2024/25 David Moyes

[jceverton]

One thing Kenwright did right was not to pull the plug on Moyes when we had that bad season in 03/04 when we were 17th. That allowed Moyes to get things going and lead to our best days. Kenwrights failure to get the money that Moyes needed to push us forward after the 08/09 season pushed us back and allowed other teams to over take us.

You seem to have forgotten his regular disastrous starts to the season. Then we had the bottling of major cup games on a regular basis. Classic example of this was Chelsea away in the League Cup semi final.

 

[windymiller]

The other ridiculous thing banded about on managerial threads is these cross era comparisons.

‘He’s gone the longest without winning a trophy’ ‘he’s got the lowest win % of an Everton manager’

It’s almost as though previous Everton teams were Mersey millionaires buying the best players in the he country and winning multiple trophies whilst the modern Everton teams have been running sell to stay in business transfer policies since 2000.

Probably Dyche’s fault though.

Moyes took over this club 7 years after we won a trophy. How long is an era? I agree that now, thirty years after last winning a trophy, is comparing apples and oranges but not in 2002.

P.S. why are you talking about Dyche in the Davey Moyes thread. You gotta let it go, SD, he's gone now, he can't hurt you any more.

 

[Vintage]

I'm content with what we've got currently. Even quite like Everton at the moment.

You could almost say that your a happy man

 

[jceverton]

The other ridiculous thing banded about on managerial threads is these cross era comparisons.

‘He’s gone the longest without winning a trophy’ ‘he’s got the lowest win % of an Everton manager’

It’s almost as though previous Everton teams were Mersey millionaires buying the best players in the he country and winning multiple trophies whilst the modern Everton teams have been running sell to stay in business transfer policies since 2000.

Probably Dyche’s fault though.

I don't think it's ridiculous to point out that the guy managed us for 12 years and failed to win a single competition! In the time he was here Middlesborough, Birmingham, Swansea, Wigan and Portsmouth won cup competitions. No other manager in the top flight, apart from Ferguson and Wenger, managed one club for so long.

 

[jceverton]

You said mckenna is very good and he hasn’t won a jot yet. We will have different scope for what’s good/very good/great. That’s fine.

But like I say, me suggesting that the only manager in my life time to provide us any consistency, regular European football and some finals that I’m old enough to remember is very good is hardly ridiculous hyperbole.

Sorry but in the context of Everton football club's history and managing us for 12 years there is no way that Moyes is a very good manager - that's a complete exaggeration. You've simply set a very low bar.

 

[Moomin]

So by that logic the only very good manager is Pep. I think that needs a rethink. Thomas Frank and Unie Emery are very good managers in my mind but not exactly replete with trophies.

Emery has won quite a few trophies.

 

[jceverton]

Emery has won quite a few trophies.

3 Europa League cups with Sevilla, also coming from behind against Liverpool to win one. Moyes can only dream of that. He's not anywhere near as good a manager as Emery.

 

[jceverton]

So by that logic the only very good manager is Pep. I think that needs a rethink. Thomas Frank and Unie Emery are very good managers in my mind but not exactly replete with trophies.

No mate there is very good and there is great. Pep is a great manager, one of the best of all time. So is Ferguson, so is Carlo. They are on another level.

 

[catcherintherye]

The last few pages just highlight why I don't think bringing Moyes back was the right choice. Personally I'm a fan but there's too much water under the bridge with him, people already have their minds made up about what he is and at a time when we were crying out for a fresh start it feels like we aren't going to get one.

This was basically my view.

I'm not having a go at anyone either, but I do wonder if this is more of a forun feel though. Like the feeling at the match seems a lot happier?

One thing I will say though, and there's a lot of ifs and buts in here, but if we spend quite the heavily being mid table will not be seen as enough. I've seen a couple of fan channels say we will spend a fair bit of money and have another nice boring season of 12th and that will be fine. I'm not sure that's how it will be seen.

 

[Lanolin]

This was basically my view.

I'm not having a go at anyone either, but I do wonder if this is more of a forun feel though. Like the feeling at the match seems a lot happier?

One thing I will say though, and there's a lot of ifs and buts in here, but if we spend quite the heavily being mid table will not be seen as enough. I've seen a couple of fan channels say we will spend a fair bit of money and have another nice boring season of 12th and that will be fine. I'm not sure that's how it will be seen.

