Current Affairs Assault on US Capitol and Related (non-Trump) Investigation

[summerisle]

"The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result."

Exclusive: FBI finds scant evidence U.S. Capitol attack was coordinated - sources

The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result, according to four current and former law enforcement officials.

www.reuters.com

Time to release the non-violent prisoners.

Interesting thread : the author of the piece was deported from the UK for disclosing military secrets. Also, Tass, the Russian news agency, is now a 'partner' of Reuters.

 

[dholliday]

Interesting thread : the author of the piece was deported from the UK for disclosing military secrets. Also, Tass, the Russian news agency, is now a 'partner' of Reuters.

More importantly, there is scant evidence of a planned insurrection.

Targeting the source rather than the message is the done thing these days. Once you notice it, you realise it's near-ubiquitous.

Was it ever thus?

 

[verreauxi]

Interesting thread : the author of the piece was deported from the UK for disclosing military secrets. Also, Tass, the Russian news agency, is now a 'partner' of Reuters.

Such a strange take in that Reuters article. Of course there was no single and centralalized command post that was issuing directives to all those who stormed the capitol building. It was very decentralized--there was similar chatter across various internet platforms that contained rhetoric about "taking back the government" "election fraud" "normies" "big lie" etc. etc. Of course it was not singularly Alex Jones or any other individual. But many people there were armed and the FBI did classify it as an act of domestic terrorism, and Trump's speech did little to disuade the insurrectionists. (I didn't know about the link between Reuters and Tass) I am betting the FBI's official report will differ a bit in how the Reuter's article portrays their findings.

 

[dholliday]

Such a strange take in that Reuters article. Of course there was no single and centralalized command post that was issuing directives to all those who stormed the capitol building. It was very decentralized--there was similar chatter across various internet platforms that contained rhetoric about "taking back the government" "election fraud" "normies" "big lie" etc. etc. Of course it was not singularly Alex Jones or any other individual. But many people there were armed and the FBI did classify it as an act of domestic terrorism, and Trump's speech did little to disuade the insurrectionists. (I didn't know about the link between Reuters and Tass) I am betting the FBI's official report will differ a bit in how the Reuter's article portrays their findings.

If anybody was armed, no one used their weapon. The violent footage shows use of items like flags and the like for makeshift-weapons.

So perhaps Trump's speech did actually dissuade the not-insurrectionists.

Note: we shouldn't call them insurrectionists if insurrection is not yet proven, nor even charged.

 

[Sassy Colombian]

Let the showdown begin. If Trump cronies like Bannon think they can get away from testifying by claiming executive privilege when he wasn't even working at the White House at that time. Then Congress and the Jan 6 committee members really need to flex their muscles.

Jan. 6 commission threatens criminal referrals after Steve Bannon snubs subpoena

The commission said the former White House adviser "indicated that he will try to hide behind vague references to privileges of the former President."

www.nbcnews.com

 

[Martin Alvito]

Let the showdown begin. If Trump cronies like Bannon think they can get away from testifying by claiming executive privilege when he wasn't even working at the White House at that time. Then Congress and the Jan 6 committee members really need to flex their muscles.
View attachment 141920

Jan. 6 commission threatens criminal referrals after Steve Bannon snubs subpoena

The commission said the former White House adviser "indicated that he will try to hide behind vague references to privileges of the former President."

www.nbcnews.com

Contempt of Congress is the next move, but it has fewer teeth than you might think.

The last time anyone actually served a sentence for such a citation was almost a century ago, and that sentence ended up being ten days confined to a room in a luxury DC hotel. Congress has held two of the last three Democrats to hold the position of Attorney General in contempt, as well as Bush's White House counsel Harriet Miers. Henry Kissinger and Neil Gorsuch's mother are also on the list of executive branch officials that have been hit with a contempt charge without incurring real consequences.

