Do Everton have an inferiority complex?

[Lanolin]

Well it's not just Chelsea where we've had biased referees in the big matches either since your unhappy with me specifically mentioning them.

Your acceptance of the situation is in line with how a lot of our players react in those matches anyway. The likes of Jagielka who just put up with poor decisions instead of questioning the refs at the time. Maybe the players need to change that part of their mentality much like a lot of the successful players down the years have done.

Roy Keane, Steven Gerrard, Diego Costa etc. All obnoxious players who got in the ref's faces because they had that hunger and desire to be successful. Yet our players just accept that we're little Everton who can't dare question certain decisions.

Jagielka got booked for dissent on Saturday and we lost 5-0. It's almost as if just shouting loads and being a snide isn't what made all those players good, and it was actually down to their footballing talent, but I know that definitely can't be the case because some lids on twitter said so.

 

[TraffordBlue]

Jagielka got booked for dissent on Saturday and we lost 5-0. It's almost as if just shouting loads and being a snide isn't what made all those players good, and it was actually down to their footballing talent, but I know that definitely can't be the case because some lids on twitter said so.

A poor example then lol.

Just think we need to have a bit more fight in us in regards to everything in these big games.

 

[Eggsyblueskin]

Mr William Kenwright is the sole reason for this. Even when we were rubbish in the 90s we could still muster up the courage to win at Arsenal and Chelsea sporadically, and win the odd derby purely on fighting spirit and belief in ourselves. Ever since top blue Bill came in we've had a mentality instilled in us that we have no right to beat these teams.

Actually as much as I agree in spirit the actual blame lies further back, someone like Kenwright should never have had a chance to purchase this club. There never seemed to be any plans for the future without John Moores. The people tasked with running Everton during Moores decline and death are where our decline began. As fans we,too , never queried the future until a golf playing doctor with little interest in football became chairman. It's going to take a lot of investment and time to repair,if it is ,indeed,repairable.

 

[Prevenger17]

Our players aren't good enough, simple as. Our general mentality doesn't help either, we worship donkeys like Lukaku and think we're lucky to have him

 

[Darth Toffeeman]

It ceased to be a 'sport' in that sense when the first player took a wage. Many teams at the time understood this and decided to remain amateur. What has changed for us is that circumstances and mis management have allowed us to drift out of the elite (we were the prime mover as one of the 'big five' at the inception of the PL don't forget).
Only a massive investment of money will give us achance of restoring our standing. Will we get it? Watch this space.

Oh I have never forgotten our 'Big 5' mantle.
I was brought up on the all conquering team of the 80's.
Hence why it makes my blood boil how far this great club has fallen due to 20 odd years of mismanagement and incompetence from the owners.

 

[Eggsyblueskin]

Oh I have never forgotten our 'Big 5' mantle.
I was brought up on the all conquering team of the 80's.
Hence why it makes my blood boil how far this great club has fallen due to 20 odd years of mismanagement and incompetence from the owners.

I agree but our decline began (as I've just alluded to on another thread) in the period preceding to and immediately after John Moores death. It's a long period of short sighted and generally poor management that needs fixing before we can even dream of rejoining the elite. As of now I see no evidence of the repair job starting soon.

 

[Neiler]

At the moment yes, i long for the days that we dont celebrate good reulsults VS Utd, Arsenal and City - we should expect them rather then celebrate them. wnt the opposition to say "S.... We're playing Everton at the weekend".

 

[Angelgabriel]

Well it's not just Chelsea where we've had biased referees in the big matches either since your unhappy with me specifically mentioning them.

There you go again mate, it's not just the refs making mistakes, its them being 'biased' against us. That's exactly what I meant earlier about us having a persecution complex.

 

[TraffordBlue]

There you go again mate, it's not just the refs making mistakes, its them being 'biased' against us. That's exactly what I meant earlier about us having a persecution complex.

Ok so you genuinely think that each time we go to those grounds and don't get a penalty for example, that they're just honest mistakes by the ref? Post war we have been awarded one penalty at Anfield. Do you seriously believe we've only been fouled once in the box in 71 years lol.

