Current Affairs Labour and Anti Semitism.......

[Tubey]

Just for you @peteblue

Think I made the same comparison at the time of that on here.

Beggar's belief that they thought that was acceptable in any way. A desperate attempt to appeal to the UKIP crowd at the time.

The Tories are closet racists in general and have been for a long, long time. I think the same can be said about the left-wing of Labour and anti-semitism. I guess it's because Jews are associated/stereotyped with banking/capitalism so they're blamed for wealth inequality or something?

Honestly don't know - it's so irrational that it's hard to actually understand, but it's crystal clear there's a very real problem with anti-semitism and, specifically, the current Labour party that has been taken over by the hard left of Momentum. It's also crystal clear that Corbyn has either been incompetent with his response to it, or he has consciously not even bothered to respond because he broadly agrees with the anti-semitism. Who knows, it's one or the other - he's either incompetent or complicit; no other options at this point.

 

[Jib in lad]

Think I made the same comparison at the time of that on here.

Beggar's belief that they thought that was acceptable in any way. A desperate attempt to appeal to the UKIP crowd at the time.

The Tories are closet racists in general and have been for a long, long time. I think the same can be said about the left-wing of Labour and anti-semitism. I guess it's because Jews are associated/stereotyped with banking/capitalism so they're blamed for wealth inequality or something?

Honestly don't know - it's so irrational that it's hard to actually understand, but it's crystal clear there's a very real problem with anti-semitism and, specifically, the current Labour party that has been taken over by the hard left of Momentum. It's also crystal clear that Corbyn has either been incompetent with his response to it, or he has consciously not even bothered to respond because he broadly agrees with the anti-semitism. Who knows, it's one or the other - he's either incompetent or complicit; no other options at this point.

Just what do you expect Corbyn to do about people on Twitter and facebook posting anti-Semitic comments this is a matter for the police.

The examples quoted in the commons by Ruth Smeeth that I saw where all off twitter and face book with JC for PM lashed on the end it could be anybody writing these posts maybe even Tories out to cause trouble who knows I don't neither do you .

As I said get the police involved find them and prosecute them , and as for Corbyn being complicit I don't think any serious person thinks that but if it fits the agenda they are pushing then some sick people will use a subject as serious as anti-Semitism to score points says everything you need to know about them.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

You old think so. As you say threatening acts of violence and rape you might expect some response from the police, but I think I read that a number of people had already been prosecuted for similar offences.....

Plenty on the men who threatned Stella Casey and Angele Eagle, but not the specific trolls Luciana Berger Ruth Smeeth or John Mann speak about, and I suppose being the nature of trolls they could in fact be anyone and not necessarily Labour members or Leftis for that matter!

 

[peteblue]

Just what do you expect Corbyn to do about people on Twitter and facebook posting anti-Semitic comments this is a matter for the police.

The examples quoted in the commons by Ruth Smeeth that I saw where all off twitter and face book with JC for PM lashed on the end it could be anybody writing these posts maybe even Tories out to cause trouble who knows I don't neither do you .

As I said get the police involved find them and prosecute them , and as for Corbyn being complicit I don't think any serious person thinks that but if it fits the agenda they are pushing then some sick people will use a subject as serious as anti-Semitism to score points says everything you need to know about them.

If he had stood up at the debate and absolutely slagged off anyone doing this in Labours name including Livingstone, he would have been cheered to the rafters and put this matter behind Labour. But he didn’t.....leaders need to lead....

 

[Jib in lad]

If he had stood up at the debate and absolutely slagged off anyone doing this in Labours name including Livingstone, he would have been cheered to the rafters and put this matter behind Labour. But he didn’t.....leaders need to lead....

Pete you know as well as I do that whatever he says will never be enough to slake the thirst for blood that you and the rest of the haters have for him.

Just look at @Tubey post were he says the "Tories are closet racists in general and have been for a long time" his words not mine yet he still voted for them in the last election that is the level of hatred we are talking about.

 

[Tubey]

Just what do you expect Corbyn to do about people on Twitter and facebook posting anti-Semitic comments this is a matter for the police.

The examples quoted in the commons by Ruth Smeeth that I saw where all off twitter and face book with JC for PM lashed on the end it could be anybody writing these posts maybe even Tories out to cause trouble who knows I don't neither do you .

As I said get the police involved find them and prosecute them , and as for Corbyn being complicit I don't think any serious person thinks that but if it fits the agenda they are pushing then some sick people will use a subject as serious as anti-Semitism to score points says everything you need to know about them.

As @peteblue said, I expect him to lead on the matter and act to eliminate it. Not only has he either been slow or outright failed to do this, in many ways his actions and demeanour is to passively endorse it instead.

