Tim Howard

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davek said:
Ridiculous comparisons.

Liverpool and Spurs spent hundreds of millions and fell way short and the managers had to pay the price. Leicester were nearly relegated last season, so who wouldn't sack the fruitcake Pearson who also had massive disciplinary issues? Southampton sacked Adkins because he had them 15th in the table and out of their depth in the PL.

A moderately spending Everton under Martinez: 5th, 11th and currently 8th.

Yeah, dead lucky to still have a job. He lives a charmed existence, for sure. :coffee:
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Love these distopian worlds where Everton are this special club with the exact perfect conditions to excuse any underperformance.

If you're arguing that our board have no ambition therefore will not go for a better manager, I fully agree with you. If you're arguing that Everton are a unique club who would not benefit from getting a better manager then I don't.

Your Southampton explanation is bizarre. He had brought them up and it was their first season in the league, he was easily keeping them up as well. Their owners though cast sentiment aside and used their prem status to attract one of Europe's top young managers. He in turn attracted good players, and when he went instead of plumping for who was available on the south coast or in house they went for another ambitious European name. That club has shot forward from hoping to stay in the league to competing for Europe. When Moyes went our shortlist was Martinez, Stubbs, Unsworth and Neville. Three in house with no experience and one who relegated Wigan but then won a cup. Kenwright's decision couldn't just hang on that one cup run. There was zero ambition shown in that appointment. There was zero ambition shown when he got off with taking our best squad into a relegation scrap. In another club he would have been fired, end of.

To bring it back on topic. If he selects Howard after Robles' recent performances, he is writing his own P45. The Colorado Rapids might save his job though if they take Tim. Worrying trait though if it does happen knowing that Martinez cannot see this glaring problem, or even worse, can see it but is not bold enough to act on it.
 

Saint Domingo said:
Love these distopian worlds where Everton are this special club with the exact perfect conditions to excuse any underperformance.

If you're arguing that our board have no ambition therefore will not go for a better manager, I fully agree with you. If you're arguing that Everton are a unique club who would not benefit from getting a better manager then I don't.
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No, I'm arguing that this manager we have now has done enough given the circumstances to get into good/decent league positions, transform the way we play and bring through a raft of quality young talent that will add a lot of value to this squad both on and off the field. And I'm correct to argue it.

Saint Domingo said:
Your Southampton explanation is bizarre. He had brought them up and it was their first season in the league, he was easily keeping them up as well. Their owners though cast sentiment aside and used their prem status to attract one of Europe's top young managers. He in turn attracted good players, and when he went instead of plumping for who was available on the south coast or in house they went for another ambitious European name. That club has shot forward from hoping to stay in the league to competing for Europe. When Moyes went our shortlist was Martinez, Stubbs, Unsworth and Neville. Three in house with no experience and one who relegated Wigan but then won a cup. Kenwright's decision couldn't just hang on that one cup run. There was zero ambition shown in that appointment. There was zero ambition shown when he got off with taking our best squad into a relegation scrap. In another club he would have been fired, end of.
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Not true. The club also approached Pereira and Rangnick. They settled on Martinez and it's been a good choice.

Saint Domingo said:
To bring it back on topic. If he selects Howard after Robles' recent performances, he is writing his own P45. The Colorado Rapids might save his job though if they take Tim. Worrying trait though if it does happen knowing that Martinez cannot see this glaring problem, or even worse, can see it but is not bold enough to act on it.
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This is a straw man argument. Howard hasn't played and isn't getting recalled either. Martinez made that plain yesterday. What's all the fuss about?

As for lack of boldness in this respect: he's also dropped Stones and Baines because he recognises other players in the squad have come in and took their opportunity.
 
