David Moyes/Everton Big Game Mentality

[Philw]

No, I agree about increasing importance.

I'd argue that the semi vs bayern was the more improtant game than the final vs vienna, mind. And same with liverpool and boro in our cup final run a few years back. But yeah on the whole, of course you're right.

It's just for me that importance hasn't built into a proper real big game until at least the semi if not the final.

Well in that case there's not much left to say, other than our boundaries for what constitutes a big game or not lie in different places on the same scale. Ofcourse there is the league to consider also....

Anyway we've won 3/4 quarter finals under moyes. If that is a big game then his record in big games is a lot less pathetic than I would have it.

So it would seem Altho there are plenty of other big games outside of the qtr finals where I would imagine his record doesn't stand up quite so well!

 

[canuckblue]

It's easy when you're the underdog to get the players fired up, if that even needs to be done. But it's the dropped points in league games or cup losses against teams we are or should be favoured to beat that's the issue with me, not so much "big" games. And that has a lot to do, in my opinion, with Moyes' inability to find the killer instinct within his team on those occasions. He's proven he can assemble a team that can take on the big boys, why can't it sweep aside inferior opposition on a more consistent basis?

 

[Allezfan]

So it would seem Altho there are plenty of other big games outside of the qtr finals where I would imagine his record doesn't stand up quite so well!

I would say big games are finals in which he's 0/1

I can see why you might count semis and the play off with villarreal. In that he's 1/5.

Go down to quarters and it's 4/9.

I tend to discount league games as big games alltogether, as you've got 37 other games to make up for it. The exceptions are when you're down to the last game and you need to win to stay up, win the title, get into europe etc and there isn't any games left if you don't do it but that's never happened under Moyes, I don't think. Our fate's always been decided going into that last game.

The only other league games that truly stand on their own, rather than simply as a part of a season, are derby games. Where his record is well known.

 

[banno]

It's easy when you're the underdog to get the players fired up, if that even needs to be done. But it's the dropped points in league games or cup losses against teams we are or should be favoured to beat that's the issue with me, not so much "big" games. And that has a lot to do, in my opinion, with Moyes' inability to find the killer instinct within his team on those occasions. He's proven he can assemble a team that can take on the big boys, why can't it sweep aside inferior opposition on a more consistent basis?

My way of thinking may be a bit simplistic, but when the better teams play against us they are playing openly because they are trying to beat us. We have been better at exposing this type of play in recent years hence the good results. On the other hand, the so called lesser teams need breaking down and thats where we suffer. A laboured approach is our problem I feel. We are slow in the middle and our set pattern is to get it out wide for the cross to come in, and this remains our main approach. Speedy players has not been a thing of our recent past thus making us that bit easier to defend against. We haven't got enough players with the guile and mindset to unlock defences and I suppose they come at a high price we cannot afford.

 

[Allezfan]

My way of thinking may be a bit simplistic, but when the better teams play against us they are playing openly because they are trying to beat us. We have been better at exposing this type of play in recent years hence the good results. On the other hand, the so called lesser teams need breaking down and thats where we suffer. A laboured approach is our problem I feel. We are slow in the middle and our set pattern is to get it out wide for the cross to come in, and this remains our main approach. Speedy players has not been a thing of our recent past thus making us that bit easier to defend against. We haven't got enough players with the guile and mindset to unlock defences and I suppose they come at a high price we cannot afford.

Partly.

But I mean we have beaten sunderland in 15 out of our last 20 games against them. And we did beat wigan at home in the league before losing to them in the cup.

I do think it's fair to say we under performed in those games compared to how we normally do against the same opposition.

 

[Ihaters]

It's easy when you're the underdog to get the players fired up, if that even needs to be done. But it's the dropped points in league games or cup losses against teams we are or should be favoured to beat that's the issue with me, not so much "big" games. And that has a lot to do, in my opinion, with Moyes' inability to find the killer instinct within his team on those occasions. He's proven he can assemble a team that can take on the big boys, why can't it sweep aside inferior opposition on a more consistent basis?

