Centre-midfield - we need to take the brakes off

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

It's not about the number of attacking players though, it's about the quality and type of player.

McCarthy regularly gets into the opposition half and the final third, but he doesn't really know what to do with the ball when he gets it. He's fantastic for cleaning up and chasing down lost causes, but he's not going to slide a pass through for Lukaku to smash into the back of the net.

So what? That's not what he's in the side for.

Having a more attack minded player in the deep role would mean you were losing most of the defensive cover that they provide. Barkley chases down no-one and generally stands there watching as soon as he's been passed, the idea that he could miraculously transform into a genuine centre mid overnight is preposterous IMO.

 

[Titus Bramble]

It's not about the number of attacking players though, it's about the quality and type of player.

McCarthy regularly gets into the opposition half and the final third, but he doesn't really know what to do with the ball when he gets it. He's fantastic for cleaning up and chasing down lost causes, but he's not going to slide a pass through for Lukaku to smash into the back of the net.

I'm pretty sure that did happen a few weeks ago...

 

[Brennan]

But if we were to go with a more forward thinking CM it would allow us to swap our attacking focus. If both full backs are bombing on (which is boss btw) both CM need to be disciplined to sit back. But then we could also have a full back and a CM bombing on, so the other full back would need to stay back. I think this is the other strong to our bow Davek is referring to and I think he's right, it would make us more unpredictable.

Precisely.

When the opposition know your main threat comes solely from out wide it's easier to defend against. We are in need of a player (or two) who can play through the lines of four that teams at Goodison like to put out, rather than going down the line and trying to come in along the goal line.

VARIETY IS THE SPICE OF LIFE LADS.

 

[Brennan]

I'm pretty sure that did happen a few weeks ago...

Oh ffs...

Hibbert scored once mate

 

[hullefc]

Martinez uses McCarthy to sit deep alongside Barry to gain domination in possession and allow the full backs to get forward. But during the game McCarthy's role changes he is pushed on when he needs to or when Barry moves forward he stays back a bit. Against certain teams, he is used to close down people higher up the pitch or wherever the ball maybe be. The way Martinez wants us to play, his role is quite central (forgive the pun) a holding role, closing down, getting forward (setting up the goal against Southampton for example), getting stuck in with tackles like yesterday.

There are some sides to his game that he needs to work on shooting, sometimes final pass for example. But I can see why people on the Republic's staff say he can and should get the game by the scruff of the neck. I don't always like making comparisons but he reminds so much of Howie Kendall, who was Catterick's 'brains' on the pitch. A high accolade I know but I think with the input of Martin O'Neil and Roy Keane, and gaining international experience, and working more with Coleman, McGeady and Gibson his game will improve, he will also learn so much from Barry.

 

[davek]

Barkley in the deep lying role would be a disaster IMO, as he consistently gets caught in possession and would offer no defensive qualities in that position.

It's a challenge for him. But it's a side of his game he'll have to master. Personally i think he's ill-suited to that more advanced role and only gets going when breaking from deep with a bit of space in front of him. He isn't a lock picker and becomes just another body snarling up space in the final third as he is currently used.

Not sure I agree. Our full backs are both incredibly adventurous, so we often have six players lending weight to any attack. I'd say that's as much as many, and our full backs offer more to our attack than arguably any other team in the league.

They can only do that because they know that there is a degree of protection left behind them in the shape of Barry and McCarthy.

We do have very adventurous FBs, yes. But against teams outside the elite home and away (plus Liverpool at Anfield) I think we have control over the game to be able to take the stabilisers off a bit in that CM area. The next evolution of this Martinez team HAS to come from there, IMO.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Aye, maybe. We're kind of a work in progress though aren't we? McCarthy is only young and still improving. Barkley certainly is. Probably Lukaku too, and certainly Gerry.

It kinda costs a whole lot of money to buy the kind of player you chaps are asking for.

 

[Brennan]

Aye, maybe. We're kind of a work in progress though aren't we? McCarthy is only young and still improving. Barkley certainly is. Probably Lukaku too, and certainly Gerry.

It kinda costs a whole lot of money to buy the kind of player you chaps are asking for.

VDV cost about £10m.

Mirallas cost us £6m.

Not huge sums for those two.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Seamus Coleman cost sixty thousand pounds.

Haha and Juan Mata cost £37m what's your point?

 

[davek]

Been saying this for weeks mate.

Don't mind Barry and McCarthy at all.

But when we're losing or really need a goal it's not ideal for me at all.

It's way too conservative against the lesser lights.

It's been good in the sense that Martinez came in and needed to have a rock to establish a passing style on - and getting hold of the ball was essential to this. But we evolve, and next season I'd like us to use more of a holding/attacking blend in cm.

 

[Duncan Disordely]

It should be a horses for courses situation. There's teams and games were we should definitely play the two more defensively minded players as we don't want to be wide open. But against teams who are sitting back deep and are unadventurous, or we are chasing a game late on we should be looking for more creativity.

Also I fan opposition team has set up thinking "Everton are going to attack down the flanks today, we'll double up on Coleman and Baines", having an extra creature player in he middle will throw heir game plan and really open things up for us.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

VDV cost about £10m.

Mirallas cost us £6m.

Not huge sums for those two.

I'd say Mirallas is kind of the level we're at already though. Much as I love him for instance, he wouldn't get in the Chelsea or City lineups.

 

[Brennan]

Haha and Juan Mata cost £37m what's your point?

That you don't have to spend tons of money to get good players.

Baines cost £5m. Mirallas £6m. Arteta £4m was it ?

 

[Brennan]

I'd say Mirallas is kind of the level we're at already though. Much as I love him for instance, he wouldn't get in the Chelsea or City lineups.

You don't need a City or Chelsea starter to improve our central midfield...

We're not talking about getting a better player than Mirallas for his position, we're talking about getting a more attack minded central midfield player to go instead of Barry or McCarthy.

As i said above, Arteta cost us £4m or something stupid. Chelsea signed De Bruyne for £7m.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

This isn't about personnel IMO, it's about mixing our style. We're predictable and one paced, due to our reluctance to vary our tactics. We need to get the ball from from front to back quicker on occasion and increase our pace in the final third. We're often faced with 2 banks of 4 to try and find our way through, but that's down to the fact that we generally move forwards slowly and allow the opposition to get set defensively