 24 games (he averages 31.91 in first class cricket ffs!). There's just no one sticking their hand up and saying you have to pick me.
Toffee in Jandals
Player Valuation: £35m
The Aussies are pretty good at demoralizing sides on their own turf that are low on confidence, in spite of any possible flaws in their own game. I just don't think the current English side have the confidence, cajones, if you will, to go toe to toe with them. They need the likes of Stokes to really stand up, like a Botham or Flintoff of yesteryear.
Yes and the issue is the skills Sibley needs to excel in the CC are different to international level. He clearly has a lot of mental strength and doesnt take many risks. Facing lads bowling at 80mph he is ok. Crank that up a bit, play bowlers with speed and bounce and mental strength alone isnt enough.
Northeast has really missed the boat. I think Englands strategy is essentially a decent one, you have to pluck the most talented young players out, and hope some adapt to cricket at a higher level. Unfortunately thus far it doesnt look like Lawrence, Pope or Crawley are kicking on much yet. There is probably 45 tests between them, so still early on, but youd be hoping to see some more consistency. Hopefully for Englands case they start to kick into gear before this years Ashes, but India will be tough and Australia is very challenging.
I listened to some of the Rose's match when it was on, and there was a lot of tall about more wickets like OT. With pace, bounce but also not too green or soft etc. So you have to work hard for your wickets and if you are a decent player you can score big. Theres just not enough of those.
summerisle
The rain, it raineth every day
Flintoff lost 5-0 whilst captain in Australia, very much a home player.
Toffee in Jandals
Player Valuation: £35m
Freddie was a bit of a lad though wasn't he. Hardly captaincy material. He probably spent 75% of that tour in the pub.
summerisle
The rain, it raineth every day
Playing Derbyshire tonight, who are batting, excellent start, currently 9-2, 2 overs.
summerisle
The rain, it raineth every day
Derbyshire 136-3 16 overs.
172-3 off 18. Gonna be some total this