Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[Brennan]

I can have a cake and a vaccine apparently.

Fair play

 

[CharliePotato]

But what are you dubious about? You know people are dying from it, they're dying in the tens of thousands. Just because you dont personally know of anyone who has - what relevance is that? Why would you need personal knowledge of a fatality to confirm it?

Because I know people are dying on the drones from other things such as sepsis, pneumonia, flue, suicide, cancer and they are not shutting down the country/work over it.

If it was a leathal as they make out on the news we would all know some one, I don’t know anyone or know anyone who knows anyone. I’m sorry but it Dosent add up.

 

[Nymzee]

Because I know people are dying on the drones from other things such as sepsis, pneumonia, flue, suicide, cancer and they are not shutting down the country/work over it.

If it was a leathal as they make out on the news we would all know some one, I don’t know anyone or know anyone who knows anyone. I’m sorry but it Dosent add up.

If you know people dying of pneumonia you know people dying with COVID.

 

[CharliePotato]

35,000 people die of lung cancer in the UK every year. Less than half of the Covid death toll in the UK in the past 10 months.

Can you imagine if you came on here saying you were dubious about lung cancer because you didn’t know anybody who’d died from it ?

Your post was offensive and a pisstake, to be frank.

It’s not though, my uncle died of lung cancer, and my name died pneumonia in Feb, however if it was a month later no doubt it would have been recorded as covid.

It’s well know that these people recorded have not all died off Covid, they have passed away with it. Anyway, for the people affected by it it makes no differences and I mean the absolute most respect, but it’s not what it seems I’m sorry.

 

[CharliePotato]

If you know people dying of pneumonia you know people dying with COVID.

It’s funny the way the Flu has vanished this year.

 

[CharliePotato]

While I don't fully agree with your point, I agree with parts of it.

There is a lot of hysteria. However, the numbers have to be calculated somehow. They have to put down COVID on the death certificate or there would be no way of saying who actually died from it or who didn't.

There has to be more perspective in some cases. Of the people that have died, if COVID didn't get them this year, something else would. But that's putting it bluntly and doesn't make it right, because if somebody gets an extra 12 months with their family then that's what should be strived for. Hell, an extra 12 days.

My worry is the hysteria over this never stopping, and it is uncalled for., We see it with the new variants, all the fear over whether the vaccine will work. And calls for more lockdowns, or track and trace for the flu ffs.

All things we should be taking heed from granted, and that's further down the line. First things first is just getting the vaccine out to as many people as possible.

I had a family member die from COVID last May. 69, healthy(ish), but had had a heart scare in 2019, and had nearly gone then. Basically, even though they weren't unhealthy, they weren't exactly fit as a fiddle. But, he went into hospital with a stomach issue and never came out, as he caught it in there. That was avoidable in the sense that had he not gone into hospital, he probably wouldn't have got it, but then again he was ill and needed to go in.

My friend's granddad died from it in October, but he was in his 80s, and last January had been in hospital for a month with pneumonia. As my friend put it, he was on his last legs. There'll be a lot of people like that, but it doesn't make it any better.

Agreed, at least some one with some common sense.

Sorry for your losses mate.

 

[Nymzee]

Oh Lord, another flu boy. Kinda thought we’d stop seeing these after a year.

 

[BlueToff]

The UK is doing well, the Oxford early vaccine approval sees them leading out in Europe.

I think when you see tables like that though you have to factor in the UKs single dose policy at the moment, that obviously means the UK can reach more population statistically but may not have the same level of community protection giving one done per person, compared to other countries who are giving two doses.

Sad thing about that table is barely a third one country on it.

Very true. However, other nations on that table are following the policy (Denmark, believe Germany are piloting it).

The AZ vaccine has been tested to 12 weeks and the proof is there that it is more efficient with that spacing. The Pfizer vaccine hasn't been tested to 12 weeks and imo they should not be spacing those out more than the recommended 3 weeks if there is not evidence that it will be as effective.

 

[tsubaki]

It’s funny the way the Flu has vanished this year.

yes, it’s almost like social distancing, masks and less people being in crowded areas makes it more difficult to catch or something

 

[BlueToff]

It’s funny the way the Flu has vanished this year.

Well, it hasn't vanished really. It's just that people who would have died of flu are instead dying of covid, and the lockdown measures probably help reduce risk (or masks etc) of catching it.

It'll be a fair chunk of people but obviously still not right that it's happening.

We'll never eradicate seasonal flu and never eradicate covid, but the vaccine is a good step towards protecting people who would end up in hospital otherwise (or worse).

 

[CharliePotato]

yes, it’s almost like social distancing, masks and less people being in crowded areas makes it more difficult to catch or something

It is isn’t it, hmmm.

 

[Neiler]

Very true. However, other nations on that table are following the policy (Denmark, believe Germany are piloting it).

The AZ vaccine has been tested to 12 weeks and the proof is there that it is more efficient with that spacing. The Pfizer vaccine hasn't been tested to 12 weeks and imo they should not be spacing those out more than the recommended 3 weeks if there is not evidence that it will be as effective.

I think it’s a brave decision mate, I’m curious to see how it works out, it might prove the right call but I think it’s remains to be seen.

