Transfer Rumour Zaha with poll

[TheBigIguana]

What relevance does that have when the opposition are the ones fouling? You cant usually choose where you are fouled.

If you could, id say fouling a DM relieves defensive pressure.

It's relevant in that as a DM the jobs you are asked to do aren't really fulfilled by getting fouled given generally you are being fouled in midfield or defense. The ball doesn't get successfully advanced up field when you are fouled. You have the opportunity to clear it but keeping the ball once you do has nothing to do with getting fouled originally. It doesn't really show that someone is winning the ball back. It could be a side effect but you don't see Gana, Ndidi, Kante, etc. on the list for a reason. Basically a DM can get fouled a ton and doesn't mean he is doing the primary jobs that most midfielders are asked to do: ball winning and moving the ball up field.

On the other hand a winger/forward is asked to create chances to score primarily and if they are being fouled in the attacking third to create those chances that is much more relevant. So it is possible that Zaha is getting fouled in his defensive end and therefore it is meaningless but I've watched him and know that isn't true. Him getting fouled earns Palace chances for shots in good areas while Torreira getting fouled gives Arsenal that chance to pass sideways or hoof it forward. It just isn't the same.

 

[Baines' left foot]

If we can get Zaha, Bernard and Richarlison on the same pitch the potential is frightening. Defenders wouldn’t know what to do.

 

[TheBigIguana]

If we can get Zaha, Bernard and Richarlison on the same pitch the potential is frightening. Defenders wouldn’t know what to do.

If we get a striker that can actually find the net I don't see that happening a ton. Richarlison as a striker with the other two wide may happen if the new striker doesn't.

 

[BigDunc'sFod]

At his best hes a talented boy.

The danger is, does he have the hunger? He flopped at United, hes gone back to Palace and done quite well, his name certainly rings out, is Everton his last move? Wheres his motivation? Theres a danger and not just with this fella, but if we start struggling, do the heads drop or do we fight?

Anyway, you cant dispute the boy is a danger when on it.

Just getting bad Bolaise vibes from him like, I KNOW hes twice the player Bolaise is, but still.

He's older than Gomes

 

[Goat]

He's older than Gomes

Hes younger than me.

 

[BigDunc'sFod]

Hes younger than me.

Isn't everyone?

 

[Zatara]

It's relevant in that as a DM the jobs you are asked to do aren't really fulfilled by getting fouled given generally you are being fouled in midfield or defense. The ball doesn't get successfully advanced up field when you are fouled. You have the opportunity to clear it but keeping the ball once you do has nothing to do with getting fouled originally. It doesn't really show that someone is winning the ball back. It could be a side effect but you don't see Gana, Ndidi, Kante, etc. on the list for a reason. Basically a DM can get fouled a ton and doesn't mean he is doing the primary jobs that most midfielders are asked to do: ball winning and moving the ball up field.

On the other hand a winger/forward is asked to create chances to score primarily and if they are being fouled in the attacking third to create those chances that is much more relevant. So it is possible that Zaha is getting fouled in his defensive end and therefore it is meaningless but I've watched him and know that isn't true. Him getting fouled earns Palace chances for shots in good areas while Torreira getting fouled gives Arsenal that chance to pass sideways or hoof it forward. It just isn't the same.

Again, i dont see how youre saying players can choose when theyre fouled? If any player has a lot of fouls on them then it means the opposition foul them whatever position they play.

If we can get Zaha, Bernard and Richarlison on the same pitch the potential is frightening. Defenders wouldn’t know what to do.

Sit deep, point and laugh?

 

[TheBigIguana]

Again, i dont see how youre saying players can choose when theyre fouled? If any player has a lot of fouls on them then it means the opposition foul them whatever position they play.




Sit deep, point and laugh?

It's not about choosing it's about positional roles and where those players are on the pitch. I don't have any way to show it but I guarantee the fouls Zaha or Hazard earn are closer to the opposing goal than Torreira's because they have the ball closer to the opponents goal than Torreira.

 

[Zatara]

It's not about choosing it's about positional roles and where those players are on the pitch. I don't have any way to show it but I guarantee the fouls Zaha or Hazard earn are closer to the opposing goal than Torreira's because they have the ball closer to the opponents goal than Torreira.

I still have no clue what youre trying to say.

All you appear to be saying is that attacking players being fouled are better and more valuable because they are attacking...

Which makes no sense...players dont choose to be fouled. Also how do you know a DM isnt fouled having made a goalsaving tackle?

Either a player is fouled or he isnt...doesnt mean much to me which is the comparison of Zaha and Torreira...they both get fouled a lot.

Must be a reason why Torreira is fouled, not really a Zaha type diver so...bit peculiar.

 

[Baines' left foot]

If we get a striker that can actually find the net I don't see that happening a ton. Richarlison as a striker with the other two wide may happen if the new striker doesn't.

I’m not sure we’re even after an out and out striker. I suspect Silva may want an interchanging front line with players that are comfortable in several positions.

