2024/25 Sean Dyche - Sacked

Status
Not open for further replies.

JLW said:
We’re a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.
Click to expand...
Fine margins in football.
A manager that comes in an upsets the players could get us relegated.
Rub of the green v Southampton and Bournemouth we are 6 points better off.
 
Marius57 said:
I love this whole “on paper” argument as it’s entirely subjective.

But I didn’t necessarily just mean on paper. I also meant on the way those teams performed on those days as well as their performances before and after the games.

For example, saints having only 1 win all season. Brentford having 10 men and at that point having zero points away from home and now still only having 1. None of them exactly put in good performances against us.

Personally think the squad we have should have been on 22/23 points at this point. (10th to 13th).

It’s not just about necessarily dropping points though, it’s about manner of some of the performances as well (such as the heavy loss to Brighton, the capitulations at Bournemouth and Villa, the scraping last minute equaliser against a poor looking Fulham).
Click to expand...
The Bournemouth game was genuinely scarring but the others just aren't a massive deal for me. I don't mean in a sense of saying oh who cares, or it's nothing to worry about or whatever, it's annoying and we have every right to moan about it - it's just that pretty much everyone can say the same things about their games, they're just standard poor performances by a bottom half side, you're always going to get them. I don't think 22/23 points is totally unthinkable but if we were on that at this stage I would think we were doing very well and would genuinely be thinking that Dyche deserved a new contract. That's not a wind up, I think any manager who comes in when you're 19th and keeps you up, and then gets you 12th and then improves on that again deserves the opportunity to carry on and see just how much more improvement they can get out of you. It has never occurred to me that we would give Dyche a new contract because I've never thought it remotely likely that we would be in the top half this year.
 

Groucho said:
See, what I don't get is why he's being treated like Sam Allardyce by some quarters.

Sam Allardyce who on being interviewed for the club's media channels after being appointed was asked "why come back to management now" and responded "it's Everton I suppose".

You suppose? He supposed?

At least Dyche is aware of the size of the club/fanbase/history. He knows it's the biggest job he's ever getting and listen I'm not saying it's pretty but I just feel some of the negativity directed at him is disproportionate.
Click to expand...
Haha, Allardyce's press conference where you could see his cogs turning "don't say £6m, don't say £6m..." before wheezing out "Everton, I suppose".

As for Dyche, it's pure frustration in my view. He's a lightening rod for it. The board are absent, so it is hard to direct at them. Folk understand we're not in a good place off field, takeover pending. I think the club is incredibly lucky folk have stayed so engaged, particularly matchgoing fans.

But there's a point when not seeing much joy on the pitch gets to people. He's a pragmatic manager, so it was possibly inevitable, especially if results are patchy and thrills low. Probably the closest comparison to Allardyce is the pragmatism.

Would a more expansive manager deliver? Honestly not a question I think we can get a clear answer to. It might be prettier, but the results aren't guaranteed.
 
Evertons biggest issue since Moshiri came in, is simply having no long term plan with regards to ensuring managers have players who fit with their tactics. Playing defensively under Moyes worked because we had Cahill, Felaini or other players who could take chances and Pienaar, Baines, Arteta and Coleman created these chances. Our problem is we don't have players to feed DCL. Dyches tactics only work if we score 1st, if opposition scores 1st there is zero ability to make things happen.
 
The forum of extremes, there never seems to be a middle ground and usually somewhere in there you find the truth.

Sean Dyche , in my opinion, has done wonderfully well to keep us in the division in the previous two seasons. I think any fair minded person would agree with that.

So far, I think this season has been his poorest since coming to us. I think he will keep us safe again, if given the opportunity. However, I also think that by now we should be far more comfortable than we are and I think his totally negative tactics are responsible for that.

I have no idea if he will be sacked shortly or will see out the season but I am convinced he will not be manager in BMD when we move there.
 
twoblue said:
Fine margins in football.
A manager that comes in an upsets the players could get us relegated.
Rub of the green v Southampton and Bournemouth we are 6 points better off.
Click to expand...
Especially if you go out each game with an emphasis of trying not to concede at all costs instead of scoring a goal
 

twoblue said:
Fine margins in football.
A manager that comes in an upsets the players could get us relegated.
Rub of the green v Southampton and Bournemouth we are 6 points better off.
Click to expand...
What a terrible argument for keeping Dyche.

If we get rid we just might be even worse than we are now

From a pure footballing perspective I'd like to see the end of Dyche now and if Wolves and Southampton get a new manager bounce ( perhaps unlikely) we could be in difficulties if we miss the same boat.

The only argument for retaining Dyche is that we are supremely confident that we will stay up even with him in charge and it's easier to attract a better quality manager and allow them to reorganize in the summer.
 
Daveysgingerlovechild said:
Haha, Allardyce's press conference where you could see his cogs turning "don't say £6m, don't say £6m..." before wheezing out "Everton, I suppose".

As for Dyche, it's pure frustration in my view. He's a lightening rod for it. The board are absent, so it is hard to direct at them. Folk understand we're not in a good place off field, takeover pending. I think the club is incredibly lucky folk have stayed so engaged, particularly matchgoing fans.

But there's a point when not seeing much joy on the pitch gets to people. He's a pragmatic manager, so it was possibly inevitable, especially if results are patchy and thrills low. Probably the closest comparison to Allardyce is the pragmatism.

Would a more expansive manager deliver? Honestly not a question I think we can get a clear answer to. It might be prettier, but the results aren't guaranteed.
Click to expand...
Probably fair to say that Russell Martin, Gary O'Neil and some others that have come and gone in Dyches time probably wouldn't have done better in terms of league placing.

Having that polar opposite view - that any manager would do better than Dyche - sounds just as daft to me as suggesting he is a miracle worker.
 
CielosGrises said:
Probably fair to say that Russell Martin, Gary O'Neil and some others that have come and gone in Dyches time probably wouldn't have done better in terms of league placing.

Having that polar opposite view - that any manager would do better than Dyche - sounds just as daft to me as suggesting he is a miracle worker.
Click to expand...
He's wildly frustrating. There's games where experimenting or taking a risk with subs wouldn't go amiss. Very rigid in his approach.

But so are a lot of managers.
 
CielosGrises said:
Probably fair to say that Russell Martin, Gary O'Neil and some others that have come and gone in Dyches time probably wouldn't have done better in terms of league placing.

Having that polar opposite view - that any manager would do better than Dyche - sounds just as daft to me as suggesting he is a miracle worker.
Click to expand...
Agreed.

Managers depend on the quality of player at their disposal.
The better the manager is the more they can get from a group of players but the are limits to what anyone can achieve
 

Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome

Join Grand Old Team to get involved in the Everton discussion. Signing up is quick, easy, and completely free.

Register

Shop

Back
Top