Chris Kavanagh

Eggs said:
….i think clubs should do more as a collective. Formally highlight obvious contradictions between decisions and bring officials to task.

They should form/fund a group of analysts to highlight failings after each group of games. Score referees and VAR officials on their performance. Referees are highly paid professionals, they should be more accountable.

Scrutinising performance is so worthwhile.
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Even something as simple as interviewing referees and VAR officials after games with club representatives fielding the questions, If these people have to explain their incompetence on TV in front of millions then incompetence would become less common.
 
RomanReigns said:
what's the protocol in asking for a referee to be banned from officiating in any of our games?
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Moyes could’ve gone nuclear today, come with a list of clear mistakes from this fella and Pawson. Said something like “these two jokers make Clatteberg look like Dave Hickson” took the fine, touching ban etc… but after he went so public I doubt they’d be given our games for a while.
 
JobForTheMoyes said:
Stop chatting crap. The key is he was challenging for the ball, and there was clearly no violent intent or excessive force.
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This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
 
yakublue said:
This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
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Yes, because they are focused on heading the ball. Which is what Keane is doing.

The amount of people who think Keane can both barely put one foot and front of the other, and at the same time jump and win a header while pulling a guy's hair, is pretty astounding.

At any rate, it's not worth continuing to discuss. I'm not usually one who believes in bias in officiating, perhaps this wasn't a matter of judgment so set it aside. But the amount of judgment calls we're on the wrong side of seems a bit high.
 
yakublue said:
This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
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Yeah, but on this occasion it is not a non-football action. It occurred as he was challenging for the ball and reflexively grabbed. If I'm looking away and put my hand on something its just a reflex that the hand closes around something on contact. Nobody every threw some keys at you? Or a tennis ball come up toward your face and you just grab through instinct?
 
carolinablue232 said:
Oh my. What’s he doing with his left hand? Someone should tell him these acts are more suited for the bedroom.
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Looks like he's at least Knuckle deep in there, Maybe that's why he was sent off.. Ass play aside What Martinelli did last night was infantilely worse than what Keane did, where was VAR then?
 
yakublue said:
This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
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It’s only weird if you slow it down and presume it’s premeditated. If you’ve played football you’ll know that arms and legs flail all over the place during challenges. Forwards and defenders spend their life grappling with each and grabbing each others shirts. By the time he realised he had hold of hair and not shirt he had let go and the challenge was over.
 
Kevsleftpeg said:
It’s only weird if you slow it down and presume it’s premeditated. If you’ve played football you’ll know that arms and legs flail all over the place during challenges. Forwards and defenders spend their life grappling with each and grabbing each others shirts. By the time he realised he had hold of hair and not shirt he had let go and the challenge was over.
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Yep this. If you've played footy and been a defender you reach your hand out and grab the shirt to steady yourself.
 
yakublue said:
This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
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If you're challenging for the ball the offence is serious foul play. If you're not challenging for the ball it's violent conduct. Clearly Keane is challenging for the ball!!
 
yakublue said:
This "challenging for the ball" thing is only really relevant if the action is considered to be part of the challenge (like if a player is going in with their studs up but clearly trying to play the ball). Hair grabbing is generally considered a "non-football" action regardless of the context. The excessive force is also not especially relevant if it's considered to be a deliberate act of aggression.

Anyway, leaving all this aside, can we agree it's a weird thing to do? There's a lot of people defending something that I don't think I've ever seen another footballer do while challenging for the ball in the air.
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The challenging for the ball thing 100% matters and is very relevant.

The guidance The league have refers to off the ball incidents so I have no idea how on earth they've taken the view this is violent conduct.

Some of the takes I've seen on this incident are absolutely absurd. Accidents happen in football particularly when an incident lasts all of about half a second where you are trying to win a header.

I thought it was one of the worst decisions of all time when it happened and to be honest I stand by it now. There is no evidence whatsoever it was deliberate. And just because its unusual doesn't mean its deliberate.
 

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