Roberto Martinez discussion

Status
Not open for further replies.
PLOTTERS v CULT

PSfskUc.gif
 

Obviously Barton's character can seriously be called to doubt, so naturally Dave was going to be all over that, just as he when was calling Alex Ferguson and alky when his valued and professional opinion about something went against his.......see also Merson, Moyes, Collymore and any other ex pro or person actually with some knowledge of the game, unlike of course to GOT's very own Mike Parry wannabe.

Anybody who gives and opinion against Daves is either slandered or put in a category. Still, if it keeps people coming back for clicks eh!

I take offence to this. We run this website in the red so people like you can come and express your opinions. Please do not accuse of doing this as some sort of click-bait.
 
What are you chatting Zatman??

Honestly, that Moyes team.

Did you think, I know, lets pick the worst possible team I can muster.

Moyes last team was :

Howard
Coleman - Jags - Distin - Baines
Felli - Gibson
Mirallas - Naismith - Pienaar
Victor
5 players from that team are still with the club and very much first team players, 2 players are still at the club and are worthless, 3 players were sold for a combined fee of 44m, 1 player left for free.

Martinez has signed 20 players for 100m in his 3 years at the club, just love the way people twist Stones and Barkley towards Martinez, you cant have them, they belong to Moyes, team Martinez also cant have Lukaku, his signing was only made possible by the sale of Felli, who also belongs to Moyes. So factor in the Moyes team above, which team would win, that 1 or :

Robles
Holgate - Mori - Foulds - Barry
Besic - McCarthy
Geri ----------------- Naisse
Kone - Tarashjai
Distin of 3 years ago would have put Kone in his pocket, Besic would get sent off for chinning Felli for elbowing him, Mirallas would run the 2 fullbacks all over the park allowing Naismith to score for fun while Victor stood there sulking like the big fanny he is.

Basically, Moyes team would win, 4-0, cos Martinez team cant defend.

Its true, Moyes left an ageing squad, Martinez has had 5 windows and 100m to fix that issue, guess what hes done, he gave a 35 year old Goalkeeper a 2 year contract extension, meaning he would be at the club till the age of 39, he gave a 32 year old Gareth Barry a 3 year contract, he also gave a 1 year extension to 36 year old Distin and signed 29 year old Arouna Kone an a 3 year contract with a 12month extension, not to mention giving 32 year old Tony Hibbert a 2 year contract. (Tired, so my ages and lengths of contract may not be 100%)

I bet that hurts Zatman, read it and weep. Where is your God NOW.
Wish there was a clapping emoj...great post. Another thing to mention, At least two of our youngest most exciting players will be asking to move in about 4 months anyway. We will then have another 100 million. I don't want a team rebuild, I want a manager that's lucky, One that makes a mistake....realises that mistake and rectifies said mistake, A winner, A manager that hates to loose, One that will use the best players...... at the right time !! As far as I can tell only one is El Boberto
 

What I can't abide is the seemingly stubbornness to put right his weaknesses.
Do that and he would become a top manager.

That's the frustration for me.
Classy guy. Buys well. Clearly talented.

But he has glaring weaknesses which show no sign of being worked on or fixed.

Defending. Set pieces. Fitness. Discipline.

Football is more than just what we do with the ball.
 
If we werent robbed of points this season and had terrible luck we'd have gained 6pts at least and be above united.

Im not sure if people are even factoring that in as its basic common sense. Also the team will have a years more experience and a new keeper coming in for next season.

The smart money is on top 4 next season.
Apart from the Chelsea goal, I cannot recall another last minute implosion that wasn't self-inflicted.
 
What I can't abide is the seemingly stubbornness to put right his weaknesses.
Do that and he would become a top manager.

That's the frustration for me.
Classy guy. Buys well. Clearly talented.

But he has glaring weaknesses which show no sign of being worked on or fixed.

Defending. Set pieces. Fitness. Discipline.

Football is more than just what we do with the ball.
Yep. I'd say the attacking aspect is the much easier part to coach, as it's more to do with how your own player use the ball, so you can practise that to your heart's content. Defending requires an understanding of how your opponents will set up, their attacking tactics and common set piece routines. RM clearly isn't doing his homework.
 

What I can't abide is the seemingly stubbornness to put right his weaknesses.
Do that and he would become a top manager.

That's the frustration for me.
Classy guy. Buys well. Clearly talented.

But he has glaring weaknesses which show no sign of being worked on or fixed.

Defending. Set pieces. Fitness. Discipline.

Football is more than just what we do with the ball.
Yep. I'd say the attacking aspect is the much easier part to coach, as it's more to do with how your own player use the ball, so you can practise that to your heart's content. Defending requires an understanding of how your opponents will set up, their attacking tactics and common set piece routines. RM clearly isn't doing his homework.
 
The thing is, where are we EXPECTED to finish?

Theres no depth in key areas and no quality keeper.

Theres been key injuries.

Refs doing us over.

Bad luck in not finishing teams off e.g WBA/Norwich.

If you remove the wages on players left by Moyes who we couldnt shift until this summer we would probably be mid table....

On paper the first eleven should be top 6. They still have years to gsin experience and develop (stones/barkley/deulofeu/lukaku and even mccarthy)

If we were 5th now (which we could be if we had beaten WBA and one other team so no stretch) then would Martinez be getting such stick = NO.

