Usmanov

[brettangellnightporter]

Nah I’m suggesting that billionaires know what they’re doing with their money, which is why the majority of clubs take bridging loans even those with very rich owners.

Im not sure why some people still live in this fantasy world where they expect billionaires to go ‘I have 4 billion in the bank, here’s a 100 million pound gift for Everton’s summer transfers. Now I have 3.9 billion in the bank’. It obviously doesn’t work like that but some seem completely adverse to any other sort of financing whatsoever.

Exactly, even billionaires have cash flow problems due to historically low interest rates. Usmanov's reported wealth puts him 6th richest in the uk. Reported uk wealth. The key to everything is Carlo. He knows who's in charge. He knows how much we have. In his last few conferences he is attacking ffp, the big six, and his own current players. What does that add up to?

 

[Kris75]

As the saying goes if you want to make a small fortune from Football start with a large one.

It does remind me of Brewster's millions at times.

 

[gwladysnight]

Hasn't he effectively rolled up all the losses into equity after each season anyhow so he is covering the interest.

No he has made soft loans to the Club and the equity he has injected has increased the percentage of the Club he owns.

For instance, he has agreed to underwrite a share issue of £250m. However, of that £250m only £50m will go to the Club with the other £200m going to repay debt owed to Moshiri.

Whilst that may seem benevolent, the share issue will see his share of the club grow from 77.2% to 93%.

 

[gwladysnight]

Exactly, even billionaires have cash flow problems due to historically low interest rates. Usmanov's reported wealth puts him 6th richest in the uk. Reported uk wealth. The key to everything is Carlo. He knows who's in charge. He knows how much we have. In his last few conferences he is attacking ffp, the big six, and his own current players. What does that add up to?

There are huge amounts of liquidity in the financial markets though and historically low interest rates means borrowing from dubious offshore sources at high interest rates makes even less sense.

 

[gwladysnight]

Well he has run the business aspect well, our commercial revenue has increased, we have a new stadium on the horizon and legacy being left behind. His mistake was the football appointments he made when he first took over which has impeded our faster progression

The commercial revenues haven't really increased though. It is just Moshiri putting his hand in his pocket through USM and associated companies.

There are two likely scenarios, either there is a bottomless pit which means we can carry on losing money hand over fist or there isn't. The second scenario means this extravagant spending with almost no reward is going to come back and bite us on the arse.

 

[lungo]

There are huge amounts of liquidity in the financial markets though and historically low interest rates means borrowing from dubious offshore sources at high interest rates makes even less sense.

The question is who owns the offshore sources. Used to launder money!

 

[gwladysnight]

The question is who owns the offshore sources. Used to launder money!

I would agree if there were positive funds coming into the club from dubious offshore sources. Unfortunately that isn't the case, we are paying more money to the offshore source than we are receiving.

 

[blulouie]

I would agree if there were positive funds coming into the club from dubious offshore sources. Unfortunately that isn't the case, we are paying more money to the offshore source than we are receiving.

Did you get your e,mail off Denise this morning mate ?

Bottom left >reply
Tell her your not happy about the financial state of the club.
I'm sure she'd be interested.

 

[larbert toffee]

Did you get your e,mail off Denise this morning mate ?

Bottom left >reply
Tell her your not happy about the financial state of the club.
I'm sure she'd be interested.

If @gwladysnight does that it will deffo give her the pip.

 

[blueblue]

As a result of the recent ESL fiasco we have seen suggested valuations of both Arsenal Liverpool as being somewhere about 3bn each.

The capital gain the current owners would make would be phenomenal. However we also see that while making a capital gain some owners are at the same time draining money from their clubs without apparently affecting the clubs valuation in a negative way.

If Moshiri does make Everton Into a successful winning club then the gains for him could be huge.....certainly it would dwarf any investment he has made so far.

 

[catcherintherye]

There are huge amounts of liquidity in the financial markets though and historically low interest rates means borrowing from dubious offshore sources at high interest rates makes even less sense.

There is liquidity in the financial markets, but it's not really being passed on to customers. Its certainly not being passed into football clubs mate.

I find it odd football clubs use the bridging loan companies, but they fulfil a function and most do it to varying degrees.

 

[catcherintherye]

I would agree if there were positive funds coming into the club from dubious offshore sources. Unfortunately that isn't the case, we are paying more money to the offshore source than we are receiving.

I'm not sure you've really read or understood his point mate.

Funds are literally coming into the club from these companies in the form of a loan.

 

[catcherintherye]

Ive never claimed Moshiri is running this club well.

Hes hiring managers, throwing money at them, paying money to sack them and then doing it all again.

We are so poorly run its unreal.

But he backs and pays for all his mistakes, mistakes have been made, but the fella just keeps trying again, I know he has his doubters and regards football it appears he has a lot to learn, but other than the oil fellas at City and Big Roman at Chelsea I wouldnt trade him any other owner in the league.

Sure I would rather he didnt have to keep spending vast sums, but to his credit he keeps doing it.

He sees the long game too.

It's worth noting that Amazon lost money for a number of years before becoming profitable. This is not atypical in businesses.

City and Chelsea both ran up huge deficits at first, in the first 10 years or so. There deficits were far sharper than ours, so it will probably take longer before we turn a profit.

You could look at Chelsea, with their billion + deficit and say they are badly run. But then hes won everything multiple times. So depends how you view it really.

 

[catcherintherye]

So what are you suggesting that we are being bankrolled by Usmanov but in such a clever way that he isn't using any of his own money. Maybe he should let his mate Abramovich know how he does it.

Hold on, Chelsea uses the same sort of bridging loans we do. What could he learn from Abramovic, when they use the same approach?

I'd imagine Usmanov wants to tie his capital up in projects that have a much higher ROIC than the 8% or whatever we get charged from the financial institutions we borrow from. It just wont register as a problem.

 

[catcherintherye]

That is the point though. It is a very expensive way of borrowing money. The going rate for loans against future media revenue are 7%. Why would one of the richest men on the planet pay way over the going rate to borrow money.

Do you think the likes of Mansoor and Abramovich resort to borrowing money at way above the going rate. From a fiduciary perspective the Directors of Everton have a duty to act in the best interests of Everton FC. To me that says that we are unable to borrow the money in a cheaper way.

Yes Chelse borrow money. And 7% is actually quite a low way of borrowing money in many ways.

We, and pretty much every other team do this, because footballs revenues streams are cyclical.

Does the existence of a loan mean you cant be being financially supported by a billionaire?