Cricket

[Chris O'Connor]

I don't think I'm really the hang them, flog them type whatever that is. I've defended Dan Lawrence on here. He's a young man, learning and I thought he did really well today. Batting at 3, in our 4th match takes real courage. There are positives.

It's obviously a very hard pitch, as it will be. Like we said yesterday, winning in India is hard, winning in India is almost impossible. You're playing the best team in the world, in their conditions, and getting 2nd use of them. It should be hard. So you are looking at performances.

I thought Alli and Leach bowled really well yesterday, a big positive.

Rohit batted wonderfully, but what he did was constantly look to put the pressure on England. He rode his luck too, but he was always scoring at a rate that ensured he was transferring pressure back to England. I think Pants innings in it's own way was just as important. Faced a similar amount of balls to Foakes, yet scored double the runs. It put real pressure back onto England.

I think you learn a lot from matches like this. If you want to be the best in the world, which England in my view should always aspire to be, you need to find batsman who can attack the opponents, even at the top of the innings. Burns certainly isn't that, and in truth neither is Sibley. I'd like to see Crawley and Bairstow come in for the last 2 games, asplayers who- like Rohit can put opponents under pressure.

They miss Buttler on a day like this. Foakes has played nicely, but having Buttler who can score quickly would have made a difference. There's probably a case for both of them.

As a final aside, I'm very impressed with Leach's application with his batting again here.

If you believe the rankings then NZ are the best side in the world (I don't and never have - far too imperfect to act as anything but a very rough guide, so many unmatched variables :- tests played unmatched, how many against which opposition unmatched, home and away percentages not accounted for - has to be historical by nature admittedly but hardly any like for like comparisons at all)

There are performances you look at, but if England actually were the best in the world and played India in identical circumstances as here, (all other things being equal), then losing the 50/50 toss would still have made it immensely difficult and I really don't think the result would be very different at all tbh

So if they do eventually become such a side I would expect largely the same outcome tbh

 

[ste d' indica]

Absolutely fierce session from India that.

 

[catcherintherye]

If you believe the rankings then NZ are the best side in the world (I don't and never have - far too imperfect to act as anything but a very rough guide, so many unmatched variables :- tests played unmatched, how many against which opposition unmstched, home and away percentages not accounted for - has to be historical by nature admittedly but hardly any like for like comparisons at all)

There are performances yo look at but if England actually we're the best in the world and played India in identical circumstances as here (all other things being equal) then losing the 50/50 toss would still have made it immensely difficult and I really don't think the result would be very different tbh

So if they do eventually become such a side I would expect largely the same outcome tbh

I think New Zeeland have a very good team, but just opinion, I think India's is slightly better. It's competitive though, which is how it should be.

The toss is important, but I suppose the challenge for England is to get to a point where they are that good that they can eliminate the requirement of a toss. Thats where it feels we have got to in one day cricket. We are some way from that now.

I don't think anybody would deny the toss is important. But England havent played well there for me. Just as the toss was important in the last match, and Root played very well. There is some human agency in this too.

 

[catcherintherye]

I think we are going to find out ust how much of a minefield that pitch was now, and whether it is a pitch where you score 130 odd and only manage to go at a bit over 2 per over.

I suspect England have underperformed in difficult conditions there, and we will see there is a chance to be positive and score runs from India.

 

[Chris O'Connor]

I think New Zeeland have a very good team, but just opinion, I think India's is slightly better. It's competitive though, which is how it should be.

The toss is important, but I suppose the challenge for England is to get to a point where they are that good that they can eliminate the requirement of a toss. Thats where it feels we have got to in one day cricket. We are some way from that now.

I don't think anybody would deny the toss is important. But England havent played well there for me. Just as the toss was important in the last match, and Root played very well. There is some human agency in this too.

But this is the whole point of all the discussion

There are tosses which give you an advantage which better sides have a chance if overcoming

And there are those were the advantage is weighted so much in favour of the correct call that it's nigh on impossible for any side no matter how good to overcome (within normal limits obviously)

I would say this toss is, if not firmly in the latter category, all but there.

 

[Chris O'Connor]

I think we are going to find out ust how much of a minefield that pitch was now, and whether it is a pitch where you score 130 odd and only manage to go at a bit over 2 per over.

I suspect England have underperformed in difficult conditions there, and we will see there is a chance to be positive and score runs from India.

Again no - however much you pretend it is the case it clearly isn't.

How can the two be compared? - This is a no risk and full reward jolly - they can take risks hit out and know there's no comeback and no risk - they'll possibly face containing fields and few close catches after the first few over.

Chalk and cheese any comparisons absolutely bogus

I thought you thought they should enforce if they were any good anyway?

I seem to disagree with everything you post this morning

 

[arminisgod]

Moeen Ali is pure garbage

 

[Cool_Blue]

This might have already been discussed, but.........how on Earth is a crowd permitted in here, 15,000 I believe? Most of them are not wearing masks (and who can blame them in that heat). Baffling.

 

[summerisle]

This might have already been discussed, but.........how on Earth is a crowd permitted in here, 15,000 I believe? Most of them are not wearing masks (and who can blame them in that heat). Baffling.

They're supposed to be socially distancing. lol

 

[arminisgod]

This might have already been discussed, but.........how on Earth is a crowd permitted in here, 15,000 I believe? Most of them are not wearing masks (and who can blame them in that heat). Baffling.

Indias reached herd immunity, only had 92 deaths yesterday

 

[big nev lookalike]

England always have at least one batting collapse per series. Sometimes it’s to do with the pitch,other times great bowling and/or poor batting.This pitch is not a 5 day pitch,the same could be said of some of our own pitches.Im just enjoying watching it.

 

[catcherintherye]

Again no - however much you pretend it is the case it clearly isn't.

How can the two be compared? - This is a no risk and full reward jolly - they can take risks hit out and know there's no comeback and no risk - they'll possibly face containing fields and few close catches after the first few over.

Chalk and cheese any comparisons absolutely bogus

I thought you thought they should enforce if they were any good anyway?

I seem to disagree with everything you post this morning

Of course we can compare. I mean if we are going to ignore evidence then it's pointless mate.

As it happens, India are showing England how you should bat on a tough pitch.You put pressure on opponents. It remains a lively pitch, one which you will have chances against you, but it's also ones you can score on. It's not a 130 odd all out pitch in my view.

 

[arminisgod]

that is PLUMB

 

[catcherintherye]

But this is the whole point of all the discussion

There are tosses which give you an advantage which better sides have a chance if overcoming

And there are those were the advantage is weighted so much in favour of the correct call that it's nigh on impossible for any side no matter how good to overcome (within normal limits obviously)

I would say this toss is, if not firmly in the latter category, all but there.

I think we've been over the toss a lot. It certainly makes it hard to win. I don't think it means you get a free pass if you're bundled out for 130 odd though,

 

[Chris O'Connor]

Of course we can compare. I mean if we are going to ignore evidence then it's pointless mate.

As it happens, India are showing England how you should bat on a tough pitch.You put pressure on opponents. It remains a lively pitch, one which you will have chances against you, but it's also ones you can score on. It's not a 130 odd all out pitch in my view.

I think we may as well conclude that my views are almost always the polar opposite of yours and leave it there