Current Affairs Bristol Shenanigans

[roydo]

Hardly in the same bracket of moral fibre jobs as teachers and Doctors though is it - the way some carry on

I will tell you a true story, then see what you think.

One of my best mates was a solicitor, who also specialised in arranging defence cases for Barristers in Bristol Chambers. (Crown Court, serious stuff). He had a renowned reputation both as a good solicitor, but also his ability to produce defence cases that would mean only the best prepared prosecution cases would win. And if they did win, all parties knew any case he lost, resulting in a conviction for his client, would never be challenged and quashed on some technicality years later.

His specialisation? Defending the most notorious and dangerous child and family sex offenders. As in, whole families abusing the youngest in their clan. Sitting though hours of "home movies" so he didnt miss a thing that could come back years later.

He, or rather his Barrister, "lost" the case, which means a notorious child/family sex ring was ended, and not one of the convicted men and women will ever see the light of day via a challenge to their conviction.

 

[Jebus_lives]

I will tell you a true story, then see what you think.

One of my best mates was a solicitor, who also specialised in arranging defence cases for Barristers in Bristol Chambers. (Crown Court, serious stuff). He had a renowned reputation both as a good solicitor, but also his ability to produce defence cases that would mean only the best prepared prosecution cases would win. And if they did win, all parties knew any case he lost, resulting in a conviction for his client, would never be challenged and quashed on some technicality years later.

His specialisation? Defending the most notorious and dangerous child and family sex offenders. As in, whole families abusing the youngest in their clan. Sitting though hours of "home movies" so he didnt miss a thing that could come back years later.

He, or rather his Barrister, "lost" the case, which means a notorious child/family sex ring was ended, and not one of the convicted men and women will ever see the light of day via a challenge to their conviction.

Elitist woke gravy train riding vulture.

 

[roydo]

Elitist woke gravy train riding vulture.

Stoke fan. I am Godfather for his eldest, and a few weeks before the baby's christening, I was at a sportsmans meal thing. Gordon Banks was the speaker, and after the meal he signed the menu with his photo (in a Stoke shirt) on it, with "To James on your Christening. Have a great life, Best, Gordon Banks."

Dave, my mate, actually cried, and James still has it.

 

[Jebus_lives]

Stoke fan. I am Godfather for his eldest, and a few weeks before the baby's christening, I was at a sportsmans meal thing. Gordon Banks was the speaker, and after the meal he signed the menu with his photo (in a Stoke shirt) on it, with "To James on your Christening. Have a great life, Best, Gordon Banks."

Dave, my mate, actually cried, and James still has it.

Lovely stuff.

 

[roydo]

Lovely stuff.

One of those weird conicidences.

 

[COYBL25]

Hardly in the same bracket of moral fibre jobs as teachers and Doctors though is it - the way some carry on

You do know that Barristers are self employed and out of “ all that money “ that they earn, that they have to pay for the chambers, all the clerical and support staff and all the other many and assorted bills ?

 

[urquattro]

Stoke fan. I am Godfather for his eldest, and a few weeks before the baby's christening, I was at a sportsmans meal thing. Gordon Banks was the speaker, and after the meal he signed the menu with his photo (in a Stoke shirt) on it, with "To James on your Christening. Have a great life, Best, Gordon Banks."

Dave, my mate, actually cried, and James still has it.

I stopped at a service station to fill up after visiting my mom in a place called Clayton in Newcastle Under Lyme and when I went to pay there was a gentlemen in front of me which was Gordon Banks. When it was my turn to pay I asked the cashier a young lad about 20, I asked if he knew who that was and his reply was he hadn't a clue. When I got outside a had a chat with Gordon and can only say what a nice man he was.

 

[Zatara]

Why I keep engaging is beyond me, but I guess we can pretty much all start our posts with that, but your final line isn't people being hypocrtical they are clearly and obviously connected. If you believe the police to be 'bullies on ego trips' then you quite clearly would want all defendants to have very good lawyers.

Oh, AND, the average criminal defence lawyer makes around £50k a year - a good but hardly being bankrolled by criminals and legal aid lawyers are making less and less thanks to politicians who want to curry favour with people like you

£50k avg? That seems very low.

6 years to become one? Surely thats starting salary ?

You do realise that most criminal barristers both prosecute and defend don’t you ????

Their clerks are the ones who sort out their cases too.

You do know that Barristers are self employed and out of “ all that money “ that they earn, that they have to pay for the chambers, all the clerical and support staff and all the other many and assorted bills ?

