Ronald Koeman discussion

[billyblue80]

Good shout on partnerships developing.

Has Baines even had this opportunity since Pienaar died?

No and Vlasic could be the lad to do it. Also Kenny and Davies have a good understanding although I want the Ketwig pulling the strings centrally. For me Koeman isn't giving this team balance or the confidence he speaks of.

 

[royvernon39]

He’s a hard faced pragmatist whose won much more than Everton during the time of his career in football so he’s not gonna throw platitudes at the club or fanbase.

The thing is that he is not a pragmatist. DM was a pragmatist. He knew his team' s limitations but sent them out with a plan and belief. We almost all knew that top footie would not be on show but we could nick a point or three. Yesterday, RK sent out a team that has failed time and time again. No winger, no pace, players out of position - Davies on the wing! Two defensive midfielders at home against a team from Cyprus and having spent truckloads!!

A pragmatist uses his resources in a plan that has clear ambitions. This guy, DK, is a chancer. Great player, no question, and because of that he is getting away with it. If RM had picked yesterday's team and had given that performance, we would be having a communal fit.

 

[riddick]

You would hope so wouldn't you?
Not sure I see the ideas but, also not sure a top manager would replace him knowing that he has no money apart from players ins/outs to change the side?

Oh, i agree. Like @chicoazul said, he is a dour, unlikable person. Which would be fine if we were rolling or even playing great(/unlucky) football. We're literally doing the opposite. I just don't see the reasoning to persist with this. And Im sure people will say "think of the how much we would have to pay him off!" but I almost guarantee those are the same people who were screaming "it's not YOUR money!" when a lot of people were thinking it was madness paying £45m for Sigurdsson.

 

[CRIMHEAD]

Pickford, Kenny, Holgate, Williams, Baines, Morgan, Davies, Siggi, Vlasic, DCL, Niasse

One problem. That lineup still has two poor Center backs and Niasse still can't play in Europa.

 

[Osamabindiesel]

This Sunday will tell us a lot about Koeman. If he doesn't stop this madness by then, he surely belongs in the loony bin.

 

[chicoazul]

You'll be starving for likes unfortunately. Rationality doesn't sate the unquenchable thirst

Admittedly it’s much more fun to post antagonistic tripe to wind up those most angry and arrogant in their views. Maybe I’ll revert again tomorrow. This feels weird.

 

[chicoazul]

The thing is that he is not a pragmatist. DM was a pragmatist. He knew his team' s limitations but sent them out with a plan and belief. We almost all knew that top footie would not be on show but we could nick a point or three. Yesterday, RK sent out a team that has failed time and time again. No winger, no pace, players out of position - Davies on the wing! Two defensive midfielders at home against a team from Cyprus and having spent truckloads!!

A pragmatist uses his resources in a plan that has clear ambitions. This guy, DK, is a chancer. Great player, no question, and because of that he is getting away with it. If RM had picked yesterday's team and had given that performance, we would be having a communal fit.

Fair points mate but a pragmatist is not defined by their results, but by their approach in my humble opinion. Koeman is entirely about the result at the expense of performance. He is not one to demonstrate a great deal of risk in his strategy. Suppose it depends on what your view of pragmatism in football management is, which is naturally subjective.

It also is doing a slight disservice to Koeman to compare him unfavourably against Moyes for runs of poor form. I remember start of seasons to Christmas of abstract rubbish from some Moyes teams, although admittedly with a fraction of the resources that Koeman enjoys.

 

[royvernon39]

RK has been here a full season and a bit. Lets assume that the Europa League is now over - not a biggie to assume because EFC has to win away from home and that rarely happens. Lets assume that CFC knock us out in the League Cup - not a foregone but nearly. The League remains and the 6 million man has no idea what his starting 11 should be.

Things can change rapidly in footie but I reckon that the Koeman Clan will be having to plan what to with their million pay-offs next summer. I don't think they will be too bothered...I can see the press interview now: 'OK.. I tried.. That's football.. The players were afraid of success..Is the cheque in the post?"

 

[Osamabindiesel]

Admittedly it’s much more fun to post antagonistic tripe to wind up those most angry and arrogant in their views. Maybe I’ll revert again tomorrow. This feels weird.

You're living the dream my man. Just try not to get banned again lol

 

[chicoazul]

Oh, i agree. Like @chicoazul said, he is a dour, unlikable person. Which would be fine if we were rolling or even playing great(/unlucky) football. We're literally doing the opposite. I just don't see the reasoning to persist with this. And Im sure people will say "think of the how much we would have to pay him off!" but I almost guarantee those are the same people who were screaming "it's not YOUR money!" when a lot of people were thinking it was madness paying £45m for Sigurdsson.

Excellent, excellent post.

We need to have club ownership which is strong and doesn’t let the most shout in the fanbase be the tail that wags the dog. There’s a reason the tail is next to the anus.

 

[Goat]

Excellent, excellent post.

We need to have club ownership which is strong and doesn’t let the most shout in the fanbase be the tail that wags the dog. There’s a reason the tail is next to the anus.

You think der fans signed Iceland mert?

 

[chicoazul]

RK has been here a full season and a bit. Lets assume that the Europa League is now over - not a biggie to assume because EFC has to win away from home and that rarely happens. Lets assume that CFC knock us out in the League Cup - not a foregone but nearly. The League remains and the 6 million man has no idea what his starting 11 should be.

Things can change rapidly in footie but I reckon that the Koeman Clan will be having to plan what to with their million pay-offs next summer. I don't think they will be too bothered...I can see the press interview now: 'OK.. I tried.. That's football.. The players were afraid of success..Is the cheque in the post?"

This Christmas will mark the halfway point of this “3 year project”. Which is a good point for benchmarking progress.

Will be an interesting time if we’re not progrsssing like as present.

 

[brownmola]

There have been no signs of his favored team selection working. I'd understand persisting with it if there was tangible improvement or signs of it coming together but there are none. If you're going to set up an unorthodox lineup, it better show some capability.

His stubbornness and inability to admit that it isn't working is baffling especially when we look so much more of a threat the last 20 minutes of games when he is forced to make changes that include playing wide players, adding pace, and a proper striker.

 

[chicoazul]

You think der fans signed Iceland mert?

Go away you fat Besic loving Tranmere suiting manatee.

 

[royvernon39]

Fair points mate but a pragmatist is not defined by their results, but by their approach in my humble opinion. Koeman is entirely about the result at the expense of performance. He is not one to demonstrate a great deal of risk in his strategy. Suppose it depends on what your view of pragmatism in football management is, which is naturally subjective.

It also is doing a slight disaeevice to Koeman to compare him unfavourably against Moyes for runs of poor form. I remember start of seasons to Christmas of abstract rubbish from some Moyes teams, although admittedly with a fraction of the resources that Koeman enjoys.

But the money is the point. RK got loads of dosh and bought 4 no.10's. DM had to sell to buy and usually did a top job gradually improving the team. Yes it was often rubbish but we all understood what working for Billy Liar and a small net spend involved. DM was pragmatic, realistic, boring, limited - all of that but the club was getting better.

RK has so far blown the chance of the century. Not since Harry Catterick and Chairman Moores has a manager had a chance to plan a team with lots of available dosh. And Catterick bought well, usually. Think about the weaknesses we have and that RK did not address?

As for RK's non-risk free approach, I would call it fear. Two holding midfielders!! no wingers!! We had to pile on the goals against them, give the team a boost and kick-start the season. No ambition is not a risk-free approach.

We have been beaten at home defore in the Cup by Walsall and Fulham , so its not the end of the world but it looks like another year down the drain, more dreams dashed...