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Really you think those players are putting in maximum effort, no chance,

Did that look like a team that had a possible European place on the line against a direct rival? That in itself should be motivation.

Powder puff, quality is there, effort, bottle and mental strength is lacking.

No effort even for themselves to get themselves in a position to challenge for Europe, unacceptable.

We clearly disagree with each other mate. I think there is a massive quality issue and that our problems are not down to a lack of effort.
 
Nowhere near as much to blame as Allardyce
Really? Because I seem to remember those utter wastes of space being crap under Rhino and Koeman this season. There plenty of blame to go about, slaughter BFS all you want but the time has come for us all to accept that the gobsb1te players we have are just as responsible if not more then any one manager. Almost every single one of them are disinterested losers who can't even muster professional pride.
 
Really? Because I seem to remember those utter wastes of space being crap under Rhino and Koeman this season. There plenty of blame to go about, slaughter BFS all you want but the time has come for us all to accept that the gobsb1te players we have are just as responsible if not more then any one manager. Almost every single one of them are disinterested losers who can't even muster professional pride.

Have to agree mate, Sam is right not to shield these players, there is a base level of effort, motivation, desire and professional determination that this set of players have never achieved.

Default setting is to crumble with the first sniff of adversity or fight.
 
Really? Because I seem to remember those utter wastes of space being crap under Rhino and Koeman this season. There plenty of blame to go about, slaughter BFS all you want but the time has come for us all to accept that the gobsb1te players we have are just as responsible if not more then any one manager. Almost every single one of them are disinterested losers who can't even muster professional pride.

Ha ha ha so true.We even rewarded those wimps for their failure, with a mid season holiday to Dubai!lol
 
They're showing an alarming lack of leadership at the moment. Of course you can blame Allardyce for the way they're setup or the players he picks, but it was fairly obvious what was going wrong as the line of attack by Burnley was so monotonous, yet the players showed no initiative to actually figure it out themselves. There was no initiative to ask Pickford to play 'sweeper keeper' to cut off the ball down the channels. No initiative to sit deeper. No real brains at all. I lost count of the times Davies was stood stationary whilst a team mate had the ball rather than making himself available for a pass.

The game itself was pretty awful and the kind of football that English football is derided for, but no one showed any real quality on our side. Even the likes of Walcott or Rooney weren't able to stamp their quality on the game.
 
Really? Because I seem to remember those utter wastes of space being crap under Rhino and Koeman this season. There plenty of blame to go about, slaughter BFS all you want but the time has come for us all to accept that the gobsb1te players we have are just as responsible if not more then any one manager. Almost every single one of them are disinterested losers who can't even muster professional pride.

I think the worrying thing is that we have a lot of new players in the side, and to a man, they all played much better elsewhere than they did here. We used to have the opposite habit, of bringing in players that had struggled elsewhere and got the best out of them. That was our schtick. Now, the opposite is the case.
 
They lack quality more than anything else. It's a crap squad full of crap players!
The problem is mate, Watford and Burnley arent exactly overflowing with top quality either? Yet the pair of the humiliated us by the simple act of giving a toss. They wanted the ball, they chased it when they lost it and they wanted to win a game for their club, their manager, and their fans.

My mate reckons they have stopped playing for Allardyce, if that is the case, it is an utterly damning indication of their character. This is a world cup year, and the vast majority of our squad are internationals, so it would appear they cant even be arsed playing for themselves??

I dont want Sam here, as he has shown he could never entertain us, but this lot simply dont care, not even about their own world cup chances, what chance has any manager got with that mentality running through the squad?
 
Basic fundamentals missing ever since the deteriorating second season under Martinez.

Lack of movements, lack of initiative, lack of guts. We used to have a team of runners bursting their lungs for a common cause. Now we have only a handful of them. Add in a flaw transfer system of buying pedestrian static footballer to the team and this is our end results.

Just survive this season.
Players like Onyekuru Lookman Cenk and Walcott will lead the renaissance next season, provided we sign an attacking minded manager with decent defensive knowledge.
 
A sizeable portion of the squad packed it in three managers ago. There's no passion, no drive, they could care less what how the game finishes. Win, draw or loss, they still get paid. If they had a just a bit more professional pride, I believe outcome would be more positive, no matter who the manager is. ( or was ).

