Lewisefc92
Player Valuation: £1m
Correct, all because Gareth Barry wasn't playing
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Correct, all because Gareth Barry wasn't playing
....I'm not convinced about the 'snide' requirement, we just need players who are not afraid to mix it and can look after themselves.
Much was made of Van de Hauwe in the mid-80s team but he wasn't a snide, he was a very classy defender. Reid and Bracewell could mix it in midfield and Shard and Gray were capable of looking after themselves.
Much was made of Van de Hauwe in the mid-80s team but he wasn't a snide, he was a very classy defender. Reid and Bracewell could mix it in midfield and Shard and Gray were capable of looking after themselves.
orly
Please check with me for Blammo criteria
I agree with you @Eggs, but our problem is very neatly encapsulated by Mark 'the Grock' Noble's snidery in the West Ham home game. He's not as good as Barry / Barkley / McCarthy (in-form) but made the most telling contribution of the game when he ran over and made absolutely certain the ref sent off Mirallas - while also taking the opportunity to annoy everyone else.
We seem to be trying to keep McCarthy's hamstrings from exploding again - and this fear of injury has utterly taken the edge off him. He's not fit, he's not in form, and he's not contributing.
I do not think it's a stereotypical snide player that we need as @Eggs mentions, but rather players who've got some fight and guile in them.
Far too often we do not impose ourselves on other teams; be that physically with some tackles and holding their ground, or verbally dominating.
The first element is that we're too easily beaten off the ball when in possession while seemingly often reluctant to commit to those 50/50 balls.
How often have you seen us losing the ball far too easily or players not wholeheartedly going for those lose balls, which is often critical in a game.
By committing yourself to the above, combined with some hard tackles, you impose yourself on the opposition and that's a huge mental positive.
As a person who played cricket and rugby as a youngster, I was embedded with the belief that winning the mental battle was a factor of a win.
Standing your ground... giving them some sledging... showing that although maybe you're not as strong physically, you're not to be messed with.
Simple things like that mean that your opponent may just hesitate slightly or they may not go in for the challenge at 100% knowing you will.
Slowly but surely, I believe Martinez's overly-positive attitude has seeped into the core of our squad and we've become fragile and non-imposing.
You see when we concede how our heads drop as they stroll back to the halfway line, hands on hips and with no verbal discussion... it's timid.
Yes a snide player may help change all of the above, however I think the problem is much more deep rooted than that. They're just too nice!
Far too often we do not impose ourselves on other teams; be that physically with some tackles and holding their ground, or verbally dominating.
The first element is that we're too easily beaten off the ball when in possession while seemingly often reluctant to commit to those 50/50 balls.
How often have you seen us losing the ball far too easily or players not wholeheartedly going for those lose balls, which is often critical in a game.
By committing yourself to the above, combined with some hard tackles, you impose yourself on the opposition and that's a huge mental positive.
As a person who played cricket and rugby as a youngster, I was embedded with the belief that winning the mental battle was a factor of a win.
Standing your ground... giving them some sledging... showing that although maybe you're not as strong physically, you're not to be messed with.
Simple things like that mean that your opponent may just hesitate slightly or they may not go in for the challenge at 100% knowing you will.
Slowly but surely, I believe Martinez's overly-positive attitude has seeped into the core of our squad and we've become fragile and non-imposing.
You see when we concede how our heads drop as they stroll back to the halfway line, hands on hips and with no verbal discussion... it's timid.
Yes a snide player may help change all of the above, however I think the problem is much more deep rooted than that. They're just too nice!
....I know where your coming from and although times change I think it is useful to look at the mid80s team because they were a successful model. I don't remember anybody in that side chasing after referees telling them to send players off. They could mix it if needed but had quality to win games. You need a mix of players and they all have to have the right winning mentality and attitude but I'm still not convinced of the snide requirement. Bruce Rioch was a snide but it didn't get us anywhere.
Great thread!
Although I too have enjoyed Mr. Martinez's hi-tempo pass and movement game, I'm afraid the time has come to revert to what we know best.
