Usmanov

[gwladysnight]

There is liquidity in the financial markets, but it's not really being passed on to customers. Its certainly not being passed into football clubs mate.

I find it odd football clubs use the bridging loan companies, but they fulfil a function and most do it to varying degrees.

Tottenham borrowed £175m at the rate of 0.5% taking advantage of the governments Covid Corporate Financing Facility. We have borrowed £100m+ at around 7%.

Most clubs do not use bridging loans from dodgy offshore companies. They get Revolving Credit Facilities from high street banks. We can't do that because we are posting 100's of millions of losses and being propped up by loans from Moshiri. The banks won't touch us.

Even the Metro bank loan is government backed.

 

[Goat]

We have borrowed £100m+ at around 7%.

We really havent.

 

[catcherintherye]

So what are you suggesting that we are being bankrolled by Usmanov but in such a clever way that he isn't using any of his own money. Maybe he should let his mate Abramovich know how he does it.

I think what he would be suggesting is that we are being bankrolled by a billionaire, who would have a better use of his liquidity than ensuring the summer passes ok.

On investments I have, I sometimes do similar. Will take a loan for leverage. Maybe 7-8% p/a . I'd expect the company to grow by 80% with tbe leverage. I could afford to fund it myself, but it's worth using the liquidity with those payback options.

 

[gwladysnight]

Hold on, Chelsea uses the same sort of bridging loans we do. What could he learn from Abramovic, when they use the same approach?

I'd imagine Usmanov wants to tie his capital up in projects that have a much higher ROIC than the 8% or whatever we get charged from the financial institutions we borrow from. It just wont register as a problem.

Chelsea do not use the same sort of bridging loans we use. The last charge placed on Chelsea was 15 years ago.

CHELSEA FC HOLDINGS LIMITED charges - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

CHELSEA FC HOLDINGS LIMITED - Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk

 

[catcherintherye]

Tottenham borrowed £175m at the rate of 0.5% taking advantage of the governments Covid Corporate Financing Facility. We have borrowed £100m+ at around 7%.

Most clubs do not use bridging loans from dodgy offshore companies. They get Revolving Credit Facilities from high street banks. We can't do that because we are posting 100's of millions of losses and being propped up by loans from Moshiri. The banks won't touch us.

Even the Metro bank loan is government backed.

Spurs took advantage of a 1 off borrowing agreement though, with quite stringent repayment terms. That's not a commercial loan though.

What is your evidence these companies are dodgy? Or any more dodgy than a High Street bank?

I'm not sure we have ever posted hundreds of millions of a loss in any year mate. You might want to re-assess that.

Likewise, we havent borrowed 100m+ have we?

As for being propped up, it was my understanding the loans had been converted to equity. So again I'm not sure that's the case.

You seem to be taking a small issue, which is an issue, and making all sorts of generalisations from it, that arent true. It sort of dilutes from a decent point.

 

[catcherintherye]

Chelsea do not use the same sort of bridging loans we use. The last charge placed on Chelsea was 15 years ago.

CHELSEA FC HOLDINGS LIMITED charges - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

CHELSEA FC HOLDINGS LIMITED - Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk

Ah ok. They just owe their owner over 1bn then.

That would seem far more dangerous than a bridging loan to me.

 

[gwladysnight]

I think what he would be suggesting is that we are being bankrolled by a billionaire, who would have a better use of his liquidity than ensuring the summer passes ok.

On investments I have, I sometimes do similar. Will take a loan for leverage. Maybe 7-8% p/a . I'd expect the company to grow by 80% with tbe leverage. I could afford to fund it myself, but it's worth using the liquidity with those payback options.

That is probably one of the funniest posts I have ever read.

For the last 12 years the Bank of England base rate has been below 1%.

Loans are readily available below 3%, but you have been borrowing at 7-8% despite having the money in the bank.

Let's face it you are chatting bubbles mate.

 

[catcherintherye]

That is probably one of the funniest posts I have ever read.

For the last 12 years the Bank of England base rate has been below 1%.

Loans are readily available below 3%, but you have been borrowing at 7-8% despite having the money in the bank.