I always thought barristers worked for / were partners in law firms.

When its the crown vs...in a criminal case then i assumed the law firm were on retainer!

 

[COYBL25]

£50k avg? That seems very low.

6 years to become one? Surely thats starting salary ?





I always thought barristers worked for / were partners in law firms.

When its the crown vs...in a criminal case then i assumed the law firm were on retainer!

Nope, you’re thinking of solicitors,.

Only a barrister can represent a client in a Crown Court. The solicitor who originally picked up the case at the magistrates court stage, can assist them in Crown Court, but not prosecute or defend.

They aren’t on retainers, but “ set fees “ are paid depending on the offence.

What this means is that the barrister may end up working many hours unpaid, if the offence is complex, but tied to a set fee.

I’ve got good mates who are barristers and they are amongst the hardest working people I know.

 

[Zatara]

Nope, you’re thinking of solicitors,.

Only a barrister can represent a client in a Crown Court. The solicitor who originally picked up the case at the magistrates court stage, can assist them in Crown Court, but not prosecute or defend.

They aren’t on retainers, but “ set fees “ are paid depending on the offence.

What this means is that the barrister may end up working many hours unpaid, if the offence is complex, but tied to a set fee.

I’ve got good mates who are barristers and they are amongst the hardest working people I know.

No mate i thought barristers came from the lawfirm

So, a barrister is self employed and then earns a 'set fee' if acting for the crown prosecution?

Then if theyre working in opposition they pick/choose their own fees?

 

[COYBL25]

No mate i thought barristers came from the lawfirm

So, a barrister is self employed and then earns a 'set fee' if acting for the crown prosecution?

Then if theyre working in opposition they pick/choose their own fees?

It’s not a law firm as such, they work from a chambers, which isn’t the same - it’s a group of barristers, who are self employed and pay the costs of running the chambers.

The defence barristers get paid from legal aid ( a set fee again ) dependent on the client.

If the client is able to pay for their defence and fails the test for legal aid, they have to pay the lot - which can be a hell of a lot.

Conversely, if the client is wealthy, they can pick and choose the best barristers, as they can afford to pay for them.

So, you could have a case, where you have someone who is guilty as sin, represented by one of the best in the land ( expensive ) versus a young quite poorly paid prosecution barrister.

 

[Zatara]

It’s not a law firm as such, they work from a chambers, which isn’t the same - it’s a group of barristers, who are self employed and pay the costs of running the chambers.

The defence barristers get paid from legal aid ( a set fee again ) dependent on the client.

If the client is able to pay for their defence and fails the test for legal aid, they have to pay the lot - which can be a hell of a lot.

Conversely, if the client is wealthy, they can pick and choose the best barristers, as they can afford to pay for them.

So, you could have a case, where you have someone who is guilty as sin, represented by one of the best in the land ( expensive ) versus a young quite poorly paid prosecution barrister.

When people get a barrister through legal aid or go for a cheap one then theyre all going to have the inexperienced/unsuccessful ones then...

Surely the crown will bring in the big hitters for the high profile cases -- which i assume barristers take despite the low fees?

 

[COYBL25]

When people get a barrister through legal aid or go for a cheap one then theyre all going to have the inexperienced/unsuccessful ones then...

Surely the crown will bring in the big hitters for the high profile cases -- which i assume barristers take despite the low fees?

Not necessarily, as it could mean the difference between the barrister working or not working, so they take what they can get most of the time.

You’re right, the Crown do bring in the big hitters for the big cases.

It would be an unequal match otherwise:

Like everything in life, it’s skewed towards those who can afford it.

 

[Zatara]

Not necessarily, as it could mean the difference between the barrister working or not working, so they take what they can get most of the time.

You’re right, the Crown do bring in the big hitters for the big cases.

It would be an unequal match otherwise:

Like everything in life, it’s skewed towards those who can afford it.

@dead_soft was saying "the avg criminal defence lawyer makes £50k a year'.

Ive assumed he meant barrister (?) does that seem about right?

I thought they were on far more than that -- maybe as a starting salary...

 

[COYBL25]

@dead_soft was saying "the avg criminal defence lawyer makes £50k a year'.

Ive assumed he meant barrister (?) does that seem about right?

I thought they were on far more than that -- maybe as a starting salary...

I’d say the average defence solicitor, who isn’t a partner probably earns between 40k - 50k.

If you crunched their hours, compared to their earnings, they are quite poorly paid.

The CPS solicitors ( prosecution ) probably earn less.

The days of the law being a gravy train, other than for a select few are long gone.