Usmanov

[Lee Smith]

Loans are readily available below 3%, but you have been borrowing at 7-8% despite having the money in the bank.

Oh hello....

 

[gwladysnight]

@catcherintherye has @gwladysnight answered your question about where he believes you can get a £100mil+ loan at under 3% ?

Spurs have borrowed £175m at 0.5%, Arsenal in 2006 when the Bank of England base rate was 5% borrowed £210m at 5.14%. Liverpool's owners borrowed £110m for the Main stand at 1.24%.

We are paying 7% because it is the Club who is borrowing the money and not the owners. It is the club that has a charge placed on it and is liable for the debt.

Why would someone with the money Usmanov has do that ?

 

[Zatara]

Spurs have borrowed £175m at 0.5%, Arsenal in 2006 when the Bank of England base rate was 5% borrowed £210m at 5.14%. Liverpool's owners borrowed £110m for the Main stand at 1.24%.

We are paying 7% because it is the Club who is borrowing the money and not the owners. It is the club that has a charge placed on it and is liable for the debt.

Why would someone with the money Usmanov has do that ?

So, you dont know anywhere who offers a £100mil+ loan at 3% then...

 

[gwladysnight]

Oh hello....

The 'you' I was referring to was Catcher.

One minute he was saying he could fund his investments himself but chose to borrow at 7-8%. The next he stated he had very little capital.

 

[gwladysnight]

So, you dont know anywhere who offers a £100mil+ loan at 3% then...

I have just showed you two examples of clubs have borrowed money at way below 3%. Plus I showed you Arsenal who borrowed money at 0.14% above the base rate in 2006.

 

[Zatara]

I have just showed you two examples of clubs have borrowed money at way below 3%. Plus I showed you Arsenal who borrowed money at 0.14% above the base rate in 2006.

Youve been using 'present tense' yet this example is 15 years ago.

Once again, who is offering £100mil+ loans at 3% ?

 

[Brisan123]

Oh hello....

You’re a latecomer to the party
We’ve all known for a while now

 

[gwladysnight]

Youve been using 'present tense' yet this example is 15 years ago.

Once again, who is offering £100mil+ loans at 3% ?

Spurs are paying 0.5% and Liverpool are paying 1.24%. United has a £150m RCF with Bank of America at Libor +1.25/1.75.

 

[Efcjake]

Spurs have borrowed £175m at 0.5%, Arsenal in 2006 when the Bank of England base rate was 5% borrowed £210m at 5.14%. Liverpool's owners borrowed £110m for the Main stand at 1.24%.

You can't throw around Spurs pandemic loan like it is some sort of industry standard. It was a unique situation and isn't something normal. Then you go back 15 years for arsenal and the best you found was 5%.

Regarding LFC the echo says that the interest rate has been adjusted and may continue to be so.

This is a quote from your ceo in 2019.

"FSG took out the loan in America to finance the stadium redevelopment. Two years ago accounts showed that the interest rate payable was 1.24% and that has since gone up to 2.4%."

I wonder what it is up to now since it doesn't appear they locked in a rate. What is even funnier is at the beginning of 2014 they were telling the papers it was an interest free loan.

We are paying 7% because it is the Club who is borrowing the money and not the owners. It is the club that has a charge placed on it and is liable for the debt.

Why would someone with the money Usmanov has do that ?

Because it helps the cash flow and builds the company's credit rating.

Also Moshiri may be making more than that 7% if he invests it himself.

 

[zukai12_]

Our only hope is that this guy gives us the Chelsea treatment

 

[gwladysnight]

You can't throw around Spurs pandemic loan like it is some sort of industry standard. It was a unique situation and isn't something normal. Then you go back 15 years for arsenal and the best you found was 5%.

Regarding LFC the echo says that the interest rate has been adjusted and may continue to be so.

This is a quote from your ceo in 2019.

"FSG took out the loan in America to finance the stadium redevelopment. Two years ago accounts showed that the interest rate payable was 1.24% and that has since gone up to 2.4%."

I wonder what it is up to now since it doesn't appear they locked in a rate. What is even funnier is at the beginning of 2014 they were telling the papers it was an interest free loan.



Because it helps the cash flow and builds the company's credit rating.

Also Moshiri may be making more than that 7% if he invests it himself.

Shall we just drop the snide remarks and look at the truth from their accounts.

Firstly they do not pay interest on the Intercompany loan, so it doesn't matter what rate their owners are paying.

Secondly they are borrowing £200m through an RCF at 1.21%.

We are paying 7% to a murky offshore company because the traditional banks won't touch us and the owner won't provide us with an inter-company loan.

Even United who are subject to leveraged debt are paying Libor +1.25/1.75%.

 

[blueblue]

Spurs are paying 0.5% and Liverpool are paying 1.24%. United has a £150m RCF with Bank of America at Libor +1.25/1.75.

I have been dipping in and out of this since yesterday , you have made your point about interest rates and I don't know or quite frankly care if you are wrong or right.

But, at this stage what point are you trying to make ?
Moshiri doesn't know how to borrow cheap money ?
Moshiri is a bad business man ?
Everton do not have the financial credibility to borrow cheap money ?

We have seen that both Moshiri and Usmanov have been inventive in getting money into the club.
We know that shortly the new ground should begin to get developed and that finance will be needed for that.

Surely that is the issue that you should be looking at more than anything else because if they are so inept at borrowing money at the right rate then this is where the real crisis will strike.

 

[Efcjake]

We are paying 7% to a murky offshore company because the traditional banks won't touch us and the owner won't provide us with an inter-company loan.

Oh you mean like the 100 million interest free loan we repaid with a share issue that got you kicking off in the first place?

 

[gwladysnight]

I have been dipping in and out of this since yesterday , you have made your point about interest rates and I don't know or quite frankly care if you are wrong or right.

But, at this stage what point are you trying to make ?
Moshiri doesn't know how to borrow cheap money ?
Moshiri is a bad business man ?
Everton do not have the financial credibility to borrow cheap money ?

We have seen that both Moshiri and Usmanov have been inventive in getting money into the club.
We know that shortly the new ground should begin to get developed and that finance will be needed for that.

Surely that is the issue that you should be looking at more than anything else because if they are so inept at borrowing money at the right rate then this is where the real crisis will strike.

The point is that the chances of us being effectively owned by Usmanov are slim to Nil. Personally I think we are almost certainly owned by Moshiri, and we have to start to wonder how long he will be able to keep funding the losses we are sustaining.

I think Everton has very little credibility to borrow money cheaply. We have posted a quarter of a billion of losses over the last three years, and we are almost entirely reliant on TV revenues for income. We are in a situation in which wages are 85% of our turnover. That is unsustainable.

As you say we now need to find the funding to build BMD. Who is going to lend money to a company that can't even get a revolving credit facility at a decent rate.

 

[Efcjake]

Shall we just drop the snide remarks and look at the truth from their accounts.



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Firstly they do not pay interest on the Intercompany loan, so it doesn't matter what rate their owners are paying.

Secondly they are borrowing £200m through an RCF at 1.21%.

We are paying 7% to a murky offshore company because the traditional banks won't touch us and the owner won't provide us with an inter-company loan.

Even United who are subject to leveraged debt are paying Libor +1.25/1.75%.

So what's the difference between FSG arranging a loan and having LFC pay them back in installments or Moshiri giving the club an interest free loan and accepting repayment in the form of equity with shares valued at the market price?