Let's face it you are chatting bubbles mate.

Well it was inadvertent if funny, I can only say it wasnt deliberate haha!

Interbank lending rate is not available to customers and never will be. Outside of mortgages I'm not sure where you can get 3%?

Most business will be at 4-5%. Football clubs probably a bit higher. 7% is not ideal, but it's not disastrous.

As for me, I can use my funds available to buy into other companies. Why do you think I am chatting bubbles? Do you not think it's a bit odd for you to seemingly be assuming you know more about my investment strategy than I do?

For clarity, I borrow at 7-8%. Its for companies I intend to keep for 3-6 month max. It's not the optimum deal on price, but it's easy, quick, flexible so I'm happy to pay a little higher than market rate. It's really not the end of the world.

 

[gwladysnight]

Ah ok. They just owe their owner over 1bn then.

That would seem far more dangerous than a bridging loan to me.

Five minutes ago until I produced evidence from Companies house you were adamant that Abramovich used bridging loans.

 

[Azza]

If we are being bankrolled by one of the richest men on the planet then why have we just taken out a payday loan against next season's TV money and put the Stadium up as surety.


View attachment 127971

Because of a lack of cash flow. The club has done this for decades.

Right and Media Funding Limited (who've been used by other PL teams, obviously something odd going on there), Metro Bank, ICBC, Barclays, JG Funding Limited (who I think it was shown they use the same fronting in IoM as Right and Media Funding Limited) and of course the infamous Vibrac have all been used to gain upfront cash during the off-season and it's been secured against TV money and season ticket revenue.

 

[catcherintherye]

Five minutes ago until I produced evidence from Companies house you were adamant that Abramovich used bridging loans.

You did. I stand corrected on that point. Appreciate you taking the time to do so, hopefully no offence was caused to yourself, an honest mistake from me.

Either way, a billion + loan to a single individual is not ideal from a lending perspective is it? It's quite a long term situation as well isnt it?

 

[catcherintherye]

Because of a lack of cash flow. The club has done this for decades.

Right and Media Funding Limited (who've been used by other PL teams, obviously something odd going on there), Metro Bank, ICBC, Barclays, JG Funding Limited (who I think it was shown they use the same fronting in IoM as Right and Media Funding Limited) and of course the infamous Vibrac have all been used to gain upfront cash during the off-season and it's been secured against TV money and season ticket revenue.

Cash flow is exactly right.

High net worth individuals will prioritise cash over a 7% repayment rate.

 

[gwladysnight]

Well it was inadvertent if funny, I can only say it wasnt deliberate haha!

Interbank lending rate is not available to customers and never will be. Outside of mortgages I'm not sure where you can get 3%?

Most business will be at 4-5%. Football clubs probably a bit higher. 7% is not ideal, but it's not disastrous.

As for me, I can use my funds available to buy into other companies. Why do you think I am chatting bubbles? Do you not think it's a bit odd for you to seemingly be assuming you know more about my investment strategy than I do?

For clarity, I borrow at 7-8%. Its for companies I intend to keep for 3-6 month max. It's not the optimum deal on price, but it's easy, quick, flexible so I'm happy to pay a little higher than market rate. It's really not the end of the world.

Please do not pretend that you are a financial wizard and then state you are not sure where you can get loans for less than 3%. It is embarrassing.

Then to state you buy and sell businesses over a period of 3-6 months is a plan that even Baldric wouldn't think up. Please explain how you can do due diligence on a business, arrange finance, get the legal work done and then sell it again within 3-6 months.

Please explain how you can grow a business by 80% in 3-6 months, borrow money at 7-8% pay all the legals and still make a profit.

As I said you are chatting bubbles.

 

[gwladysnight]

You did. I stand corrected on that point. Appreciate you taking the time to do so, hopefully no offence was caused to yourself, an honest mistake from me.

Either way, a billion + loan to a single individual is not ideal from a lending perspective is it? It's quite a long term situation as well isnt it?

It is a soft loan that Abramovich has no intention of calling in. Why would he Abramovich owns 100% of the business.

 

[TheSecondComing]

Give up on this pipe dream lads