Current Affairs EU In or Out

[Pienaar's gloves]

We've seen it all before.......

So I believe, doubt it was good news for the consumer.

Again though, hasn't that happened before Brexit?

I can't think of anything really, that hasn't either gone up in price, or got smaller...

Yep, defo. Terry's Chocolate Orange is a snide example. 175g to 157g and the same sized packaging!

Brexit just provides a handy opportunity for big food manufacturers to quicken the pace.

 

[The Esk]

Didn't this all happen before 'Brexit' as well? It's happening to plenty within the EU now?

With that, I'm thinking there is a tendency to attribute everything to Brexit.

I guess my point is that the garden was not particularly rosy prior to the referendum, but the referendum decision has certainly worsened the economic fundamentals both in the UK and in Europe, at a time before any decisions have been made.

 

[Joey66]

Lots are/will - but food sizes have decreased consistently for a long time. It's not a new phenomenon because of brexit...

Have you noticed our football team form has dipped since Brexitlol

 

[GrandOldTeam]

I guess my point is that the garden was not particularly rosy prior to the referendum, but the referendum decision has certainly worsened the economic fundamentals both in the UK and in Europe, at a time before any decisions have been made.

No doubt.

I suspect a key part of the referendum result was people preferring an unknown, leap of faith - that attempt to maintain what was.

My gut suggests the UKs future isn't as bleak as all these experts and publications are so keen to tell you - most of the same experts couldn't even predict the outcome of the referendum.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Have you noticed our football team form has dipped since Brexitlol

Has anyone checked Koeman's papers?

*shakes fist*

 

[Pienaar's gloves]

Have you noticed our football team form has dipped since Brexitlol

Will be because Koeman is Dutch!

What happened to great English managers like Neil Warnock and Ollie Holloway?!

 

[peteblue]

I guess my point is that the garden was not particularly rosy prior to the referendum, but the referendum decision has certainly worsened the economic fundamentals both in the UK and in Europe, at a time before any decisions have been made.

So now you're saying that Brexit is responsible for worsening fundamentals in Europe......

 

[peteblue]

No doubt.

I suspect a key part of the referendum result was people preferring an unknown, leap of faith - that attempt to maintain what was.

My gut suggests the UKs future isn't as bleak as all these experts and publications are so keen to tell you - most of the same experts couldn't even predict the outcome of the referendum.

Indeed, although one or two posters on here did state that by now we would be in recession......can't remember who though.....

 

[Barnfred 55]

No doubt.

I suspect a key part of the referendum result was people preferring an unknown, leap of faith - that attempt to maintain what was.

My gut suggests the UKs future isn't as bleak as all these experts and publications are so keen to tell you - most of the same experts couldn't even predict the outcome of the referendum.

We both trade a lot with each other and neither side would want to see an end to that.

My personal opinion is that free movement/free trade is off the cards as the EU has said this would have to go hand in hand and free movement wouldn't be acceptable from the UK side.

However there are 2 years of negotiating in which these will be the 2 main topics under discussion. I'm confident that both sides can provide concessions so that each can obtain preferable terms and thus not lose face. It's called diplomacy.

Everybody just seems to accept that it has to be all or nothing and it doesn't always have to work that way.

 

[Pienaar's gloves]

We both trade a lot with each other and neither side would want to see an end to that.

My personal opinion is that free movement/free trade is off the cards as the EU has said this would have to go hand in hand and free movement wouldn't be acceptable from the UK side.

However there are 2 years of negotiating in which these will be the 2 main topics under discussion. I'm confident that both sides can provide concessions so that each can obtain preferable terms and thus not lose face. It's called diplomacy.

Everybody just seems to accept that it has to be all or nothing and it doesn't always have to work that way.

It's in the interests of the EU in a sense to keep it all or nothing. They don't want to be seen polluting the four freedoms for the UK in order to dissuade Italy, France or The Netherlands from bailing out.

I'd love them to negotiate over it, I think it's one of their flaws, but they need to try to keep the whole union together as best as possible now.

 

[The Esk]

So now you're saying that Brexit is responsible for worsening fundamentals in Europe......

I am saying the uncertainties caused by Brexit are contagious and will not help European fundamentals at all.

Indeed, although one or two posters on here did state that by now we would be in recession......can't remember who though.....

Three out of the 4 sectors of the economy are currently shrinking, the service industry grew stronger than expected (i) due to an exceptional summer for the film industry and (ii) as a direct result of the BoE''s emergency extension of QE.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Britain’s trade deficit with the rest of the world widened unexpectedly in September as the sharp fall in the pound since the Brexit vote failed to boost exports.

The UK trade in goods deficit increased by £1.6bn over the month to £12.7bn. Imports rose £1.3bn to £38.8bn, while exports fell by £200m to £26.1bn. Imports of ships, materials, vehicles and oil were all up in September, the Office for National Statistics said.

The disappointing figures suggested the 16% fall in the value of the pound since the EU referendum in June failed to lift exports, despite making British goods cheaper abroad.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...icit-widens-september-exports-fall-pound-drop

My guess is that a lot of the increase deficit (which is basically equal to the increase in the cost of imports) is actually caused by the reduction in the value of sterling and it's direct effect on the cost of imports to those business's who hadn't put adequate hedging in place.

It's still a result of Brexit. However they are making out that it is unexpected and my argument is that it should at least have been anticipated.

 

[The Esk]

My guess is that a lot of the increase deficit (which is basically equal to the increase in the cost of imports) is actually caused by the reduction in the value of sterling and it's direct effect on the cost of imports to those business's who hadn't put adequate hedging in place.

It's still a result of Brexit. However they are making out that it is unexpected and my argument is that it should at least have been anticipated.

I agree with you as to the cause of the increase in deficit. It is surprising though that exports did not increase after the fall in value of sterling.

 

[tsubaki]

We both trade a lot with each other and neither side would want to see an end to that.

My personal opinion is that free movement/free trade is off the cards as the EU has said this would have to go hand in hand and free movement wouldn't be acceptable from the UK side.

However there are 2 years of negotiating in which these will be the 2 main topics under discussion. I'm confident that both sides can provide concessions so that each can obtain preferable terms and thus not lose face. It's called diplomacy.

Everybody just seems to accept that it has to be all or nothing and it doesn't always have to work that way.

The easy get-out for freedom of movement is just to roll it back to what the various treaties actually say:

1. Freedom of movement for workers shall be secured within the Community.
2. Such freedom of movement shall entail the abolition of any discrimination based on nationality between workers of the Member States as regards employment, remuneration and other conditions of work and employment.
3. It shall entail the right, subject to limitations justified on grounds of public policy, public security or public health:
   (a) to accept offers of employment actually made;
   (b) to move freely within the territory of Member States for this purpose;
   (c) to stay in a Member State for the purpose of employment in accordance with the provisions governing the employment of nationals of that State laid down by law, regulation or administrative action;
   (d) to remain in the territory of a Member State after having been employed in that State, subject to conditions which shall be embodied in implementing regulations to be drawn up by the Commission.
4. The provisions of this article shall not apply to employment in the public service

ie: to allow people to move for work, but without any automatic entitlement to benefits (something which arose out of a court decision, not a treaty) and subject to checks to prevent (for instance) people with criminal records getting in. A shall-issue (ie: one would be granted unless there were grounds not to) working visa for all EU nationals would be an easy way of meeting the criteria set out in article 45 and satisfying the wish of the UK to prevent alleged abuse of the immigration system.

 

[Joey66]

Will be because Koeman is Dutch!

What happened to great English managers like Neil Warnock and Ollie Holloway?!

Again you have to fetch in tones to a joke post!lol