Can We Succeed Next Season Without Breaking FFP?

[EverTheOptimist]

The worst thing about football accounting is fans who post doomsday predictions on social media about our spending.

No one knows what money we will or wont have to spend.

Boils my pish when you see people claiming we are skint or will have x amount to spend. USM could put £200 million into our accounts overnight towards the stadium and completely smash our FFP deficit in one go.

Likewise Kean could go to PSG tomorrow for £40 million etc.

Literally no one knows whats going to happen other than the owners.

Our owner won't do that though, no return for him.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

Our owner won't do that though, no return for him.

A large naming rights deal has already been agreed just not announced yet - will be announced when the new ground financing is announced/finalised.

 

[Bluestar]

Sadly we have already broken FFP. We have blown £240m.

We have to fill a 135m deficit, somehow.

The premier league has FFP rules. We can’t record losses of more than £105m over a rolling three year period.
our losses are £240m over the last two years.
The sanctions can be financial. We would have to vomit to reducing our losses by £22m per year, and failing that there could be transfer bans or points deductions.

It has not gone away.

Vomit??? Promise

 

[Dymak]

The premier league has FFP rules.

Have they ever been used? Like, even once?

Carlo laughed in the face of someone that brought up FFP a few weeks ago. He laughed because it’s dead, a non-issue at a time where football is facing far greater issues.

 

[Bluestar]

Have they ever been used? Like, even once?

Carlo laughed in the face of someone that brought up FFP a few weeks ago. He laughed because it’s dead, a non-issue at a time where football is facing far greater issues.

It isn’t dead. The authorities may be more lenient and there are no doubt ways around it, but there is no denying we have posted £240m of loss in two years.

 

[Dymak]

It isn’t dead. The authorities may be more lenient and there are no doubt ways around it, but there is no denying we have posted £240m of loss in two years.

It is dead. The PL haven’t handed out a single punishment since its inception. The punishments from UEFA have been soft, puny, and negligible. City have since had their way in court and half of the footballing world is on its arse.

City will ride roughshod over any supposed FFP rules this summer, and so will anyone else that is capable of doing so and doesn’t want to use it as an excuse not to spend.

 

[Martin Alvito]

It doesn't work like that. FFP is calculated on the accounts. So the PL and UEFA would know exactly where the money went.

Injecting £200m into the club would certainly help with cash flow, but it wouldn't affect FFP because the funds have to be accounted for. FFP is about profit and loss and not cashflow.

There are ways. Where there are rules, there is money laundering. I will tell you right now that City has all the satellite clubs for the purpose of laundering money under FFP.

Arguably, an accountant's job is to figure out how to launder money and get away with it. We have an billionaire accountant running the show. If he can't figure out how to exploit the gray areas of FFP to the hilt, no one can.

One possible explanation of our struggles is that he's cognitively limited by that framework. City may be having more success because they've chosen to just flip FFP off rather than try to be sneaky about it. They're Tyler Durden, and we're Charles Grodin in Midnight Run.

 

[Bluestar]

It is dead. The PL haven’t handed out a single punishment since its inception. The punishments from UEFA have been soft, puny, and negligible. City have since had their way in court and half of the footballing world is on its arse.

City will ride roughshod over any supposed FFP rules this summer, and so will anyone else that is capable of doing so and doesn’t want to use it as an excuse not to spend.

I do hope so.

 

[tim cahill]

One way of Moshiri appeasing the fans after bringing in FSW would be to go on another summer spending spree. He must've been promised a decent budget to take the job in these circumstances.

 

[gwladysnight]

There are ways. Where there are rules, there is money laundering. I will tell you right now that City has all the satellite clubs for the purpose of laundering money under FFP.

Arguably, an accountant's job is to figure out how to launder money and get away with it. We have an billionaire accountant running the show. If he can't figure out how to exploit the gray areas of FFP to the hilt, no one can.

One possible explanation of our struggles is that he's cognitively limited by that framework. City may be having more success because they've chosen to just flip FFP off rather than try to be sneaky about it. They're Tyler Durden, and we're Charles Grodin in Midnight Run.

City were sneaky about avoiding FFP. The problem was Das Spiegel obtained leaked emails that showed City's deception.

As you say, there may be ways around FFP, but they will always be a gamble.

The main thing though is that injecting £200m, into the club for the Stadium will have zero effect on FFP.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Benitez will have been desperate for this job because its dead convenient for him. I doubt our transfer budget is of much concern

 

[gwladysnight]

It is dead. The PL haven’t handed out a single punishment since its inception. The punishments from UEFA have been soft, puny, and negligible. City have since had their way in court and half of the footballing world is on its arse.

City will ride roughshod over any supposed FFP rules this summer, and so will anyone else that is capable of doing so and doesn’t want to use it as an excuse not to spend.

UEFA banned AC Milan for a year, I would hardly call that soft, puny or negligible.

 

[Dymak]

UEFA banned AC Milan for a year, I would hardly call that soft, puny or negligible.

That was prior to City’s court case and Covid, but even then it was just a ban from a single Europa League campaign. I’d much rather strengthen the team so that it actually becomes half decent, rather than remain crap forever because of some sanctions that were seldom used. Wolves were in breach and were just given a small fine.

This was all before the City court case, Covid, and the European Super League debacle. They aren’t gona be clamping down on clubs spending money this year, and even if they did, I think their soft punishments are worth taking.

FFP is dead.

 

[gwladysnight]

That was prior to City’s court case and Covid, but even then it was just a ban from a single Europa League campaign. I’d much rather strengthen the team so that it actually becomes half decent, rather than remain crap forever because of some sanctions that were seldom used. Wolves were in breach and were just given a small fine.

This was all before the City court case, Covid, and the European Super League debacle. They aren’t gona be clamping down on clubs spending money this year, and even if they did, I think their soft punishments are worth taking.

FFP is dead.

Wolves were not just given a small fine. They had their squad reduced from 25 to 23 but more significantly they had to agree to a set spending pattern that would ensure that they didn't breach FFP again.

City didn't actually win their case, they were fined, and the ban was overturned only because evidence had become time barred.

UEFA certainly won't be clamping down on FFP this year. They have rolled two accounting periods in to one. They have also allowed clubs to disregard losses due to COVID.

That doesn't really help us, though because our match day revenue is tiny so COVID has had a minimal impact on our finances. The other issue is that FFP is based on a rolling three-year period. So spending big this year will affect the following two years.

 

[Dymak]

Wolves were not just given a small fine. They had their squad reduced from 25 to 23 but more significantly they had to agree to a set spending pattern that would ensure that they didn't breach FFP again.

City didn't actually win their case, they were fined, and the ban was overturned only because evidence had become time barred.

UEFA certainly won't be clamping down on FFP this year. They have rolled two accounting periods in to one. They have also allowed clubs to disregard losses due to COVID.

That doesn't really help us, though because our match day revenue is tiny so COVID has had a minimal impact on our finances. The other issue is that FFP is based on a rolling three-year period. So spending big this year will affect the following two years.

These ‘consequences’ are puny. So Wolves had their European squad reduced by two players, and had to agree to the rules that they’d already broken. If they hadn’t have qualified for Europe then they’d have experienced no punishment at all.

You say yourself that UEFA won’t be clamping down on FFP this year, and I don’t see any clamp down on its way. There has yet to be any clamp down this far, just small punishments that are worth taking.

Carlo laughed about the FFP excuse for a reason. It’s dead. Not worth worrying about unless you want to use it as an excuse not to spend.