Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
Status
Not open for further replies.
Tubey said:
Fairly simple - no combined majority, whatever gets the most votes wins. After all, a combined majority is what the initial referendum was, so there's no reason to repeat that outcome - what we need is clarity.

If the country decides to 'No Deal' when presented with three very clear choices on the methodology of our relationship with the EU, then so be it. My problem is and always has been that the choice wasn't clear and it wasn't argued honestly - as in nobody voted for a 'hard' or 'soft' Brexit; they just voted for Brexit, and that is too vague a question.

Of course, it could be argued that the Chequers Deal and exiting on WTO rules should be the only two options on the ballot box in such a referendum, but given the result had 48% of the population vote for Remain, I feel after two years of discussion and coverage that leaving the option for remaining out of it would be ridiculous.
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Sorry I can’t have that. You could end up with ‘no deal’ getting 34% and the other 2 options getting 33% each, meaning that 2/3rds didn’t want the ‘winning’ outcome.
 
Tubey said:
Fairly simple - no combined majority, whatever gets the most votes wins. After all, a combined majority is what the initial referendum was, so there's no reason to repeat that outcome - what we need is clarity.

If the country decides to 'No Deal' when presented with three very clear choices on the methodology of our relationship with the EU, then so be it. My problem is and always has been that the choice wasn't clear and it wasn't argued honestly - as in nobody voted for a 'hard' or 'soft' Brexit; they just voted for Brexit, and that is too vague a question.

Of course, it could be argued that the Chequers Deal and exiting on WTO rules should be the only two options on the ballot box in such a referendum, but given the result had 48% of the population vote for Remain, I feel after two years of discussion and coverage that leaving the option for remaining out of it would be ridiculous.
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That voting paper was democratically set out by our mother parliment 6-1 in favour of how it was presented in the ballot box ...
There was a month campaign in all of the media.... Both side used propaganda like any other election
The Government sent a booklet out in it it stated if you vote out the UK will have to leave the customs union and the single market ....
so 1.4 the majority that won out just coincidentally never knew what they were voting for?......
the highest turn out
If the vote would have been at constituency in a GE level it would have a massive majority for a party .....
Labour have a problem if they had 30 % of voters who voted out........
hence the coo to get rid of Corbyn afterwards........
the only thing i can agree the negotiations on our side where we let Ollie Robbins { Sir Humphrey } an avid remainer dominate the negotiations - one would ask if we are leaving with one foot in and one foot out why did we offer 39 billion compensation ? why did we not force the Eu to do the trade deal first etc etc I agree on the point that May has been a total disaster just as she was at the Home office.......
Labour need to put in unity solid proposals of an alternative Brexit in to get elected .....
 
Joey66 said:
But... you can see into the future...?
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I suspect the vast majority of folk are quite happy to use the weather forecast Joe, despite knowing full well that it is not a cast iron prediction of what the weather will be tomorrow. If you said I'm not going to use it because it's not 100% infallible, that would be a rather silly position to take.
 
Joey66 said:
That voting paper was democratically set out by our mother parliment 6-1 in favour of how it was presented in the ballot box ...
There was a month campaign in all of the media.... Both side used propaganda like any other election
The Government sent a booklet out in it it stated if you vote out the UK will have to leave the customs union and the single market ....
so 1.4 the majority that won out just coincidentally never knew what they were voting for?......
the highest turn out
If the vote would have been at constituency in a GE level it would have a massive majority for a party .....
Labour have a problem if they had 30 % of voters who voted out........
hence the coo to get rid of Corbyn afterwards........
the only thing i can agree the negotiations on our side where we let Ollie Robbins { Sir Humphrey } an avid remainer dominate the negotiations - one would ask if we are leaving with one foot in and one foot out why did we offer 39 billion compensation ? why did we not force the Eu to do the trade deal first etc etc I agree on the point that May has been a total disaster just as she was at the Home office.......
Labour need to put in unity solid proposals of an alternative Brexit in to get elected .....
Click to expand...

You couldn't force the EU into anything. That's what you've never understood - the UK wasn't in a position of power over this at any stage. We simultaneously have more to lose economically and less to lose existentially, meaning the EU can't afford to give us anything.

But as I've said you've never understood that, so your default position now is to blame Remainers for trying to get something together that isn't a total beating by the EU that would destroy our economy. That's what the Chequers Deal is - a last-gasp attempt to get something at least plausible together, and even then the EU won't accept it and the Tory right won't, so it's pointless - but it was the only thing she could try to do. The alternative is being a lunatic and leaving negotiations/no deal.

Tell me this Joey - how was Brexit ever workable? We were told it was going to be 'easy', free trade deals all over the shop, the EU would bend over to accommodate us, we'll thrive, the NHS will get more money, Britain will be a world power again... can't you at least accept now that it was all, literally all of it, a tissue of lies and the vote was sold on those lies rather than anything of substance whatsoever?
 
Joey66 said:
You keep on forecasting the future in your crystal ball......
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No, I deal in FACTS. The last 15 YouGov polls on the spin have shown that the majority believe that the decision to Leave was a mistake. The last one on the 9th July had the gap at 5%.

Cue: polls are meaningless despite Joey bringing them up to try and prove his point.
 
Tubey said:
You couldn't force the EU into anything. That's what you've never understood - the UK wasn't in a position of power over this at any stage. We simultaneously have more to lose economically and less to lose existentially, meaning the EU can't afford to give us anything.

But as I've said you've never understood that, so your default position now is to blame Remainers for trying to get something together that isn't a total beating by the EU that would destroy our economy. That's what the Chequers Deal is - a last-gasp attempt to get something at least plausible together, and even then the EU won't accept it and the Tory right won't, so it's pointless - but it was the only thing she could try to do. The alternative is being a lunatic and leaving negotiations/no deal.

Tell me this Joey - how was Brexit ever workable? We were told it was going to be 'easy', free trade deals all over the shop, the EU would bend over to accommodate us, we'll thrive, the NHS will get more money, Britain will be a world power again... can't you at least accept now that it was all, literally all of it, a tissue of lies and the vote was sold on those lies rather than anything of substance whatsoever?
Click to expand...
I never thought it would be easy but you need good negotiations....
why offer 39 billion on the table ?
that should have been a game changer to get a deal......
 
Joey66 said:
I never thought it would be easy but you need good negotiations....
why offer 39 billion on the table ?
that should have been a game changer to get a deal......
Click to expand...

Because we have to? They were EU budget obligations we are signed up to - not committing to paying it when we leave whilst asking for trade negotiations is akin to not paying a credit card debt off from a bank whilst simultaneously asking for a mortgage.

And again, that was another lie from Leave - who called that payment optional. It never was optional.
 
Joey66 said:
View attachment 47731
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Ironic that you’ve posted that, given that your entire premise for voting Leave was belief based and relies on some mythical and completely undefined future, that you’ve convinced yourself is going to be somehow better than what we’ve got now.......not to start with though, it’ll be a bit crap to start with....but later, at some point........it’ll be sound.......honest.

Pass us your crystal ball Joey lad lol
 
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