Which is why I wholeheartedly agree with a return to the 'Dogs of War' midfield, coupled with a 4-4-2 formation and a partnership of Funes-Mori up front with Rom, especially if we persist with a long ball game like yesterday.
IMHO, this would not only halt the steady slide in the table, but see is right through To the final. Not pretty, and probably goes against the grain, but when needs must...
Ironically, it might also save his job.
Although I too have enjoyed Mr. Martinez's hi-tempo pass and movement game, I'm afraid the time has come to revert to what we know best.
Which is why I wholeheartedly agree with a return to the 'Dogs of War' midfield, coupled with a 4-4-2 formation and a partnership of Funes-Mori up front with Rom, especially if we persist with a long ball game like yesterday.
IMHO, this would not only halt the steady slide in the table, but see is right through To the final. Not pretty, and probably goes against the grain, but when needs must...
Ironically, it might also save his job.
Besic, but he's actually more " he plays like he's assed" than a snide but I think he could be that to
RFUS
Anustart
It is the most spineless Everton team I can recall.
The one thing I never wanted us to lose from the Moyes era was the fight and passion we had. Rarely ever had back to back defeats. Rarely surrendered games. Rarely ever followed a bad first half with a bad second one.
Whether it was a team thing or just Moyes being good at bollocking those who needed it, it's something we've lost. If Everton are winning with 10 to go, we bottle it. If we're losing with 10 to go, we don't take it up a notch and fight for it. We're utterly spineless.
The one thing I never wanted us to lose from the Moyes era was the fight and passion we had. Rarely ever had back to back defeats. Rarely surrendered games. Rarely ever followed a bad first half with a bad second one.
Whether it was a team thing or just Moyes being good at bollocking those who needed it, it's something we've lost. If Everton are winning with 10 to go, we bottle it. If we're losing with 10 to go, we don't take it up a notch and fight for it. We're utterly spineless.
my two grand daughters have more snide than our lot.
Just like their manager, this side have an arrogant expectation of results but are unwilling/unable/unprepared to finish. Can't finish a clearance, can't finish a tackle, can't finish a strike on goal.
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orly
Please check with me for Blammo criteria
The foul Snivelley got booked for in the away leg vs City summed him up. Pointless, damage already done, had been given the run-around and was looking for a leveller. Really desperate stuff.
People were complaining (correctly) about lack of snide in Moyeses team too, but it's got worse as Martinez signs yes men and gets rid of the Eto'o & Distin's, Garbutt's and others.
While I appreciate what the OP is getting at, I don't find the absence of a snide particularly concerning. Or at least not as concerning as the absence of leadership. Martinez has made great effort to stress the responsibility he gives to young players but, while great when working, the likes of Lukaku, Stones and Barkley are not quite at the point where they have a selfless dedication to the team.
Our most senior players - Jags, Baines and Barry - are all too passive: all, in fact, good players themselves in need of an exacting captain. Jags gave Lukaku some stick yesterday when he failed to get on the back post when we had a corner, but that was pretty rare. Our young players need to know there's a proven winner on the pitch with them who is ready to give them a real b-ll-k-ng if they let their standards slip.
There's only so many times you can watch your player give the ball away in his own half and praise him for expressing himself. There will be a pretty big limit on how far these outstanding young talents of ours will develop if they don't learn what it takes to be a winner.
Our most senior players - Jags, Baines and Barry - are all too passive: all, in fact, good players themselves in need of an exacting captain. Jags gave Lukaku some stick yesterday when he failed to get on the back post when we had a corner, but that was pretty rare. Our young players need to know there's a proven winner on the pitch with them who is ready to give them a real b-ll-k-ng if they let their standards slip.
There's only so many times you can watch your player give the ball away in his own half and praise him for expressing himself. There will be a pretty big limit on how far these outstanding young talents of ours will develop if they don't learn what it takes to be a winner.
We are just too nice. If you look at the West Ham sending off on Saturday, ( granted it was harsh) but within seconds they had 6-7 players in the refs ear surrounding him, protesting. When Mirallas got sent off against them we just shrugged our shoulders and got on with it.
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