If the anti-semitism problem belonged to the Conservatives and Jews were protesting outside parliament directly at Theresa May, you'd be the first criticising her for it. That's the problem with you and a lot of other people on here - tribalism; the complete inability to put aside the default position you hold to judge a situation objectively.

The Tories are closet racists and hold the poor in contempt and all too often act to protect the rich first and foremost, whatever the cost to the poor. Labour under Corbyn have an anti-semitism problem, are a danger to national security due to a ridiculously pacifist approach and their policies would economically ruin the country in my view.

See, that's called balance.

 

[peteblue]

Pete you know as well as I do that whatever he says will never be enough to slake the thirst for blood that you and the rest of the haters have for him.

Just look at @Tubey post were he says the "Tories are closet racists in general and have been for a long time" his words not mine yet he still voted for them in the last election that is the level of hatred we are talking about.

I hate Corbyn. Not the man personally as I expect he’s probably a decent lad. But I hate what he has done to the Labour Party and I hate what he does to our national security by his slavish love of Russia. This antisemitism thing though is just incredible, anyone with any sense would have decried what is happening. During the debate, before he left, he even seemed to be refusing to listen to what was said. No one should defend him over this, no one.....

 

[Toffeeslam]

Some of the stuff that’s been said has been disgraceful and should be condemned fully, bigotry and xenophobia should never be tolerated.

But....I also think that this is also been manipulated to conflate Anti-Semitism with criticism of Israel or stifle criticism of said state

 

[zzr45]

Some of the stuff that’s been said has been disgraceful and should be condemned fully, bigotry and xenophobia should never be tolerated.

But....I also think that this is also been manipulated to conflate Anti-Semitism with criticism of Israel or stifle criticism of said state

What were your thoughts on Idan Tal?

 

[hullefc]

Some of the stuff that’s been said has been disgraceful and should be condemned fully, bigotry and xenophobia should never be tolerated.

But....I also think that this is also been manipulated to conflate Anti-Semitism with criticism of Israel or stifle criticism of said state

Well said. It is designed to stifle debate and criticism of the colonial occupation of Palestine. The despicable and inhumane video of an IDF sniper shooting a Palestinian, then laughing about it saying, 'this would make a good movie. As if it was the scene in Schnidler's List when the Nazi guard got out of bed, scratched his bollocks, got his gun, poured a drink, took aim like a sniper and shot a Jewish. There was near universal silence from parliament. Why? Because to criticise the colonial and illegal occupiers of Palestine is now equated with, 'your anti-semitic'. As a result the IDF are allowed to carry on just shooting and killing people.

 

[hullefc]

Jenny Manson, co-chair of Jewish Voice for Labour, claimed on the Victoria Derbyshire show that she has never heard or seen anti-semitism in the Labour Party. Her main concern is the fear of those in the Labour party being fearful of raising any issues about Israel.

One of the chief architects of anti-semitism in the Labour party Ruth Smeeth, who demanded the expulsion of a Labour Party member for anti-semitism, has deleted her allegation. Smeeth's allegation was central to the chorus of those claiming there is anti-semitism in the Labour Party.

»Marc Wadsworth defends himself against unsubstantiated allegations, now apparently withdrawn…
JVL Introduction

Marc Wadsworth responds to a Guardian article’s reference to the incident that led to his suspension from the party, which he is will be vigorously contesting at a hearing this month.

Subsequent to this letter, Asa Winstanly published an article in the Electronic Intifada (11 April) under the heading Labour Israel lobbyist deletes anti-Semitic “conspiracy” claims

I am not part of Labour’s antisemitism problem
Marc Wadsworth, Guardian Letters,
5 April 2018



Your article (Why Labour continues to struggle with antisemitism, 26 March) gave the entirely wrong impression that I was part of the Labour party’s antisemitism problem.

It said: “In her report, [Shami] Chakrabarti concluded that Labour ‘is not overrun by antisemitism, Islamophobia or other forms of racism’. She did acknowledge that ‘I have heard too many Jewish voices express concern that antisemitism has not been taken seriously enough’ and said that there was ‘an occasionally toxic atmosphere’.

“One example emerged on the day Ruth Smeeth, a Jewish Labour MP, walked out after a party activist Marc Wadsworth accused her of working with rightwing media to attack Corbyn. She tried to complain at the time and said she received no response from the leader’s office, although Wadsworth was suspended.”

I am not an example of antisemitism within the Labour party. Quite the opposite. I did not accuse Ruth Smeeth, whom I did not know was Jewish, of “working with rightwing media to attack Corbyn”. At the launch of the Shami Chakrabarti report, I mentioned an exchange between Kate McCann, the Daily Telegraph’s senior political correspondent, and Ms Smeeth.