I think when he came in there was a wave of optimism and I must admit I was quite (pleasantly) surprised at how quickly the fans were singing his name etc, but the last couple of games i think there's been a noticeable increase in the sort of grumbling you see on here - 'Just make a change ffs', 'this is typical Moyes', 'he's settling for a point as always' type stuff.

 

[Gilbert..]

Yep I agree with this. I just think it was a retrograde step. At a push it was okay for this season. It's also been compounded by ditching the DOF model and giving him control over transfers. Then we've got a number of people who think the guy is a top manager when he's never been that.

It was an essential move because of how atrocious Dyche was. This has been gone over on the forum. Who was available in mid season to take over a club and a team that had scored 15 goals in 19 games.
Three rubbish teams below us and we were 1 point above them.
It wasnt just ok at a push. This club needed to start performing quickly otherwise we were in a 4 team battle at the bottom as we were just as bad as the likes of ipswich.
Im amazed at some of the flippant comments and attitude. Everton were in a really bad way under Dyche. As bad a team performing as ive ever seen. It needed to get a manager in quickly with no fuss and compensation issues of getting them away from another club.
Long term aspirations were not relevant in january. Pulling away from the bottom was.

 

[Goat]

…in one interview he seemed keen to get DCL back. I might be reading this wrong but I got the impression he still thinks he’s the best striker at the club.

That's cos he is and it's not even close.

 

[DualityNSNO]

I think when he came in there was a wave of optimism and I must admit I was quite (pleasantly) surprised at how quickly the fans were singing his name etc, but the last couple of games i think there's been a noticeable increase in the sort of grumbling you see on here - 'Just make a change ffs', 'this is typical Moyes', 'he's settling for a point as always' type stuff.

I'd argue that this is just general moaning; seems to happen everywhere online at the moment.

And even with that, we're still a mile better in just about everything - on the pitch we look good/decent, feels like we're getting the most out of the players at our disposal, etc.

I honestly think solidly midtable (or midtable to The 7th Place Trophy as far as contention goes) is reasonable - we'll need to invest heavily in the next 2 years just to remain stable as we'll need a proper squad and some players will have to go/be replaced, so spending is inevitable, but it should lead to stable growth and not instant growth. Newcastle are a decent example of this - yeah, they're moneyed up, we know who the owners are, etc., and they've spent a fair few bob, but they're stable and on the up - you can't expect a team from the bottom half to get 300m and instantly challenged for 4th like.

 

[catcherintherye]

I think when he came in there was a wave of optimism and I must admit I was quite (pleasantly) surprised at how quickly the fans were singing his name etc, but the last couple of games i think there's been a noticeable increase in the sort of grumbling you see on here - 'Just make a change ffs', 'this is typical Moyes', 'he's settling for a point as always' type stuff.

Interesting. I was amazed how quickly his song was sung really. We will see, I wasn't at the derby.

Its almost not joined up in thoughts though. Like I think a lot of fans are probably not seeing the new period and shift we are going into. Come July there will be a lot more cash to spend (circa early Moshiri levels) and a clear structure to spend it. I think Moyes can easily consolidate us between 7th-10th, and has probably already done that.

Im not sure though, that of we have a couple of seasons not 100m+ net spend, that is going to satisfy fans.

And that's the downside of Moyes, he's not shown anywhere yet he can get a team from say 6th to 3rd. I'm not saying he can't do it, but as yet he's not done it.

The problem is though, that I don't think we have fully appreciated what a turning point July is from what happened before.

This was the criticism West Ham fans had of him too really. Like he did brilliantly getting them to 7th, but then had a lot of money and they didn't kick on. My gut feeling is like Iriala or say Emery would be better at this.

 

[Titus Bramble]

We are going to have to agree to differ. A very good manager in my mind is someone who regularly wins trophies. Moyes hasn't done that.

I'd love to know your definition of an elite manager.

Off the top of my head, here are a few managers who do (or have) regularly win trophies:

- Alex Ferguson
- Pep Guardiola
- Jose Mourinho
- Carlo Ancelotti

I'd class them above 'very good'.