Current Affairs Gender Nonsence

[Kever10]

@Kever10 as I said to Bishop TT. I don't agree with your views. All I would say is spending time with the trans people I know and have spent time with. Makes you understand the hardship they face on a daily basis.

Being gay is easy these days. But being Trans is it a huge mental battle. And I applaud every Trans person out there.

Of course there may one or two bad eggs. But that's the same whether you are male or female. Gay or straight. Unfortunately there will always be stories that will test you and make your blood boil. But remember it is only a fraction of all the good Trans people out there.

I completely agree with that, and like ive said, i have no problem with anyone and how they live their lives. I know plenty of gay people, friends and family, and have met and known Trans people, friends of friends, and i wish no ill on anyone.

My point was very specific, and probably boils down to what are a few extreme examples, whereby there are, unfortunately, people out there who take liberties with other peoples general kindness and use it to their advantage. People who will take something and abuse it to benefit themselves. It happens all the time, in all walks of life, from thieves, con artists, criminals, even every day people who, to use the old term, give them an inch and they will take a mile.

I was talking to someone recently who openly said they lied on their job application form, saying they were bisexual to ensure getting an interview. And thats the problem. The system is created on the basis that people are all honourable and honest, but many people, even some people you would otherwise think of as being good, will lie, cheat and steal for their own benefit.

I am very cynical by nature, so the idea of giving everybody the benefit of the doubt doesnt always sit easily with me, even though i wish i could. The idea that hard and fast rules can be applied fairly across the board doesnt sit well with me either when there is a chance of someone unscrupulous benefitting unfairly, and especially when that also results in someone potentially being hurt badly.

Ive been unfairly labelled as a troll simply for not being democrat leaning in my opinions on Trump (even though im from the UK and dont even vote) and for being cynical of that narrative, and for having the temerity for arguing my point against the pack.

But i can assure you, i dont have any ill will towards anyone (except maybe kopites).

The struggles that Trans people in general face are undoubtedly numerous, and as someone who has experienced bullying throughout school, i can't even begin to understand what it must be like.

But i also thing there needs to be some nuance applied to situations like the main 1 i have been arguing against, which is almost exclusively related to sports and the general physicality of certain sports (not all). There was also another point raised about violent prisoners being moved, and the general points about people changing gender without transitioning and still insisting on aquiring those rights, but that goes a lot deeper.

I did also argue on the side of how i was against the trans ideology being forced on kids, but that to me is simply a matter of i dont believe kids of a certain age should be learning anything about sexuality. Its unnecessary.

So for the record, i am not anti Trans or Transphobic, and i am definitely not homophobic in any way. I just have my concerns about certain aspects that i believe should be led by common sense, and not emotion.

And finally, i hope in haven't offended you in any of my posts. That was never my intention.

 

[Hackbread]

i dont believe kids of a certain age should be learning anything about sexuality. Its unnecessary.

What do you mean by this?

 

[Xizor]

Nice to know your dad liked to entertain bigots. Must have been a nice guy

If you must know, once I turned 18 and went to uni we were estranged, almost entirely up until his death, and I barely even think about him now. Whilst I don't specifically remember any bigoted views my dad held, you're not going to bait me into defending the man over anything.

What an awful way to attempt a cheap shot on me, you should be utterly ashamed of yourself.

 

[Sean Ashley]

If you must know, once I turned 18 and went to uni we were estranged, almost entirely up until his death, and I barely even think about him now. Whilst I don't specifically remember any bigoted views my dad held, you're not going to bait me into defending the man over anything.

What an awful way to attempt a cheap shot on me, you should be utterly ashamed of yourself.

I'm not ashamed calling a man who entertained bigots a bigot. Not a cheap shot, it is calling it how it is.

 

[Sean Ashley]

I completely agree with that, and like ive said, i have no problem with anyone and how they live their lives. I know plenty of gay people, friends and family, and have met and known Trans people, friends of friends, and i wish no ill on anyone.

My point was very specific, and probably boils down to what are a few extreme examples, whereby there are, unfortunately, people out there who take liberties with other peoples general kindness and use it to their advantage. People who will take something and abuse it to benefit themselves. It happens all the time, in all walks of life, from thieves, con artists, criminals, even every day people who, to use the old term, give them an inch and they will take a mile.

I was talking to someone recently who openly said they lied on their job application form, saying they were bisexual to ensure getting an interview. And thats the problem. The system is created on the basis that people are all honourable and honest, but many people, even some people you would otherwise think of as being good, will lie, cheat and steal for their own benefit.

I am very cynical by nature, so the idea of giving everybody the benefit of the doubt doesnt always sit easily with me, even though i wish i could. The idea that hard and fast rules can be applied fairly across the board doesnt sit well with me either when there is a chance of someone unscrupulous benefitting unfairly, and especially when that also results in someone potentially being hurt badly.

Ive been unfairly labelled as a troll simply for not being democrat leaning in my opinions on Trump (even though im from the UK and dont even vote) and for being cynical of that narrative, and for having the temerity for arguing my point against the pack.