You make it sound like we never win these games, we got a maximum result against these this season:

QPR
STOKE
READING
OLDHAM
WEST BROM
BOLTON
CHELTENHAM
SOUTHAMPTON
SWANSEA
LEYTON ORIENT
ASTON VILLA
NEWCASTLE
WIGAN
WEST HAM
SUNDERLAND

 

[Ihaters]

I'm sure all that were arguing that the Sunderland loss was the most important game of the season, will join me in congratulating Moyes on winning the most important game of the season on Saturday.
Well in Moyesey lad.

 

[Darth Toffeeman]

I think a lot does come down to the lack of speedy, clever players.
We beat Stoke thanks to a bit of magic from Mirallas. It's that extra bit of unknown quantity that we lack (Bale at Spurs for example). Most sides in the top flight are able to set up in such a way as to stop you playing and have people who are capable of nicking a goal (Fulham could have equalised at the weekend as they did so in the reverse fixture). I think we are playing to a consistant level and are not that far off. We just need a stronger squad, but that won't come without investment.
Interestingly I remember after the Fulham 2-2 game, fans were expecting someone to get a good hiding from us. No one has all season, yet the rable across the park have handed out spankings to almost all the bottom clubs at will. Yet they cannot compete with the top teams like we can. Perhaps DM should break from his 'keep it tight' mentalitity and allow our superior players to run all over the weaker teams? Every game is a tight 'edge of your seat' battle whether playing Chelsea or QPR!

 

[dixie7]

My way of thinking may be a bit simplistic, but when the better teams play against us they are playing openly because they are trying to beat us. We have been better at exposing this type of play in recent years hence the good results. On the other hand, the so called lesser teams need breaking down and thats where we suffer. A laboured approach is our problem I feel. We are slow in the middle and our set pattern is to get it out wide for the cross to come in, and this remains our main approach. Speedy players has not been a thing of our recent past thus making us that bit easier to defend against. We haven't got enough players with the guile and mindset to unlock defences and I suppose they come at a high price we cannot afford.

add to that we lack quality players, sure everyone of our players puts 100% in but thats not enough anymore. to take the team to the next level moyes needs proven quality players. even when we have had money we have had to bring in players like yak and fellaini i.e. players no teams above us were after. part of the problem there is the manager, Jol bought in berbatov massive coup but he only came becuase jol was manager, moyes could never attract anyone like that

all of the teams above us has at least 1 world class player in their midfield/ striker that can unlock defenses, even at times play poorly but come out with the win. If we have a bad day we lose

 

[Timak]

Some people are holding Moyes and the players to unfairly high standards.

No team wins every game.

For all the dropped points this season we are within a few points of Tottenham, Chelsea and Arsenal all of whom have vastly larger squads assembled at a price Moyes can only dream of.

We are 10-20 points clear of every other team with an even slightly similar budget.

 

[The Saffrons]

Its the draws and losses against lesser teams that have affected us most.

This is how the table looks with just the top 7 we can clearly put it up to the big teams this season

** P W D L GF GA GD PTS
Utd 11 6 2 3 19 15 4 20
City 12 4 5 3 17 16 1 17
Chelsea 9 4 3 2 15 13 2 15
Everton 10 3 5 2 12 11 1 14
Spurs 11 4 2 5 21 24 -3 14
Arsenal 12 2 5 5 16 17 -1 11
Liverpool 11 1 6 4 17 21 -4 9

 

[harry]

You make it sound like we never win these games, we got a maximum result against these this season:

QPR
STOKE
READING
OLDHAM
WEST BROM
BOLTON
CHELTENHAM
SOUTHAMPTON
SWANSEA
LEYTON ORIENT
ASTON VILLA
NEWCASTLE
WIGAN
WEST HAM
SUNDERLAND

We need to be beating those teams twice. If we don't beat Westham at home, we wont have done the double over any team this season.

 

[Del]

We need to be beating those teams twice. If we don't beat Westham at home, we wont have done the double over any team this season.

Thats shocking ffs

 

[ToffeeMike]

Thats shocking ffs

Tell me about it lad

 

[Ihaters]

What's shocking is only losing 6 games all season. For a squad of our size that's awesome. I'd rather the four points we gained from most clubs this season than the one they got from us, but maybe that's just me.