I got the first Pfizer dose earlier, so the advice we were given is it gives me something just over 50% efficacy protection after 12 days post the first dose, I’ll get the second in 21 days to take me to the 90 odd % after 12 days of the second dose.

Strikes me that there is different interpretations of risk and modelling between countries, I think the UK make it that it gives 70% efficacy protection after 12 days of the first dose.

 

[BlueToff]

I think it’s a brave decision mate, I’m curious to see how it works out, it might prove the right call but I think it’s remains to be seen.

I got the first Pfizer dose earlier, so the advice we were given is it gives me something just over 50% efficacy protection after 12 days post the first dose, I’ll get the second in 21 days to take me to the 90 odd % after 12 days of the second dose.

Strikes me that their is different interpretations of risk and modelling between countries, I think the UK make it that it gives 70% efficacy protection after 12 days of the first dose.

The Guardian article that Dave shared earlier said this mate...

Second shots of coronavirus vaccine could be delayed even further amid growing evidence that spacing out the doses improves their effectiveness.

And then...

Evidence now suggests that spacing out doses of the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine may be more effective at protecting people. Clinical trials revealed the efficacy of the vaccine was substantially higher, at 90%, in a subgroup of people who received half a dose followed by a full dose, rather than two full doses, which had an efficacy of 62%.

But Prof Wei Shen Lim, the chair of the Covid-19 immunisation group of the JCVI, told MPs further analysis by AstraZeneca showed the improved protection came from spacing out the doses.

“People who had the half dose then full dose were those who were vaccinated at a longer time interval, roughly six to 12 weeks, and what they’ve seen in their data is that people who have the second dose later probably have a three times higher antibody level than those who were vaccinated earlier. So if anything, it suggests that increasing the dose interval is beneficial,” he said.

There was also an article which I shared in here a few days ago about the AZ vaccine having been trialed with both 3 weeks' spacing and 12 weeks, and the 12 weeks showing more efficiacy.

Obviously a risk, but it all is to an extent. At least with the AZ one, there is evidence that a longer spacing works and, given the easier storage and the fact we have so many on order, the majority of the population will get that one.

I repeat though that since Pfizer didn't test for longer spacing (which seems an odd decision actually when you think about it?) then anybody getting that vaccine should, imo, be getting their second jab after the recommended 21 days.

 

[Neiler]

The Guardian article that Dave shared earlier said this mate...

Second shots of coronavirus vaccine could be delayed even further amid growing evidence that spacing out the doses improves their effectiveness.

And then...

Evidence now suggests that spacing out doses of the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine may be more effective at protecting people. Clinical trials revealed the efficacy of the vaccine was substantially higher, at 90%, in a subgroup of people who received half a dose followed by a full dose, rather than two full doses, which had an efficacy of 62%.

But Prof Wei Shen Lim, the chair of the Covid-19 immunisation group of the JCVI, told MPs further analysis by AstraZeneca showed the improved protection came from spacing out the doses.

“People who had the half dose then full dose were those who were vaccinated at a longer time interval, roughly six to 12 weeks, and what they’ve seen in their data is that people who have the second dose later probably have a three times higher antibody level than those who were vaccinated earlier. So if anything, it suggests that increasing the dose interval is beneficial,” he said.

There was also an article which I shared in here a few days ago about the AZ vaccine having been trialed with both 3 weeks' spacing and 12 weeks, and the 12 weeks showing more efficiacy.

Obviously a risk, but it all is to an extent. At least with the AZ one, there is evidence that a longer spacing works and, given the easier storage and the fact we have so many on order, the majority of the population will get that one.

I repeat though that since Pfizer didn't test for longer spacing (which seems an odd decision actually when you think about it?) then anybody getting that vaccine should, imo, be getting their second jab after the recommended 21 days.

Fair play mate, the AZ one isn’t licensed in the EU yet, so thanks for sharing that. What do AZ say themselves or have the UK gone rouge doing their own analysis?

It still strikes me as a brave decision, it may well prove the right one long term, that said 12 weeks is a full quarter, it’s a long time to wait in between doses with not optimal efficacy especially in the community, you can imagine the swell for people pushing for normality, pubs, holidays, work, gyms etc after the first dose.

I’m really curious to see how it unfolds, hopefully the UK has the right of it and proves the EU approach in general is overcautious.

 

[BlueToff]

Fair play mate, the AZ one isn’t licensed in the EU yet, so thanks for sharing that. What do AZ say themselves or have the UK gone rouge doing their own analysis?

It still strikes me as a brave decision, it may well prove the right one long term, that said 12 weeks is a full quarter, it’s a long time to wait in between doses with not optimal efficacy especially in the community, you can imagine the swell for people pushing for normality, pubs, holidays, work, gyms etc after the first dose.

I’m really curious to see how it unfolds, hopefully the UK has the right of it and proves the EU approach in general is overcautious.

no worries. From what I gather from the article I saw a few days back (I'll try find it) it was AZ who did all the testing so surely it'll be those scientists gathering the evidence? I'll check back though.

It is a brave decision, I agree, but at least with AZ there is evidence to back it up.

But like I say it should only be done where there is evidence. Pfizer and Moderna didn't test longer spacing it seems, so those vaccines should be administered based on reccomendations, imo.