But i can assure you, i dont have any ill will towards anyone (except maybe kopites).

The struggles that Trans people in general face are undoubtedly numerous, and as someone who has experienced bullying throughout school, i can't even begin to understand what it must be like.

But i also thing there needs to be some nuance applied to situations like the main 1 i have been arguing against, which is almost exclusively related to sports and the general physicality of certain sports (not all). There was also another point raised about violent prisoners being moved, and the general points about people changing gender without transitioning and still insisting on aquiring those rights, but that goes a lot deeper.

I did also argue on the side of how i was against the trans ideology being forced on kids, but that to me is simply a matter of i dont believe kids of a certain age should be learning anything about sexuality. Its unnecessary.

So for the record, i am not anti Trans or Transphobic, and i am definitely not homophobic in any way. I just have my concerns about certain aspects that i believe should be led by common sense, and not emotion.

And finally, i hope in haven't offended you in any of my posts. That was never my intention.

I appreciate the response. No your posts haven't bothered me tbf. More posters who know my stance and constantly feel the need to make it a discussion about me. Not the issues I raise. Case in point Xizors response calling me a disgrace what a joke.

I'll try and break down your post. On the conning to take advantage. It does seem that seem in the case provided a straight person was lying. If someone feels the need to apply with that intention then you hope karma will happen as I'm sure if they got the role they would have to continue the lie.

I do find there are two types of individuals and based on that you can tell if they will vote democratic or republican and you bring more cynical in nature and feelings people take advantage of the system is a key element in many of your and Republican views.

Whether immigrants taking government funds, benefit scroungers, foreign aid going for war support. Or the case in hand trans having an advantage in female sports.

This argument is polarised and I think it is something that will take years of studies to determine. As currently based on the latest cenus 0.5% of the population had there gender different to their assigned gender at birth and how many of them are young and athletes? So is unfair on science to have ample studies to test trans athletes. Currently on what they have it is mixed and could depend on when the individual transitioned before or after puberty. It could be a fairer way of splitting the athlete if they had went through puberty than they have to assign to the gender at birth and if they transitioned before puberty they can compete at the gender they transitioned to. Again this isn't a perfect answer, but medically it is the best answer.

On the being forced. I would say we are in an age where choice should be embraced. And if a kid feels they are a different gender then it is best to allow them to make that choice. Even at an early age. I think legally as long as the age is appropriate for surgery and doctors (specialists) who speak with the individuals feel it isn't coerced. Than a transition is the best option.

On ideology history and facts are always told in today's eyes and spoken in the way governments want them to. And given the current environment with trans I feel the ideology is a more negative one and I would say I don't feel it is being forced upon kids. And regardless what is shown in schools it is your household that has the most influence.

I will finish on Paul O'Grady someone who whether he performed as Lilly Savage to showcase trans and fight HIV or as himself showing love for dogs not able to get a home. They had the same values in drawing attention to matters in society. I say this as when you see an issue out there in the world instead of being cynical at first try and see how it can impact someone if you make that call.

What happens to the immigrants not deemed legal in the USA that are forcibly removed? What happens to the Ukrainians and others war torn citizens if you remove aid.

 

[Kurt.]

I'm not ashamed calling a man who entertained bigots a bigot. Not a cheap shot, it is calling it how it is.

It’s calling it wrongly to be fair.

 

[Sean Ashley]

It’s calling it wrongly to be fair.

Didn't realise calling someone who is clearly a bigot was such an issue. I mean Xizor actually doesn't deny it.

So respectively Kurt you ain't actually chime in on these issues but make these unless comments for likes. You are best not getting involved.

 

[Kurt.]

Didn't realise coming someone who is clearly a bigot was such an issue. I mean Xizor actually doesn't deny it.

So respectively Kurt you ain't actually chime in on these issues but make these unless comments for likes. You are best not getting involved.

In English please

 

[Sean Ashley]

In English please

You can read and if that is your response. Again best leaving the thread.

 

[LostLegend]

All I would say is spending time with the trans people I know and have spent time with. Makes you understand the hardship they face on a daily basis.

I’ve already tried telling people this, but some outright refuse to listen.

Some find it easier to regurgitate culture war talking points and be sneering trolls in this thread rather than take time to speak to the actual people who are living as trans.

Empathy is in short supply these days it seems.

 

[Sean Ashley]

I’ve already tried telling people this, but some outright refuse to listen.

Some find it easier to regurgitate culture war talking points and be sneering trolls in this thread rather than take time to speak to the actual people who are living as trans.

Empathy is in short supply these days it seems.

You are right. And some won't listen.

A point I have made on this is the media that is exposed to individuals to cater to their emotions. When I referenced the type the of person who votes Republican or democrat. It is clear Dems are more content in life and understand how the system works even if it works against them. Where Republicans are more anti-establishment and they always blame big government and red tape and taxes for dragging the common person down, When it is all smoke and mirrors.