I will repeat, our team just hasn't been good enough overall down the years in those matches, which is the main reason for our poor record. However, to suggest that refs have in no way played a small part in us not getting the odd win here and there is just wrong and you can say it is a victim mentality all you want but 1 penalty in 71 years speaks for itself.

I remember a game the other year at Man City. A ground where they have been given numerous contentious penalties against us, and were in the same game, Nastasic smashed Lukaku to the ground and no pen was given to us. Some evidence to back up my argument:

2013 game:

The spot-kick, awarded after Seamus Coleman tangled with Pablo Zabaleta but hotly disputed by the visitors

One word about the penalty, though. Was Coleman’s push on Zabaleta any worse than Nastasic’s on Lukaku in the first half? I would suggest probably not. A bad afternoon indeed for referee Mr Moss.'

2014 game:

Yaya Toure's penalty, after Phil Jagielka was controversially adjudged to have fouled James Milner, secured a fourth straight league win.

It would be nice for us to get the odd "controversial decision" go our way for a change...

 

[Angelgabriel]

Ok so you genuinely think that each time we go to those grounds and don't get a penalty for example, that they're just honest mistakes by the ref? Post war we have been awarded one penalty at Anfield. Do you seriously believe we've only been fouled once in the box in 71 years lol.

I will repeat, our team just hasn't been good enough overall down the years in those matches, which is the main reason for our poor record. However, to suggest that refs have in no way played a small part in us not getting the odd win here and there is just wrong and you can say it is a victim mentality all you want but 1 penalty in 71 years speaks for itself.

I remember a game the other year at Man City. A ground where they have been given numerous contentious penalties against us, and were in the same game, Nastasic smashed Lukaku to the ground and no pen was given to us. Some evidence to back up my argument:

2013 game:

The spot-kick, awarded after Seamus Coleman tangled with Pablo Zabaleta but hotly disputed by the visitors

One word about the penalty, though. Was Coleman’s push on Zabaleta any worse than Nastasic’s on Lukaku in the first half? I would suggest probably not. A bad afternoon indeed for referee Mr Moss.'

2014 game:

Yaya Toure's penalty, after Phil Jagielka was controversially adjudged to have fouled James Milner, secured a fourth straight league win.

It would be nice for us to get the odd "controversial decision" go our way for a change...

It's down to poor refereeing decisions, pure and simple. To suggest there's something more sinister is ridiculous and serves only to back up my point even further.

'to suggest that refs have in no way played a small part in us not getting the odd win here and there is just wrong'
Every single football fan in the world could have wrote that sentence. We've been on the end of some bad refereeing decisions, we've also been beneficiaries. Every football club could say the same. No dark arts. That's football mate.

 

[LEONARD]

 

[chippy1722]

Under Moyes Yes we did.
Strangely Under early Martinez, No, we had a good go at the big teams.
Latter Martinez, I don't know if we had an inferiority complex, we were too crap to differentiate.
Under Koeman, Yes we do. Play for a draw at Man City and go five at the back at Chelsea. That could still be down to him not having the players he wants and certainly no faith to have a go at these teams.

Man Utd will be interesting because they can be poor and we really shouldn't be scared of them.

 

[Blues Harp]

It's down to poor refereeing decisions, pure and simple. To suggest there's something more sinister is ridiculous and serves only to back up my point even further.

'to suggest that refs have in no way played a small part in us not getting the odd win here and there is just wrong'
Every single football fan in the world could have wrote that sentence. We've been on the end of some bad refereeing decisions, we've also been beneficiaries. Every football club could say the same. No dark arts. That's football mate.

Obviously not all down to ref decisions but if you know your EFC history I single out numerous derby matches where we have been on the receiving end of atrocious reffing. Not going to list them as you will be able to recall them immediately.....

 

[daza_1973]

I long for just one recreation of the mentality we had in the early to mid 90's Derbies.

 

[Angelgabriel]

Howard Webb said Goodson was the hardest place to referee. Why do you think that is?
Maybe us shouting 'handball' every time the ball goes above waist height or 'penalty' for seemingly innocuous challenges in the box makes the referee think twice when there has been an actual offence. Maybe this whole persecution complex and us foaming at the mouth putting even more pressure on refs is actually working against us. Just a thought.