2024/25 Sean Dyche - Sacked

[John from Bootle]

You don’t think we could have beaten Leicester, saints and Brentford?

On paper yes. Football is not played on paper though. as evidenced by us getting a point at Arsenal but losing at Saints. We're a bottom half team and that normally involves dropping points in loads of games. Even challenging for top 4 normally involves dropping points in just short of half of your games. 20 wins normally has you there or there abouts. Sometimes a bit less, sometimes a bit more.

I think it was @Lanolin who pointed out a few weeks ago that if we'd won all the games we were 'supposed' to win then we'd be 2nd in the table. I'm fairly comfortable saying we're underachieving by 3/4 points.

 

[Groucho]

Where he bores the living daylights out of us for the season but gets enough moody wins to see us comfortably safe with no dramas.

See, what I don't get is why he's being treated like Sam Allardyce by some quarters.

Sam Allardyce who on being interviewed for the club's media channels after being appointed was asked "why come back to management now" and responded "it's Everton I suppose".

You suppose? He supposed?

At least Dyche is aware of the size of the club/fanbase/history. He knows it's the biggest job he's ever getting and listen I'm not saying it's pretty but I just feel some of the negativity directed at him is disproportionate.

 

[JLW]

On paper yes. Football is not played on paper though. as evidenced by us getting a point at Arsenal but losing at Saints. We're a bottom half team and that normally involves dropping points in loads of games. Even challenging for top 4 normally involves dropping points in just short of half of your games. 20 wins normally has you there or there abouts. Sometimes a bit less, sometimes a bit more.

I think it was @Lanolin who pointed out a few weeks ago that if we'd won all the games we were 'supposed' to win then we'd be 2nd in the table. I'm fairly comfortable saying we're underachieving by 3/4 points.

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

 

[blueboy72]

Wowzers!!!!!!!

Was about to comment but dont really know were to start so il just leave it.

All you have to do is ask him a question about dyche that he finds a bit tricky and, he will just answer very quickly “ you know nothing about football “

 

[John from Bootle]

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

I disagree. It's just your opinion and there's very little evidence to back it up.

I think 19 points for us now would be about right for where we are. That would be 7 points clear of the drop zone and 9 points off the top 4. What should the gap to the top 4 be for us? 6 points? 5 points? 4 Points ( )?

 

[Groucho]

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

I don't think the players should ever be expunged of blame, regardless of who is in charge.

If they're not performing because of a manager, then they're unprofessional and deserve just as much criticism, if not more.

 

[Marius57]

On paper yes. Football is not played on paper though. as evidenced by us getting a point at Arsenal but losing at Saints. We're a bottom half team and that normally involves dropping points in loads of games. Even challenging for top 4 normally involves dropping points in just short of half of your games. 20 wins normally has you there or there abouts. Sometimes a bit less, sometimes a bit more.

I think it was @Lanolin who pointed out a few weeks ago that if we'd won all the games we were 'supposed' to win then we'd be 2nd in the table. I'm fairly comfortable saying we're underachieving by 3/4 points.

I love this whole “on paper” argument as it’s entirely subjective.

But I didn’t necessarily just mean on paper. I also meant on the way those teams performed on those days as well as their performances before and after the games.

For example, saints having only 1 win all season. Brentford having 10 men and at that point having zero points away from home and now still only having 1. None of them exactly put in good performances against us.

Personally think the squad we have should have been on 22/23 points at this point. (10th to 13th).

It’s not just about necessarily dropping points though, it’s about manner of some of the performances as well (such as the heavy loss to Brighton, the capitulations at Bournemouth and Villa, the scraping last minute equaliser against a poor looking Fulham).

 

[JLW]

I don't think the players should ever be expunged of blame, regardless of who is in charge.

If they're not performing because of a manager, then they're unprofessional and deserve just as much criticism, if not more.

The players are not exempt from criticism but they are instructed what to do on the pitch by the manager and his coaching staff.

I misplaced pass or a sitter isnt on the manager but the not creating or attacking is on him.
Instructing Pickford to launch to DCL everytime is on him
He is there to get the best out of what tools he has.

Can you say that each player or any player is playing to their max ability?

 

[Deleted member 50501]

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

I just don't understand what you're basing this off of. We've been bottom half for nearly 4 seasons running and you've only seen this current squad play under Dyche. What makes you think they're being stunted?

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Another week passes with this born loser in the dugout.

Its a shame our fans cant go the game with any hope or to be entertained.
Instead we just have to endure us chasing Chelsea around the pitch for 90 mins in the hope we get fouled in or around their box or get a deflection for a corner.

5 mil a year for that!!!

It's a matter of when he ceaces to be Everton manager, no it's or buts...

 

[Groucho]

The players are not exempt from criticism but they are instructed what to do on the pitch by the manager and his coaching staff.

I misplaced pass or a sitter isnt on the manager but the not creating or attacking is on him.
Instructing Pickford to launch to DCL everytime is on him
He is there to get the best out of what tools he has.

Can you say that each player or any player is playing to their max ability?

No but other than Man City (usually) and Liverpool (usually), I'm not sure any team has all eleven players operating at maximum capacity all of the time.

I think a balanced view is required.

No, it's not pretty football. No, it's not getting us into Europe. What it is is being defensively as solid as we can while we wait for the new owners to step in and do what they will.

I'm not sure there's many managers out there with the mental strength to cope with us as a fanbase in times such as these. I see Graeme Potter mentioned at times, who was close to tears when Chelsea fans briefly turned on him. He'd have a nervous breakdown here. What we need at this moment in time (not in a year when we can look to develop, but right now) is a mentally tough manager and that's what we have.

I'm in no way saying it's an ideal situation but it is where we find ourselves. So to get out of this funk, we need to sit tight, get our heads down and graft while we wait for the imminent investment and, hopefully, improvements all round.

 

[JLW]

I just don't understand what you're basing this off of. We've been bottom half for nearly 4 seasons running and you've only seen this current squad play under Dyche. What makes you think they're being stunted?

Three really poor managers mate

Dyche
Lampard
Benitez

 

[Lanolin]

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

On what evidence though? What is there in the careers of these players here or elsewhere that makes you say that, because I can't see it. Obviously it's not that us being 10th or 11th is impossible, but I genuinely don't see anything at all either on the pitch or on paper which backs up the idea that this side should be coming 10th with a 'half decent' manager. Taking that logic to its natural conclusion we're surely saying that a fully decent manager has us top 6? Maybe top 4? We've not finished higher than 10th for 5 years, Carlo Ancelotti couldn't get a team with Digne, Richarlison, James, Sigurdsson etc higher than 10th, we were finishing 8th when we were routinely buying players for 30 odd million and paying the 150k a week, but now that should be the minimum expectation for a team made up of loans, frees, and players bought on klarna from other relegation threatened sides? Absolute nonsense.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Were a bottom half team because of the manager not the squad, a half decent manager gets us top of the bottom half or bottom of the top half.

Have much more balanced side than last season. Even with Onana gone, when you get down to it didn't really play or came on late in those games we picked up important points.

 

[twoblue]

We’re 3 points off the relegation zone so this theory doesn’t make sense.

well the last couple of weeks have been ok. Sure he’ll be back soon to hang out with you soon, there’s a difficult run of fixtures.