Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[Kenshin]

I take it all back, you're the free thinking logical expert we need right now.

Tell me more about how Covid only affects the old and is literally pneumonia.

Now you are putting words in my mouth.

Pneumonia and covid are different things, with the former very much triggered by coronaviruses.

One stat to would be interested in knowing but have no access to is how many covid deaths also had pneumonia. Because that would give a new perspective on treatment and cause of death which I am sure the medical experts are already aware of, just not tweeting it out. I'm not allowed to think outside the box like that am I? Dr kenshin must repeat what everyone else says.

Why would; after months of public health messaging on hand washing and social distancing, mandatory mask wearing, enhanced PPE, H&S requirements to make spaces 'Covid safe' and public availability of hand santisers, hygiene measures be down?

Yeah must be magic right. Just out of the blue any other respiratory death just hundreds lower than any other year but one specific respiratory death doesn't get affected by it.

That is literally what you are saying. Only one respiratory death is allowed to exist at any given time. And the guidelines saying the only requirement is a positive test , that means nothing neither. I forgot all other illnesses just disappear when you rest positive

 

[Deckard2049]

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanmic/article/PIIS2666-5247(20)30151-8/fulltext

Good read this. Particularly liked this bit "For months many governments have proclaimed that a vaccine is the complete solution, without any mention that not all potential vaccines will fill this role. Nonetheless, some quarters will push to roll out a vaccine, irrespective of its properties, and abandon other measures. It is not unreasonable for the public to expect this drive, given the failure to manage expectations to date. In this setting most people would experience little disease but those who currently are at greatest risk would find themselves completely exposed. This would be an inversion of the underlying principles guiding current interventions. Some might see this characterisation as absurd, but we have seen the world over how easily physical distancing seems to have been abandoned when people are led to believe, deliberately or otherwise, that new measures replace rather than complement earlier interventions.

Often it is difficult to offer solutions, but it is straightforward in this case: interventions that have been in use since early in the pandemic, most crucially physical distancing and hand hygiene, must continue indefinitely"

Does this paper provide a more detailed meaning for what it means by indefinitely? Until complete eradication?

Typical doomer headline “we will not be returning to the old normal”. Seriously, did Davek write this?

 

[spectateur]

I note anthrax and TB deaths are down in the UK....

Similar to Covid19 symptoms has anyone considered that the drop in Anthrax and TB deaths are accounting for Covid deaths???????

Don't be daft. How many people contract anthrax and TB nowadays in UK?

 

[Jebus_lives]

Now you are putting words in my mouth.

Pneumonia and covid are different things, with the former very much triggered by coronaviruses.

One stat to would be interested in knowing but have no access to is how many covid deaths also had pneumonia. Because that would give a new perspective on treatment and cause of death which I am sure the medical experts are already aware of, just not tweeting it out. I'm not allowed to think outside the box like that am I? Dr kenshin must repeat what everyone else says.




Yeah must be magic right. Just out of the blue any other respiratory death just hundreds lower than any other year but one specific respiratory death doesn't get affected by it.

That is literally what you are saying. Only one respiratory death is allowed to exist at any given time. And the guidelines saying the only requirement is a positive test , that means nothing neither. I forgot all other illnesses just disappear when you rest positive

What thinking outside the box are you doing?

Saying that despite being different things, pneumonia and Covid19 share similar symptoms with one being brought on by the other isn't groundbreaking. It's not even all that relevant to how deaths are being reported. You can alter that definition as it suits the evidence at any given time as has been done across to he year.

Largely much of the reporting for pneumonia and influenza are linked because you can't separate them effectively. Unless you're looking for clinical difference and applying solutions it's mostly irrelevant.

 

[Jebus_lives]

Don't be daft. How many people contract anthrax and TB nowadays in UK?

Cases are up....linked to Covid???????

 

[Jebus_lives]

Does this paper provide a more detailed meaning for what it means by indefinitely? Until complete eradication?

Typical doomer headline “we will not be returning to the old normal”. Seriously, did Davek write this?

Oh dear.

 

[Kenshin]

What thinking outside the box are you doing?

Saying that despite being different things, pneumonia and Covid19 share similar symptoms with one being brought on by the other isn't groundbreaking. It's not even all that relevant to how deaths are being reported. You can alter that definition as it suits the evidence at any given time as has been done across to he year.

Largely much of the reporting for pneumonia and influenza are linked because you can't separate them effectively. Unless you're looking for clinical difference and applying solutions it's mostly irrelevant.

Unless

There is actual ground to suggest covid is t killing people directly but the pneumonia that is triggered does.

Which would offer an explanation as to why some people end up in hospital outside the general demographic and many others don't. That's what you call a deciding factor. From a science perspective (which I am sure they are) you can look into how covid is triggering it in patients. It then can shape how you treat patients differently rather than just generalising a virus that most often is a mild cough at worst in many cases.