The pity is, that those that do give a crap, get caught up in the farce, and their effectiveness suffers.

The current manager had a bit of grace period, during which the players played better. But unfortunately he was found to be more interested in himself than the club. He is a carpetbagger and the players will take their cue from him, and go will through the motions until the end of the season.

It is a crime that this great club has to endure this rot. The problem is, I don't think anyone currently with the club can cure it.

This is probably over simplistic. There are so many other issues with the club that need to be dealt with, but this one is so glaring bright, it's blinding.
 
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I don’t believe that, it’s bottle, courage, will to compete, not one of players deserves to take a penny out of Everton based on that criteria. I’ve seen far worse Everton teams, but have actually cared and put in effort.

This team is an utter embarrassment to the club for the fight they show.

Game after game this team just crumbles.
To easy yo blame a manager at times, and even though Allardyce is at fault it is not all of his own making. I can understand comments of the squad is unbalanced, but iwill never accept players not showing commitment and passion.
This bunch of players is the worst I have ever watched.... a disgrace to the badge and the fan base
 
m not entirely convinced they are all spineless...Rooney certainly isnt. I think you have to look back to the latter days of Martinez and to an extent Koeman. If the leadership isnt leading the players will drift. If the leadership is failing to lead then the players wont play for him
I think thats the most likely scenarion. There are a lot of young hungry lads in that squad and folks wanting to make their names but being held back by the hoofball tactics.
 
I hate fatty and all he stands for, I hated him before he came here and will continue to hate him once he has gone. Having said that, I don’t Know who we can bring in as manager, this is a totally demoralised group of players who’s confidence is shot and at the core of all that we have some truculent sulky players who have conspired to get managers sacked because they have dared to ask them to pull their fingers out and play in a certain way.

So yes, Fat Sam out for sure, but, I am at a loss to know who can fix this mess, the malaise in this club started towards the end of Brown Shoes time and is getting progressively worse.
 
Absolutely spot on. I'm happy to criticize the manager (God knows he derserves it) but I am sick to death of those useless parasites leaching a living off this club and get away with underprofoming and generally not giving a sh1t about the club, the fans or even their own professional pride. Never In all my life have I despised an blues side like this. There's only about three or four players in this whole side that I don't hate. We need a proper purge in the summer to rid ourselves of the utter vermin who infest this club.
I understand you are angry, but do you really think getting rid of one bunch of mercenaries and replacing them with another is the solution? Perhaps part of the problem is that the club has gone through so much change in the past few years, no-one has really had the time to settle and gel as a team. 4 managers in just a couple of years is not going to instil a sense of purpose and direction
 
I understand you are angry, but do you really think getting rid of one bunch of mercenaries and replacing them with another is the solution? Perhaps part of the problem is that the club has gone through so much change in the past few years, no-one has really had the time to settle and gel as a team. 4 managers in just a couple of years is not going to instil a sense of purpose and direction
After three out of the last four years (and even the third one was nothing to be proud of) yes mate, i do think getting rid of this despicable side is the answer. They have proven themselves to be disloyal cowards who give up at the slightest sign of adversity. I can except the reailty that all professional footballers are mercenaries. Only a handful in the modern game give a dam about the club they are playing for. I'll except that, what I can't except is the lack of professional pride they show week in and week out and just shrug of defeat as though it was nothing. If you or I went to work with attitudes like that we'd be sacked within days. I'm not asking them to be playing like they're best mate and know each other brilliantly, just to try.

If your point is true and its the change in managers thats continually efffecting them, then I have a solution. How about they end this horrible habbit of theirs when they delibertly stop playing for managers when things are grim and fight for the manager. They know the score, if they don't try it's the manager who falls on the sword and they can carry on with their nice and easy life with a new manager until he pisses them off and they do the same again. This is part of how Sunderland began, they had a team full of rats who got manager after manager sacked while they just stood there like helpless victims and dragged the club further and further into the abyss, an abyss they are still plunging down to this day.

Ill be clear here it's not just the players. The attitude from the very top of this club except mediocrity and has for decades. This is why we need a fresh start, with fresh players who aren't yet effected by the losers mentality that infeists this club from top to bottom. Only then can we start afresh and begin to think about ever being successful again, this side has excepted failure for to long and its part of their make-up now.
 
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