 

[TheBigIguana]

I still have no clue what youre trying to say.

All you appear to be saying is that attacking players being fouled are better and more valuable because they are attacking...

Which makes no sense...players dont choose to be fouled. Also how do you know a DM isnt fouled having made a goalsaving tackle?

Either a player is fouled or he isnt...doesnt mean much to me which is the comparison of Zaha and Torreira...they both get fouled a lot.

Must be a reason why Torreira is fouled, not really a Zaha type diver so...bit peculiar.

I'm saying two things:

Getting fouled in a more dangerous attacking position is more valuable than getting fouled in your own half for example.

And with that as a basis someone whose job is to attack getting fouled more is probably more valuable overall and makes that person better at doing their job specifically than someone who is tasked with doing the things midfielders do.

In your example of the goal saving tackle the action that matters is the tackle. Whether the guy is fouled, passes it to a teammate, hoofs it out of bounds or whatever else they can do the part that matters is that they stopped the attack with the tackle. For an attacker that dynamic changes more because the act of drawing a foul can directly lead to shots at goal which is typically the only way to score a goal and win the game. The defender doesn't prevent the other teams shot by being fouled he prevents it by making the tackle. It isn't a direct thing.

The whole point being rating a defender because they are good at drawing fouls makes zero sense and is more of a novelty than an indication that they player is any good at playing defender/defensive midfield.

Anyway on Zaha he drew 7 penalties last season and if you count that as directly creating a chance or getting an assist when it is scored he starts to move up the list of creative players in the league pretty quickly. Not many better chances than a penalty.

 

[TheBigIguana]

I’m not sure we’re even after an out and out striker. I suspect Silva may want an interchanging front line with players that are comfortable in several positions.

Kean and Leao have been the two main rumors and although people seem to think them being mobile means they can shift wide, they've almost exclusively played as a classic center forward in their careers. If someone different comes on the radar than maybe but what I make of the rumors we want two wingers who play inside and allow overlapping fullbacks and a classic striker to put the ball in the net.

 

[Zatara]

I'm saying two things:

Getting fouled in a more dangerous attacking position is more valuable than getting fouled in your own half for example.

And with that as a basis someone whose job is to attack getting fouled more is probably more valuable overall and makes that person better at doing their job specifically than someone who is tasked with doing the things midfielders do.

In your example of the goal saving tackle the action that matters is the tackle. Whether the guy is fouled, passes it to a teammate, hoofs it out of bounds or whatever else they can do the part that matters is that they stopped the attack with the tackle. For an attacker that dynamic changes more because the act of drawing a foul can directly lead to shots at goal which is typically the only way to score a goal and win the game. The defender doesn't prevent the other teams shot by being fouled he prevents it by making the tackle. It isn't a direct thing.

The whole point being rating a defender because they are good at drawing fouls makes zero sense and is more of a novelty than an indication that they player is any good at playing defender/defensive midfield.

Anyway on Zaha he drew 7 penalties last season and if you count that as directly creating a chance or getting an assist when it is scored he starts to move up the list of creative players in the league pretty quickly. Not many better chances than a penalty.

I dont see how it can be assumed that an attacker being fouled is more valuable than a midfielder...simply cant judge that at all.

Zaha is the focal point for Palace, totally different style and team. Looking at the team today he starts as CF, if out wide he probably gets 50% of the ball he got at palace or less depending on whether we sign a CF.

I mean we may have Sigurdsson, Kean and Richarlison also on the pitch whereas Palace had Zaha as their main threat.

Kean and Leao have been the two main rumors and although people seem to think them being mobile means they can shift wide, they've almost exclusively played as a classic center forward in their careers. If someone different comes on the radar than maybe but what I make of the rumors we want two wingers who play inside and allow overlapping fullbacks and a classic striker to put the ball in the net.

Id rather sign those 2 and play Kean as the left sided forward.

 

[TheBigIguana]

I dont see how it can be assumed that an attacker being fouled is more valuable than a midfielder...simply cant judge that at all.

Zaha is the focal point for Palace, totally different style and team. Looking at the team today he starts as CF, if out wide he probably gets 50% of the ball he got at palace or less depending on whether we sign a CF.

I mean we may have Sigurdsson, Kean and Richarlison also on the pitch whereas Palace had Zaha as their main threat.




Id rather sign those 2 and play Kean as the left sided forward.

I wish I had access to data to show the foul thing but I just don't so I'm going to leave it.

I agree with Zaha having to adjust to fitting into a team that gets him the ball less being a problem.

Kean hasn't played LW since he played for the Juve u17s so I really don't see that as a viable option personally.

 

[Baines' left foot]

Kean and Leao have been the two main rumors and although people seem to think them being mobile means they can shift wide, they've almost exclusively played as a classic center forward in their careers. If someone different comes on the radar than maybe but what I make of the rumors we want two wingers who play inside and allow overlapping fullbacks and a classic striker to put the ball in the net.

Whatever happens we will have an exciting attack. Just can’t wait for this circus to be over with for another few months.