Since then I have had to take several news media organisations to task and get them to correct inaccuracies about this.

To make this incorrect claim about me plays into a Jewish media conspiracy theory that I utterly reject and have never espoused. As a letter that you published noted (Labour must reinstate anti-racist activist Marc Wadsworth, 1 February 2017), I have spent a lifetime fighting anti-black racism and antisemitism. Here is the campaign page that gives a proper explanation: www.crowdjustice.com/case/justiceforantiracismcampaigner/

May I note that, during the current debate, rampant anti-black racism and Islamophobia have been negligently ignored. Why?

With lawyers and witnesses who support me, including leading MPs and prominent Jewish Labour members, I will be vigorously contesting my Labour party suspension at a national constitutional committee hearing on 25 April.

Marc Wadsworth
London

________________________________

Extract from Asa Winstanley’s article

The former Israel lobbyist and high-profile Labour lawmaker Ruth Smeeth has deleted a statement from her website which alleged anti-Semitism in Labour.

In one of the most high profile instances of the supposed “anti-Semitism crisis” in the UK’s main opposition party, Smeeth in June 2016 claimed she had been “attacked by a Momentum activist and Jeremy Corbyn supporter who used traditional anti-Semitic slurs to attack me for being part of a ‘media conspiracy.’”

Activist Marc Wadsworth had in fact neither said nor implied anything about Jews. Neither did he use the word “conspiracy.”

Smeeth did not reply to a request for comment. You can read the deleted statement in full below.

…

Wadsworth told The Electronic Intifada: “I am glad the extremely defamatory statement has finally been removed from Ruth Smeeth’s website as I requested way back in 2016.”

But he said he was “disappointed that I have had to wait such a long time for this to happen and have still not received an apology for being smeared as an anti-Semite.”

And here is the tweet, now deleted from Ruth Smeeth’s page (see Labour Israel lobbyist deletes anti-Semitic “conspiracy” claim):

Read the full article.

April 11th, 2018 | Tags: antisemitism allegations, Labour Party disciplinary procedures, Marc Wadsworth | Category: Campaigns.

Smeeth should apologise to Marc Wadsworth in parliament. This whole 'anti-semitism in the Labour party' has been deliberately coordinated to censor criticism of Israel. And for now it seems to be working.

 

[hullefc]

'The Huddle' not that at Celtic Park or the Etihad but sections of the media. Who have been in the forefront of attacking Corbyn including 'anti-semitism'. Jones claims they get 'their heads together and 'agree' on the line to take with issues.

Jones goes on to say the mainstream media

This report in RT is based on the article.


Guardian’s Owen Jones accuses mainstream media of ‘groupthink’, ‘intolerance’ and elitism
Published time: 23 Apr, 2018 15:34Edited time: 24 Apr, 2018 07:50
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© Stefan Kiefer / Global Look Press

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Guardian columnist Owen Jones has fired an opinion-rocket right into the midst of his own kind – journalists. His claim that the mainstream media is an invite-only club run by public school pals has not gone down well.


It began when the author and columnist tweeted some of the lessons he’s learned working in the British media. Labeling the profession a “cult” in the UK, Jones goes on to say the mainstream media (MSM) is “afflicted by a suffocating groupthink, intolerant of critics, hounds internal dissenters, full of people who made it because of connections and/or personal background rather than merit.”

Hurling such accusations against the British media did not solicit a positive reaction from the club’s members. Jones himself described the onslaught that followed against him as an “inferno” of fury… which in turn, sparked an article detailing exactly what is wrong with the UK press.

Journalists from publications across London (where most mainstream outlets are based) were outraged by the comments. There were anecdotes given to disprove Jones – with one reporter even quipping that “no one tells me what to think.”


Kate McCann

✔@KateEMcCann
20 Apr
Like @janemerrick23, @haynesdeborah and others I went to comprehensive school in Yorkshire and university in Newcastle. Had no friends or family in journalism and worked hard to get this job. But ... https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/987229001151369216 …


christinalamb

✔@christinalamb
https://twitter.com/christinalamb/status/987287117624741889

@owenjones84 i went to state school and was first person in my family to ever go to university. I had never met a journalist till i left uni. No one tells me what to think
PS have you noticed we are all women??

12:09 PM - Apr 20, 2018


Jones goes on to describe what’s known as the ‘huddle’ – to put it simply, that’s when reporters get together after Prime Minister’s Questions (or other media events frequented by lobby journalists) to decide what to say or write about. “[L]obby journalists will often stand together and/or walk back to the press lobby together and agree on ‘what just happened,’ if you like,” Jones writes.