However people paying money to watch home games prefer Moyes record at home i think as opposed to the better football on show...so its clouding their opinions.

in my opinion anything top 6 and we are OVERachieving this season.

Next season with a top GK, new CM and competition for Lukaku is the time to judge him. He has needed to spend what he has where he can and this summer has the opportunity with money and players out of contract to do so.

Have you just made an argument based on adding two imaginary wins to our tally? What if we just arbitrarily take off 6 points? If Newcastle had scored first on Boxing Day and a few draws v City Spurs and Liverpool had been losses (quite easily given the blatant pen we gave up and Kane's awful finishing) we'd be down in the depths and the calls for Martinez to go would be resounding.

Let's deal in reality please. You can't have a whole 18 months of bad luck, refereeing errors, injuries, unlucky finishing, one of those days etc. Martinez takes responsibility for all of our results good and bad.
 
What are you chatting Zatman??

Honestly, that Moyes team.

Did you think, I know, lets pick the worst possible team I can muster.

Moyes last team was :

Howard
Coleman - Jags - Distin - Baines
Felli - Gibson
Mirallas - Naismith - Pienaar
Victor
5 players from that team are still with the club and very much first team players, 2 players are still at the club and are worthless, 3 players were sold for a combined fee of 44m, 1 player left for free.

Martinez has signed 20 players for 100m in his 3 years at the club, just love the way people twist Stones and Barkley towards Martinez, you cant have them, they belong to Moyes, team Martinez also cant have Lukaku, his signing was only made possible by the sale of Felli, who also belongs to Moyes. So factor in the Moyes team above, which team would win, that 1 or :

Robles
Holgate - Mori - Foulds - Barry
Besic - McCarthy
Geri ----------------- Naisse
Kone - Tarashjai
Distin of 3 years ago would have put Kone in his pocket, Besic would get sent off for chinning Felli for elbowing him, Mirallas would run the 2 fullbacks all over the park allowing Naismith to score for fun while Victor stood there sulking like the big fanny he is.

Basically, Moyes team would win, 4-0, cos Martinez team cant defend.

Its true, Moyes left an ageing squad, Martinez has had 5 windows and 100m to fix that issue, guess what hes done, he gave a 35 year old Goalkeeper a 2 year contract extension, meaning he would be at the club till the age of 39, he gave a 32 year old Gareth Barry a 3 year contract, he also gave a 1 year extension to 36 year old Distin and signed 29 year old Arouna Kone an a 3 year contract with a 12month extension, not to mention giving 32 year old Tony Hibbert a 2 year contract. (Tired, so my ages and lengths of contract may not be 100%)

I bet that hurts Zatman, read it and weep. Where is your God NOW.

Firstly, your point of Lukaku's acquisition can't be put into Martinez's team is one of the strangest points I've seen in...ever.

But. BUT. Why this comparison is occurring is a mystery @Zatara

Moyes had 11 years and a totally different mandate. During the AGM it was openly admitted that the previous manager had the money to purely concentrate on the first team and slight fringes. With all of the new money, Martinez is allowed to bring in the likes of Holgate, Foulds and Shani (not attempting to spell that surname).

There is a lot of debates to be had regarding our ex and our current, but the fact they were both very good in the market doesn't seem a debate worth having imo.

Ignore me though, carry on.
 
Let's not bring Moyes' squad into this. As a handover it was not bad at all. Some old experienced pros (gladly used by Martinez), some extremely talented youngsters, and a good raft of players in their prime (which Martinez has gleefully sold for good amounts to aid his restructuring). Martinez has had 6 windows and a lot of money to do what he wants with the squad. mondy for very expensive loans, Everton's most expensive striker, defender and wide player (Niasse) all purchased. Overstocking of players in the central and side positions of midfield.

Yet after all this people are still blaming Moyes' squad for our failings this season, laughably even the fringe players like Hibbert Pienaar Osman etc.

Look at what Pochettino did at Spurs. Big stars brought in by the Bale money ruthlessly sold off if they weren't of use to him. Academy products brought through (far more than Martinez has in less time), popular players such as Mason Bentaleb benched for better players in better form.

This squad excuse really is laughable. It's just poor management simple as that.
 
What I can't abide is the seemingly stubbornness to put right his weaknesses.
Do that and he would become a top manager.

That's the frustration for me.
Classy guy. Buys well. Clearly talented.

But he has glaring weaknesses which show no sign of being worked on or fixed.

Defending. Set pieces. Fitness. Discipline.

Football is more than just what we do with the ball.

That's it really. 18 months of absolute tosh and we haven't fixed our problems.

If this was 2000 it'd be fine but it's 2016 and given our squad, it's not good enough. The only reason Martinez has any support left is that we can all see his positives. Walter Smith had no redeeming factors but Martinez does so much right. We want him to turn it around. But he's shown no signs of learning from, or even acknowledging some glaring problems. Problems which undermine what's good about the team and nullify the 20 goal a season striker we spent two and a half decades begging for.

If he can't turn it around by the end of the season then I'd be disappointed to see him start the next. I hope he does turn it around, but he's had a lot, lot longer than other managers would get and thus far, has us sitting in the same league position as last year without the excuse of Europe.
 

Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome

Join Grand Old Team to get involved in the Everton discussion. Signing up is quick, easy, and completely free.

Shop

Back
Top