In other words, this is fairly standard posturing in a case like this. It might be more serious than usual given the circumstances, but the Democrats are in a difficult spot. Making a congressional contempt citation have teeth makes it very hard to govern when the government is divided. Inaction is not an option. Appointing an impartial special counsel (as the House arguably has a conflict of interest as victims) will slow things down quite a bit.

I don't envy the Democrats this particular kettle of fish.

 

[tsubaki]

Contempt of Congress is the next move, but it has fewer teeth than you might think.

The last time anyone actually served a sentence for such a citation was almost a century ago, and that sentence ended up being ten days confined to a room in a luxury DC hotel. Congress has held two of the last three Democrats to hold the position of Attorney General in contempt, as well as Bush's White House counsel Harriet Miers. Henry Kissinger and Neil Gorsuch's mother are also on the list of executive branch officials that have been hit with a contempt charge without incurring real consequences.

In other words, this is fairly standard posturing in a case like this. It might be more serious than usual given the circumstances, but the Democrats are in a difficult spot. Making a congressional contempt citation have teeth makes it very hard to govern when the government is divided. Inaction is not an option. Appointing an impartial special counsel (as the House arguably has a conflict of interest as victims) will slow things down quite a bit.

I don't envy the Democrats this particular kettle of fish.

this is why I thought the smarter move was for Biden to just dump everything Trump did our into the open right after he took over - they are never going to get “justice”politically, given who runs the GOP

 

[Martin Alvito]

this is why I thought the smarter move was for Biden to just dump everything Trump did our into the open right after he took over - they are never going to get “justice”politically, given who runs the GOP

The problem is that they don't have enough to convict. If they did, they'd already be in court with it. If you're trying to get to the ringleader in a criminal investigation, it takes patience, pressure and time to flip witnesses.

Trying to win in the court of public opinion seems pointless these days. Nixon went down because he lost there after the tapes came out, which flipped enough Senate votes. I can imagine revelations which would flip even Fox News, but it would probably take either an airtight tax fraud case or following the money through Deutsche to Putin.

 

[Sassy Colombian]

Contempt of Congress is the next move, but it has fewer teeth than you might think.

The last time anyone actually served a sentence for such a citation was almost a century ago, and that sentence ended up being ten days confined to a room in a luxury DC hotel. Congress has held two of the last three Democrats to hold the position of Attorney General in contempt, as well as Bush's White House counsel Harriet Miers. Henry Kissinger and Neil Gorsuch's mother are also on the list of executive branch officials that have been hit with a contempt charge without incurring real consequences.

In other words, this is fairly standard posturing in a case like this. It might be more serious than usual given the circumstances, but the Democrats are in a difficult spot. Making a congressional contempt citation have teeth makes it very hard to govern when the government is divided. Inaction is not an option. Appointing an impartial special counsel (as the House arguably has a conflict of interest as victims) will slow things down quite a bit.

I don't envy the Democrats this particular kettle of fish.

I am glad Democrats are in power but given the minimum margins it really makes it almost impossible to govern and even harder to run this type of investigations.

My problem with this committee is that if they are going to make threads about pursuing criminal charges then they need to follow those threads with actions or Republicans will make the most of their bluff.

If Bannon continues refusing to testify he needs to be put in jail, plain and simple. No luxury DC hotels or at home confinement. Put him on an orange suit and get him behind the bars where he and Trump belong.

 

[Sassy Colombian]

Jail him up!

Steve Bannon's defense sent another letter to the January 6 committee saying he and others will not cooperate

The White House counsel reportedly asked the National Archives on Wednesday to turn over Trump-related documents to the January 6 committee.

www.yahoo.com

 

[Ruairi77]

I am glad Democrats are in power but given the minimum margins it really makes it almost impossible to govern and even harder to run this type of investigations.

My problem with this committee is that if they are going to make threads about pursuing criminal charges then they need to follow those threads with actions or Republicans will make the most of their bluff.