Saint Domingo said:
Happened twice already. Last season's league placing was enough to get him fired from most top half premier league teams. In that respect he is fortunate to be at a club that afford their managers a lot of time. Look how Liverpool replaced Rodgers, Southampton Atkins, Spurs Redknapp then AVB, Leicester Pearson. The nice morale thing to do? No. Did they all end up with better quality managers? Yes. Had Martinez been at any of these spouting his 'I'm not interested in clean sheets, Tim is having an incredible moment' he would have been gone in the blink of an eye. They've got a word for this that begins with A but some Evertonians despite what is written on the crest consider any aspect of this word to be kopite behaviour.
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We also were the English team that went furthest in Europe last year, and it was obvious Martinez was building something.

You bang on all the time about ambition - i'm guessing that's the word.

You say that Stoke and Newcastle have it because they spent loads of money on tosh in January....

Well, Stoke haven't won a game in six now and Newcastle are still awful.

I don't think you yourself know what ambition means...

And with the teams you listed...

Leicester - Pearson's position at that club was completely different. He'd kept them up but he had proved he was a bit mental (McCarthur incident) and there was also that unsavoury situation involving his son.

Spurs - Change managers every two or three seasons.

Liverpool - Klopp has literally taken them no where. They play torrid football as well. Squeezed through into a league cup final.
 
BlueToff said:
We also were the English team that went furthest in Europe last year, and it was obvious Martinez was building something.

You bang on all the time about ambition - i'm guessing that's the word.

You say that Stoke and Newcastle have it because they spent loads of money on tosh in January....

Well, Stoke haven't won a game in six now and Newcastle are still awful.

I don't think you yourself know what ambition means...

And with the teams you listed...

Leicester - Pearson's position at that club was completely different. He'd kept them up but he had proved he was a bit mental (McCarthur incident) and there was also that unsavoury situation involving his son.

Spurs - Change managers every two or three seasons.

Liverpool - Klopp has literally taken them no where. They play torrid football as well. Squeezed through into a league cup final.
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Ha, after that post and you accuse me of not knowing what ambition is. Do you think Everton football club display ambition? I don't.

Where are Spurs in the table? I'm sure you're ready with an excuse for that. Think they'll be ditching Pochettino soon? No. 'Squeezed into a league cup final', honestly mate, I'd take that over being squeezed out of one. Klopp took over a poor squad and has barely been there, Martinez is in his third year, my point is about Liverpool's board punishing Rodger's underperformance but you want to judge his work after a few months?

As usual utterly bizarre arguments.
 

Saint Domingo said:
Your Southampton explanation is bizarre. He had brought them up and it was their first season in the league, he was easily keeping them up as well. Their owners though cast sentiment aside and used their prem status to attract one of Europe's top young managers. He in turn attracted good players, and when he went instead of plumping for who was available on the south coast or in house they went for another ambitious European name. That club has shot forward from hoping to stay in the league to competing for Europe. When Moyes went our shortlist was Martinez, Stubbs, Unsworth and Neville. Three in house with no experience and one who relegated Wigan but then won a cup. Kenwright's decision couldn't just hang on that one cup run. There was zero ambition shown in that appointment. There was zero ambition shown when he got off with taking our best squad into a relegation scrap. In another club he would have been fired, end of.

To bring it back on topic. If he selects Howard after Robles' recent performances, he is writing his own P45. The Colorado Rapids might save his job though if they take Tim. Worrying trait though if it does happen knowing that Martinez cannot see this glaring problem, or even worse, can see it but is not bold enough to act on it.
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One of Europe's top young managers? He'd literally only ever managed Espanyol beforehand and was bottom of the table with 9 points from 13 matches when he was sacked. I really do think that a lot of the ground work for Pochettino was made by an unfairly sacked Villas-Boas, but perhaps I am a little biased. I will admit though that I agree with you on Howard, if he drops him now it will be even worse than last year.

Keep fighting the good fight @davek
 

Not going to the MLS either this season as yet according to RM the rumours are rubbish!
Timmy we are stuck with him great contract negotiations =NOT!
to contract timmy to the age of 39 on top wages was plain stupid!
 

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