Ross Barkley

[Amw79]

Bolasie a player a lot on here have slated for blunting our attacks by running down blind alleys and not being creative - has the past two seasons been top ten for the most dribbles per game

Yeah, if other attacking stats were going down as well it could be a problem.

But more key passes and chances, but less dribbles for me indicates more intelligent use of the ball.

 

[MikeH72]

Just checked (OCD about stats / numbers)

Whoscored.com has the same 13/14 numbers - 6 goals 0 assists.

Wow. So according to the actual stats, he's improving his creativity rather than having it drained out of him. Wouldn't you know it.

 

[hallamblue]

You can't compare Alli to Barkley, they are totally different. Alli is a Cahill type, brilliant runs in behind, positional and timing sense is superb, but can't tackle or play long passes particularly well. Barkley has a great eye for a pass, and a good long shot on him. He doesn't have the quick thinking of a Scholes, Gascoigne or Beardsley which prevents him from being world class, but he has got better at getting the ball and moving it on quicker, rather than hesitating and losing the impetus of attacks. Also his tracking back and tackling has improved massively in the last 10 games or so, which is vital for the way most teams play these days.

 

[Amw79]

Wow. So according to the actual stats, he's improving his creativity rather than having it drained out of him. Wouldn't you know it.

Yeah, as I said above - less dribbling, but more creation of chances and key passes, says to me - improved intelligence in use of the ball.

 

[truebluejersey]

Trying to keep it simple here with all the stats this and percentages that.

IMO we (the supporters) should
get behind the fella and let him progress.

I think the lad has shown enough to suggest he could be a talent, but as soon as his form dips, the crowd get on his back
and he gets worse, its self fulfilling.

By the way I have been one of those supporters who have been frustrated with him previously.

 

[Amw79]

Just to hammer to the point home, here's the per game averages for the same metrics, over the 4 seasons, which is a better comparison, given the different numbers of games played per year. Rather than doing the mental gymnastics of working it out

 

[Black Belt Jones]

Reckon his weight is an important stat. He was playing with two arses in his shorts under the Martinez regime of pies and ale - because who needs fitness in the premier league when you can stroke the ball around the park eh?

Moves like a professional footballer now - actually looked like he was carrying an injury at times last season he was moving in such a laboured way.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Just to hammer to the point home, here's the per game averages for the same metrics, over the 4 seasons, which is a better comparison, given the different numbers of games played per year. Rather than doing the mental gymnastics of working it out

View attachment 35138

Ouch, someone won't be happy with that, he's getting better.

 

[Amw79]

Ouch, someone won't be happy with that, he's getting better.

If you mean Dave, I agree with him over the general need for more distribution of goals in our team, and Barkley Is one who you'd hope steps up with more.

But the dribbling stat just seemed quite a narrow measure of attacking play and thought I'd look into. Must admit I was quite surprised with the improvement in the stats I picked.

But must be said, there may be others stats which don't show the same - passing stats, shots per game etc.

 

[hallamblue]

Is there a stat for how many times a player loses the ball and sets up an attack for the opposition? Not being facetious, it's just Ross's ball retention seems to have improved and I was wondering if that's measurable.

 

[Amw79]

Is there a stat for how many times a player loses the ball and sets up an attack for the opposition? Not being facetious, it's just Ross's ball retention seems to have improved and I was wondering if that's measurable.

Ha, think there is on Squawka - errors leading to chances or something.

I'll look at those later.

 

[paulbefc]

I still think despite the clear improvement this season he's still nowhere near his potential. I think he's a lot more polished now and loses the ball less but he could take more risks because he has the talent to pull off things other players can't. There's no real weakness in his game apart from that.

 

[davek]

I think he was crying out for the facets of the game he is displaying now mate, he needed to be more disciplined, he really didn't develop under Martinez if he had continued along that trajectory he would remain a one in five player in terms of effectiveness. He now influences every game albeit in a more disciplined way. What Ross has in creativity cant be coached its innate and will always be there, the coach able part of his game and displaying now can be. I still think he needs to hone his creative and disciplined skills and find the right balance but i look at that as a process rather then an event.

Th goal for Ross has to be to get to the level of Gerrard and Lampard.

Gerrard and Lampard weren't tasked with tracking back and winding their necks in while on the ball. They played for teams that encouraged them to go out and dominate games.

He's gone backwards under Koeman overall. You say that he didn't develop until Koeman arrived. But his best season under Martinez was last season. How does that scan with what you believe?

There's something added to his game now in terms of being a lot more circumspect and not losing possession, but what s lost is something more valuable, IMO...and the opinion of others.

 

[davek]

I understand where you are coming from Dave and I have a lot of empathy for your point of view. If Ross were a true creative number 10 I would have agreed fully with you. Problem is, having watched him for the last 4 years, and bear in mind he is absolutely my favourite player, I don't think he is a true number 10. He doesn't have that cuteness/subtlety to his play that he needs, and I just don't think it's in his make up. Players like Alli have it.

Ross is a bit of an enigma and finding the right role for him is probably one of RKs hardest jobs. RM tried to build his team around him which I can fully understand. But when you do that he has to deliver with goals and assists, similar to what Alli is doing now. Quite frankly, he has never delivered enough in that regard. But because he doesn't provide anything else to the team cause, the fans get on his back when things aren't happening for him. Not just that, the whole British media seems to have jumped on the bandwagon also. This "gives the ball away" myth is a prime example and totally untrue. I'm not surprised the lad's confidence was shot earlier in the season. Coincidentally, Alli, who gives the ball away far more than Ross, is given an absolutely free ride on this by the press and by his own fans.

What Koeman has done has changed Ross's role in the team into more of an all round midfielder, one which is able to fit into the team rather than have a team built around him. He's got him fit, got his work rate up and even got him tackling ffs. Slowly, Ross's confidence has come back, his performances have improved immensely, and the fans seem to be completely behind him now. We still rely on him to be our main creative influence because, at the moment, we have nobody else. But when he isn't doing magic in the final third nobody is getting on his back the way they used to because he's still contributing to the team performance. Take Sunday for instance, Everton were practically toothless as an attacking force, but Ross still came out of that game with a lot of credit. What we need, and both you and I have been crying out for this, is a creative player to play alongside and compliment Ross, and then we'd have the perfect combination.

Yes Ross has changed as a player, but I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing provided the club bring in somebody to work alongside him in the summer. I also think you'll see more of those dribbles than this years stats show. I just think he'll pick his moments and don't believer has actually told him not to take players on.

I also think Jenas' comments are wide of the mark. Had me made them months ago they would have been spot on. But we've seen a change in Ross this year and I don't think confidence is an issue with him now.

Some fans are now supportive of Barkley because he works a bit harder and keeps it more simple. Heaven preserve us from those type of fans I say.

WTF would you want to neuter a player like this for in order to turn him into some hard pressing, lacking in adventure drone - they type that litters the PL?

He's basically been reconstructed from a talent that could transform a game to one who fits in with the hard work ethics that surrounds him. It's an absolute shame in football terms.

 

[Carlito]

Barkley has gone a long way towards burying the idea that he's a luxury player who can't be trusted to follow instructions. I hope he carries on as he is.

It'll be interesting to see if he's recalled to the England squad this month, given how heavily it was implied that Southgate was the one who told the press he was 'uncoachable' last year.