If Bannon continues refusing to testify he needs to be put in jail, plain and simple. No luxury DC hotels or at home confinement. Put him on an orange suit and get him behind the bars where he and Trump belong.

yea, I'm a fan of Pelosi most of the time but the democrats have got to look at their core leadership.
Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer. For me, all 3 seem to be grounded in the politics of yesterday. The republicans are playing every trick card in the book, making new rules as they go and straight up cheating the system and the Dems are sitting in rocking chairs saying "trust the system","it'll turn out ok".
It's all too easy for Trump to tie all this up in legal loopholes while the dems are too scared to do anything to counter incase they further enrage trumps base.
Moderate Democrats are absolutely spineless.

 

[tsubaki]

yea, I'm a fan of Pelosi most of the time but the democrats have got to look at their core leadership.
Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer. For me, all 3 seem to be grounded in the politics of yesterday. The republicans are playing every trick card in the book, making new rules as they go and straight up cheating the system and the Dems are sitting in rocking chairs saying "trust the system","it'll turn out ok".
It's all too easy for Trump to tie all this up in legal loopholes while the dems are too scared to do anything to counter incase they further enrage trumps base.
Moderate Democrats are absolutely spineless.

TBF Biden at least won a massively important election, and he is right to try and be the adult in the room if only because it highlights how much McConnell etc are scum. Pelosi and Schumer are terrible though, walking adverts for term limits and a mandatory retirement age (70 at a maximum) for most elected representatives.

Everything effective on that side of the aisle is coming from younger and lets face it vastly more capable politicians like AOC.

 

[Martin Alvito]

I am glad Democrats are in power but given the minimum margins it really makes it almost impossible to govern and even harder to run this type of investigations.

My problem with this committee is that if they are going to make threads about pursuing criminal charges then they need to follow those threads with actions or Republicans will make the most of their bluff.

If Bannon continues refusing to testify he needs to be put in jail, plain and simple. No luxury DC hotels or at home confinement. Put him on an orange suit and get him behind the bars where he and Trump belong.

I agree that the lack of a real governing majority in the Senate is a problem. The last time the Senate split evenly twenty years ago, Jim Jeffords ultimately turned coat and threw the Senate to the Democrats. I don't think that Manchin will do that as he doesn't want to face a primary challenge from the right, but the reality is that he's more or less forced to stake out non-Democratic positions due to his electorate. I think that the Democrats could bargain that one out relatively easily, if it weren't for Sinema throwing sticks in the spokes of the bicycle. I'm not quite sure what her game is. The only thing that makes sense to me is that she's looking for a contrarian talking head post at Fox after she loses her re-election bid.

By statute the Democrats could put Bannon in jail for up to a year if they can get Justice to prosecute, though Bannon can't be held until after the next Congress convenes in any event. Getting Justice to prosecute is an open question, as Biden's institutionalist streak probably means that he would prefer not to go down that road unless it becomes absolutely unavoidable. On the other hand, Biden is the guy that borked Robert Bork, so we've seen him change the rules before.

 

[Sassy Colombian]

yea, I'm a fan of Pelosi most of the time but the democrats have got to look at their core leadership.
Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer. For me, all 3 seem to be grounded in the politics of yesterday. The republicans are playing every trick card in the book, making new rules as they go and straight up cheating the system and the Dems are sitting in rocking chairs saying "trust the system","it'll turn out ok".
It's all too easy for Trump to tie all this up in legal loopholes while the dems are too scared to do anything to counter incase they further enrage trumps base.
Moderate Democrats are absolutely spineless.

I'm also a Pelosi fan, I admire her strength in a Congress of mostly men but Democrats definitely need to up their game. Republicans do as they please when they are in power and also when they are not. It is very upsetting that they continue cheating the system and sabotaging our democracy with the lies of a stolen election and now with changes to voting restrictions while the Democrats have internal fights that are solving nothing. There are two moderate Democrats at the moment that are the most spineless of all and that's Sinema and Manchin, they are sabotaging Biden's agenda and Republicans are loving it!

 

[LinekersLegs]