Other ways the huddle – or “groupthink,” as he calls it – manifests in the media is through peer pressure. Jones included a comment from right-wing blogger Paul Staines in explanation: “there is for example peer pressure on new hacks to not rock the boat,” even if that pressure is applied by an “exasperated collective groan [from other reporters] if someone asks a dissonant question.”


Mikey Smith

✔@mikeysmith
23 Apr
@OwenJones84 Hi chief. Quick thing. This isn’t what “the huddle” refers to. The huddle is where PM, party and LOTO spox take questions after PMQs. Like a lobby briefing but standing up.

I agree that if it were what you’ve described, it would be astonishing. But it really isn’t. pic.twitter.com/HVEusQonAs


Owen Jones

✔@OwenJones84
https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/988323370105278465

Mikey: I'm aware of what the huddle is. I've interviewed 3 lobby journalists, 2 former, one current, who explained to me that during these huddles, the journalists will discuss the "best line" and interpretation of what they saw. The NS mentions it here:https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/media/2017/08/why-not-let-canary-westminster-lobby-it-could-do-shakeup … pic.twitter.com/mECKxYOrP8

8:47 AM - Apr 23, 2018

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Staines’ comments end by adding that it is “not a conspiracy, just peer pressure.”
Times columnist David Aaronovitch‏, ex-BuzzFeed writer James Ball, Financial Times editorial director Robert Shrimsley‏, and freelance journalist Robin Whitlock were some of many to swipe back at Jones. ITV news royal editor Chris Ship simply tweeted back his educational history, as the virtue signaling and defensiveness told their own story.


Kevin Schofield

✔@PolhomeEditor
20 Apr
I grew up in a working class household, went to state schools, worked my arse off on local papers for years and finally made it to Fleet St (The Sun) at the age of 35. But I guess that doesn't fit the narrative. https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/987229001151369216 …


Chris Ship

✔@chrisshipitv
https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/987263282972160000

Comprehensive school. No family connections in media. No help. No nepotism. But a lot of hard work @OwenJones84

10:34 AM - Apr 20, 2018


PoliticsHome editor Kevin Schofield followed suit. “I grew up in a working class household, went to state schools, worked my arse off on local papers for years and finally made it to Fleet St,” he tweeted, nose thoroughly out of joint.

It turns out Jones was referring to the media elite of the national titles and broadcasters; and not the “army of poorly paid and insecure freelancers or local reporters who are deeply undervalued,” as he describes them.

To go with the truth bomb he lobbed into the center of the media scrum, Jones dug up one or two supporting statistics – and it turns out that many in the media had a very privileged start to life.

“Just 7% of the British population are privately educated. But according to the Sutton Trust in 2016, 51% of Britain’s top journalists are privately educated,” Jones writes. Poverty Commission in 2014, 43% of newspaper columnists are privately educated; just 23% went to comprehensives. Two thirds of new entrants to journalism came from managerial and professional backgrounds: more than twice the level of the rest of the population.

“According to another government study, journalists are second only to doctors when it comes to the dominance of those from professional or managerial parental backgrounds. In other words: journalism is one of the most socially exclusive professions in Britain.”

That hasn’t stopped journalists and writers from coming out of the woodwork to slam Jones – or, at least, to enjoy others doing so.


Tim Dawson

✔@Tim_R_Dawson
https://twitter.com/Tim_R_Dawson/status/987336189328969730

I can't decide if Owen Jones' very public unravelling is tragic or funny.
I guess it's 50/50.
Okay- 30/70.
Okay- AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

3:24 PM - Apr 20, 2018

 

[hullefc]

Smeeth has now deleted this statement that sets out her reasons for her lynch mob attack on Corbyn and demanding he resigns. Smeeth will not be happy until Corbyn is no longer leader of the Labour party, because he can't guarantee 'a safe space for Jews'. She will do everything and anything in her to attempt to stop a Corbyn lead Labour party from getting elected. Including using anti semitism.

Since Corbyn's election in 2016 to leader of the Labour party with the overwhelming support of Labour party members, Smeeth has resented his leadership and was instrumental in attempting to remove Corbyn as leader. It failed as he increased his vote as the likes of Smeeth has seethed with anger ever since.

 

[verreauxi]

I thought this was interesting, but I fully admit to not following this issue closely:

 

[hullefc]

I thought this was interesting, but I fully admit to not following this issue closely:

What Mann talked about is a criminal matter. In 2012 a man was given a restraining order for posting a dead bird to Mann's wife.

Man who sent MP's wife dead bird in post is given restraining order ...

In the report it said, "Dyas-Elliot said that he sent the package because he was ‘bitter’ after his application to run as a Labour councillor was declined by the group’s Bassetlaw District Applications Panel, which included Coun White - due to his ‘unkempt appearance’. There was no mention of his politics or beliefs.