This is thinking outside the box because I'm not just blanket terming everything with buzzwords

Am I right ? God knows , As I said I don't have access to that information to say one way or another.

And if you can't separate pneumonia from covid (your words), does that not make the death number for covid flawed?

Is covid 19 killing people directly? Or is it causing other issues that then affect someone's chance of living?

Oh and pneumonia is far more prevalent in the elderly anyway , triggered by other coronaviruses. So again that offers some way of explaining things beyond simply saying COVID over and over again.

 

[Jebus_lives]

Unless

There is actual ground to suggest covid is t killing people directly but the pneumonia that is triggered does.

Which would offer an explanation as to why some people end up in hospital outside the general demographic and many others don't. That's what you call a deciding factor. From a science perspective (which I am sure they are) you can look into how covid is triggering it in patients. It then can shape how you treat patients differently rather than just generalising a virus that most often is a mild cough at worst in many cases.

This is thinking outside the box because I'm not just blanket terming everything with buzzwords

Am I right ? God knows , As I said I don't have access to that information to say one way or another.

And if you can't separate pneumonia from covid (your words), does that not make the death number for covid flawed?

Is covid 19 killing people directly? Or is it causing other issues that then affect someone's chance of living?

Oh and pneumonia is far more prevalent in the elderly anyway , triggered by other coronaviruses. So again that offers some way of explaining things beyond simply saying COVID over and over again.

Has it ever occured to you that just because you don't know something, nobody has given it any thought?

 

[Moomin]

Has it ever occured to you that just because you don't know something, nobody has given it any thought?

Going by what @Kenshin says we shouldn't fear AIDS as well.

 

[Jebus_lives]

Unless

There is actual ground to suggest covid is t killing people directly but the pneumonia that is triggered does.

Which would offer an explanation as to why some people end up in hospital outside the general demographic and many others don't. That's what you call a deciding factor. From a science perspective (which I am sure they are) you can look into how covid is triggering it in patients. It then can shape how you treat patients differently rather than just generalising a virus that most often is a mild cough at worst in many cases.

This is thinking outside the box because I'm not just blanket terming everything with buzzwords

Am I right ? God knows , As I said I don't have access to that information to say one way or another.

And if you can't separate pneumonia from covid (your words), does that not make the death number for covid flawed?

Is covid 19 killing people directly? Or is it causing other issues that then affect someone's chance of living?

Oh and pneumonia is far more prevalent in the elderly anyway , triggered by other coronaviruses. So again that offers some way of explaining things beyond simply saying COVID over and over again.

They aren't my words.

 

[Deckard2049]

Oh dear.

People aren’t abandoning physical distancing because they think it’s safe to do so or even because a vaccine is just around a corner. They’re abandoning physical distance because a large number of people simply don’t care enough anymore.

From the article you shared:

It might be that the vaccines that ultimately become available are more like those described under scenario 2: slowing transmission in addition to limiting illness and death. This scenario will be more welcome than scenario 3 but will not change the need to maintain earlier interventions in place. It is time to forcefully impress on people that basic measures to limit the transmission of SARS-CoV-2 are here to stay. This is the new normal.

Seriously, irrespective of what’s right or wrong, how much support and for how long do you expect the “new normal” to have?

 

[Nymzee]

They’re abandoning physical distance because a large number of people simply don’t care enough anymore.

And they'll still whinge like mad when pubs & restaurants get shut.

 

[Jebus_lives]

People aren’t abandoning physical distancing because they think it’s safe to do so or even because a vaccine is just around a corner. They’re abandoning physical distance because a large number of people simply don’t care enough anymore.

From the article you shared:

It might be that the vaccines that ultimately become available are more like those described under scenario 2: slowing transmission in addition to limiting illness and death. This scenario will be more welcome than scenario 3 but will not change the need to maintain earlier interventions in place. It is time to forcefully impress on people that basic measures to limit the transmission of SARS-CoV-2 are here to stay. This is the new normal.

Seriously, irrespective of what’s right or wrong, how much support and for how long do you expect the “new normal” to have?

From the article I shared:
"This concept essentially warns that if a problem is characterised as nearly insurmountable then many people will just give up. These people surmise that the cost of the intervention is not worth it, given they perceive that the cost yields little benefit".

Didn't that cover it or are you suggesting an alternative to breakdown of distancing - boredom, lack of understanding, selfishness?

 

[DrEFC]

Do you work in a hospital mate?

Yes. It's not gotten like April yet, thankfully.

 

[zzr45]

Has it ever occured to you that just because you don't know something, nobody has given it any thought?

I don't understand the chemical reaction of how chewing on a lump of arsenic might kill me, thus it will not.