Current Affairs 2017 General Election

[bring the ghost on]

There's good stuff in pretty much every manifesto, there's even plenty of good ideas in the Tories and Lib Dems manifestos - but as a package, all 3 are pretty grim.

What did you find terrible about Labour's manifesto? I would honestly struggle to get vocal enough to call it grim, personally, but interested to know.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Even in that laughably bad hit piece (describing McDonnell as a "Marxist Leninist Trotskyist" for instance, or saying that Corbyn "flaunted Gerry Adams in the House of Commons as his guest", when Adams had been elected as an MP the year before), there is nothing to suggest that Corbyn thought those murders were justified - let alone that he gave "aid and comfort" to the IRA.

Its a mishmash of links-to and spoke-to crap that would never be accepted in other circumstances, such as (for example) pointing out how many Tory MPs go on junkets to Saudi Arabia.

I've no idea about the Saudi instance you raise but obviously if there's any promotion or glorification of terror, then that's despicable and should be condemned. But it's not in the UK.

But I'm more concerned with here, where he would be my PM. I agree the columnist has an agenda, but she is actually from Dublin so somewhat impartial. The facts are all true. No one who sought a peaceful solution associated with on the run terrorists, or participated in troops out rallies, or met only with one side of the problem. I want to live here peacefully with no one continuing to justify the mindless violence we had. It actually hurts me when anyone, on any side is allowed to give justifications. I can't trust Corbyn on this until he at least apologises for his previous actions. At least McDonnell has had the decency to do so. Corbyn has had countless opportunities to do so and continually dodges. This was on bbc radio.... Ignore the video and it's tory crap, but the interview is with Steven Nolan, 5 live.

 

[Mrk]

What did you find terrible about Labour's manifesto? I would honestly struggle to get vocal enough to call it grim, personally, but interested to know.

Mostly the economic policies (although on the economy, the Tories manifesto is nearly as bad for different reasons).

 

[tsubaki]

But I'm more concerned with here, where he would be my PM. I agree the columnist has an agenda, but she is actually from Dublin so somewhat impartial. The facts are all true. No one who sought a peaceful solution associated with on the run terrorists, or participated in troops out rallies, or met only with one side of the problem. I want to live here peacefully with no one continuing to justify the mindless violence we had. It actually hurts me when anyone, on any side is allowed to give justifications.

That is the thing though - he didn't associate with on the run terrorists, people who sought a peaceful solution did participate in the troops out rallies, and from 1983 onwards he has held a position where its his actual job to meet with, talk with and engage the other side of that problem.

I agree that people shouldn't try and justify the unjustifiable, but we should at least try to recognize what it is they actually did.

 

[Blue 1]

It almost seems like the Tories are trying to lose this election because they've realised what an absolute mess Brexit is going to be and don't want to be the ones to have to administer it. Either that or they're so confident of an absolutely crushing majority that they've just thought "sod it", and decided to take the piss as much as possible. That manifesto is just an uncosted hard-right fantasy.

 

[blue76]

Mostly the economic policies (although on the economy, the Tories manifesto is nearly as bad for different reasons).

That is not really clearing up your answer.

 

[orchard]

Another example of how we are not 'in it together' under the Tories, as tax payer's money is distributed for transport infrastructure:


These figures are based on HM Treasury’s Spring 2016 edition of the National Infrastructure Pipeline and ONS sources for population and commuters. The figures show what the government plans to spend on transport infrastructure between 2016/17 and 2020/2021, Only spending that includes public funding is used – projects either publicly funded, or funded by a combination of public and private funding. Figures are in constant prices, with population growth factored in where appropriate.
SPEND SPEND PER CAPITA* SPEND PER COMMUTER**
London £17,063,246,127 £1,869 £4,271
London without Crossrail £12,450,144,254 £1,364 £3,117
Crossrail £4,613,101,873 £505 £1,155
East of England £2,347,011,109 £375 £935
North East £806,352,394 £304 £802
South East £2,662,220,173 £289 £713
North West £2,100,763,232 £289 £740
North £4,258,370,496 £277 £710
West Midlands £1,563,033,104 £266 £696
Yorkshire & the Humber £1,351,254,870 £247 £629
South West £1,227,418,171 £219 £576
East Midlands £924,321,977 £193 £481
*(2016-2021 AVERAGE)
** Commuters to and from the region in 2011
Sources: HM Treasury (2016), National Infrastructure Pipeline Spreadsheet, Spring 2016 update; ONS (2016) Subnational Population Projections for Local Authorities in England; and ONS (2016) Census: WU01UK - Location of usual residence and place of work by sex.

 

[Mrk]

That is not really clearing up your answer.

I'm very sorry you feel this way.

 

[blue76]

I'm very sorry you feel this way.

Honestly, it's ok.

 

[bring the ghost on]

Mostly the economic policies (although on the economy, the Tories manifesto is nearly as bad for different reasons).

Which economic policies do you have a problem with?

 

[tsubaki]

Peter Oborne (ex-Mail, ex-Telegraph political journalist) takes a look at the foreign policy elements in the main party manifestos:

It is more than 20 years since the emergence of Tony Blair as Labour leader in the early 1990s led to the deliberate eradication of genuine, substantial difference between Britain’s two main political parties.

Labour under Blair and the Conservatives under David Cameron shared identical policies. They both wanted to "marketise" the public sector. They had fundamentally the same views on taxation and spending.

Foreign policy on both sides was literally identical. The leadership of both Labour and the Conservatives backed the wars in Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan, the alliance with Saudi Arabia and the Sunni states in the Gulf.

London did what it was told by Washington.

This was terrible for democracy, but very few politicians minded. Under the Blair-Cameron system parties belonged to hugely rich donors. Activists were viewed with contempt and hostility.

This was the situation under Blair, his Labour successor Gordon Brown and then Cameron. Nick Clegg ended up destroying his own Liberal Democrat party by embracing this anti-democratic politics when he joined Cameron's coalition government as a junior partner between 2010 and 2015.

This cross-party consensus has been smashed, thanks to Jeremy Corbyn, the current Labour leader. Whatever one thinks of Corbyn's political views (and I disagree with many of them), British democracy owes him a colossal debt of gratitude for restoring genuine political debate to Britain.

And of course his extremely brave and radical decision to break with the foreign policy analysis of Blair and his successors explains why he is viewed with such hatred and contempt across so much of the media and within the Westminster political establishment.

 

[Donald Twain]

It almost seems like the Tories are trying to lose this election because they've realised what an absolute mess Brexit is going to be and don't want to be the ones to have to administer it. Either that or they're so confident of an absolutely crushing majority that they've just thought "sod it", and decided to take the piss as much as possible. That manifesto is just an uncosted hard-right fantasy.

This neatly sums it up !

 

[flibbyflob]

Tories have been fairly quiet for last week or so apart from just saying that the Labour manifesto is total fantasy and saying nothing about their own. I think their juggernaut will roll into action in the last fortnight with a campaign against Corbyn and McDonnell about anything and everrything they have said going back 30 years about IRA and any other "Terrorist" organisations and they know the public won't vote for them then with the backing of the Murdoch media behind them to spread the word.

 

[Mrk]

Which economic policies do you have a problem with?

Pretty much all of them (I'm a Liberal, that should go some way as to explain why...)

 

[Number_25]

Polls tomorrow should be telling.