It is the same on these issues such as trans, that Piers Morgan or Tate and others use specific stories to rile up a base. To suggest how they are gaming the system. And somehow a threat to them. Again smoke and mirrors for clicks, money and I think a ploy to distract them from real issues that actually do impact them. Why do you think all Trump talks about at his rallies are random nonsensical stories.

 

[Kurt.]

You can read and if that is your response. Again best leaving the thread.

I can read very well thank you, and by doing so I believe you’re calling someone a bigot by association, I merely pointed out to you that I believe that is wrong. I have a friend of over 30 years who lately has become very vocal with his very right leaning views about politics, immigration and trans issues. Does this therefore make me bigoted too ? By association ?

Oh, and just a small reminder, people on here don’t require your permission to post in any thread they want to, so please stop trying to police the forum. Thanks.

 

[wandyr79]

I completely agree with that, and like ive said, i have no problem with anyone and how they live their lives. I know plenty of gay people, friends and family, and have met and known Trans people, friends of friends, and i wish no ill on anyone.

My point was very specific, and probably boils down to what are a few extreme examples, whereby there are, unfortunately, people out there who take liberties with other peoples general kindness and use it to their advantage. People who will take something and abuse it to benefit themselves. It happens all the time, in all walks of life, from thieves, con artists, criminals, even every day people who, to use the old term, give them an inch and they will take a mile.

I was talking to someone recently who openly said they lied on their job application form, saying they were bisexual to ensure getting an interview. And thats the problem. The system is created on the basis that people are all honourable and honest, but many people, even some people you would otherwise think of as being good, will lie, cheat and steal for their own benefit.

I am very cynical by nature, so the idea of giving everybody the benefit of the doubt doesnt always sit easily with me, even though i wish i could. The idea that hard and fast rules can be applied fairly across the board doesnt sit well with me either when there is a chance of someone unscrupulous benefitting unfairly, and especially when that also results in someone potentially being hurt badly.

Ive been unfairly labelled as a troll simply for not being democrat leaning in my opinions on Trump (even though im from the UK and dont even vote) and for being cynical of that narrative, and for having the temerity for arguing my point against the pack.

But i can assure you, i dont have any ill will towards anyone (except maybe kopites).

The struggles that Trans people in general face are undoubtedly numerous, and as someone who has experienced bullying throughout school, i can't even begin to understand what it must be like.

But i also thing there needs to be some nuance applied to situations like the main 1 i have been arguing against, which is almost exclusively related to sports and the general physicality of certain sports (not all). There was also another point raised about violent prisoners being moved, and the general points about people changing gender without transitioning and still insisting on aquiring those rights, but that goes a lot deeper.

I did also argue on the side of how i was against the trans ideology being forced on kids, but that to me is simply a matter of i dont believe kids of a certain age should be learning anything about sexuality. Its unnecessary.

So for the record, i am not anti Trans or Transphobic, and i am definitely not homophobic in any way. I just have my concerns about certain aspects that i believe should be led by common sense, and not emotion.

And finally, i hope in haven't offended you in any of my posts. That was never my intention.

That is a fair post, I am also cynical by nature but I think there there has been far too many comments that simply say 'men fighting women' etc. It is not as simple as that and each case should be dealt with by the relevant authorities in it's own bubble. As you said people will look to abuse the system but you hope they would be found out and dealt with in the correct way.

I do have issues with the bit in bold though. I think it is fair that you are labelled a troll, from my perspective all I have seen is you put laughing emojis on my posts. A lot of them have simply been serious discussion points and my own view that is open for discussion. Would you sit there and laugh constantly with no effort to debate my points, if we were sat face to face? If you have nothing to say to them, fair enough, if you don't want to respond then fair enough but why the constant laughing emoji, it is just a form of online trolling, is it not?

 

[LostLegend]

Where Republicans are more anti-establishment and they always blame big government and red tape and taxes for dragging the common person down,

I remember when it used to be the opposite.
It was traditionally the left who were the ‘smash the system’ types and loved conspiracies.

How times have changed!

 

[Sean Ashley]

I can read very well thank you, and by doing so I believe you’re calling someone a bigot by association, I merely pointed out to you that I believe that is wrong. I have a friend of over 30 years who lately has become very vocal with his very right leaning views about politics, immigration and trans issues. Does this therefore make me bigoted too ? By association ?

Oh, and just a small reminder, people on here don’t require your permission to post in any thread they want to, so please stop trying to police the forum. Thanks.

I haven't called anyone other then his father a bigot. Based upon his Dad kept inviting a guy over for entertainment and their discussions would lead to how gays shouldn't be allowed in changing rooms with straight men because simply they are gay. It is a bigoted view. If someone had said that in my house or my parents house there would have been words.

On your question in bold. That depends of course on if you agree with it? But from the way you worded it, you don't so no you ain't.

I don't police the forum I just notice and others do to. That you and others who are all big contributors on here. All like to attack in bursts, never actually going over anything I say. Other than try to make it a happy hour for you guys. Using Trans issues for your entrainment. I mean why else you here on a Monday morning and instead of speaking once about Trans issues you are just having a pop at me?