The 2015 Popularity Contest (aka UK General Election )

[peteblue]

........I hate politicians of all colours saying things like, 'the public want this', 'people aren't interested in this they are more focused on that', 'on the door step bla, bla, bla'.

They are not talking about me when they say the 'people on the streets want this' so stop using such blanket statements.

There are very few politicians nowadays who even have a clue about most peoples lives and hopes. They are far more concerned with their own finances and power. Lib/Lab/Con, they are all the same and all come from the bossy boots school of elitism. I'm sick of the whole charade........

 

[Eggs]

There are very few politicians nowadays who even have a clue about most peoples lives and hopes. They are far more concerned with their own finances and power. Lib/Lab/Con, they are all the same and all come from the bossy boots school of elitism. I'm sick of the whole charade........

......amazing how their interest peaks at General Election time. I have been more impressed with a number of very young MPs in Labour ranks, they seem a breath of fresh air in comparison with more experienced counterparts. Little chance of the established moving aside.

It's hard not to be cynical.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

......amazing how their interest peaks at General Election time. I have been more impressed with a number of very young MPs in Labour ranks, they seem a breath of fresh air in comparison with more experienced counterparts. Little chance of the established moving aside.

It's hard not to be cynical.

I was at a thing the other week that had Stella Creasy, Jo Swinson and Justin Tomlinson as a panel, and it was so nice to see them actually being normal human beings. They'd generally respect one anothers opinions, agree with ideas on their merits, even if they were voiced by 'the enemy', and genuinely seemed to be capable of working together on things (which was small businesses in this instance).

The question therefore, is are most MPs like this in private and the childish back and forth is reserved for public (and if this is the case, why on earth do they need to do it in public?), or were these three just a (refreshing) bunch of deviants?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Oh, and interesting take on the traditional 'gender divide' in education. This time it's more a technological divide in that girls in developing countries have less access to the web/phones.

 

[Toffeelover]

And yet at the same time non tax payers of the sort who don't earn enough to pay income tax, mostly the poorest in society, are having to pay 20% vat on pretty much all their outgoings.

Everyone pays VAT, your remark in nonsensible, how could you have a zero rate VAT on certain items? and which ones. Which outgoings in your mind attract VAT that the poorest buy? Are the people you are thinking of working full time. Personally I would like to see a 25% vat rate on luxury items, e,.g TVs over £1000, Cars over £45000, Holidays over £10000, Business rate flights. etc now that could be done. It is done in Australia. Now notice not one political party has mentioned this, not even Labour who go on about cost of living. Such a VAT figure could bring quite a bit and would cost nothing to collect.

 

[Toffeelover]

No it's doesn't make me wonder at all. Business owners undercut the working class by paying immigrants a pitiful amount. The Eastern Europeans will work for it because it's more than they can get at home, while the British, quite rightly, won't work for less than the already insultingly low minimum wage. Look at the bigger picture.

Quite agree mate, problem is if as Labour want to do push the LMW to £ 10, it will make migrant workers look all the more attractive to employers as they will still work for less.

 

[Toffeelover]

Do you genuinely believe that teenage girls are so calculating and malicious that they would go through pregnancy, bring a new life into the world and care for the child for 18 years to get some extra benefits? Sounds like a bloody bad deal to me.

The opinion you're spouting is actually very insulting. It's sexist because you're blaming young mothers (why are the fathers not even mentioned in your posts?). It's ignorant because you are taking a complex issue of unplanned pregnancy and trying to claim it is for malicious financial reward. And it's classist, because, by implication, you're perpetrating a myth that young mothers on benefits have a great life and are financially secure when the opposite is true.

With all due respect, you can't call yourself a socialist and then come out with the kind of opinions that Charles Murray famously advocated. Socialism don't work like that.

There is a situation that girls do get pregnant by partners and or boy friends who up and leave them to go off with some one else and leave the girl holding the baby, this is more common than you think. The girl has no option then but to seek assistance. as in many cases the partners will not or cannot pay maintenance.

 

[Eggs]

I was at a thing the other week that had Stella Creasy, Jo Swinson and Justin Tomlinson as a panel, and it was so nice to see them actually being normal human beings. They'd generally respect one anothers opinions, agree with ideas on their merits, even if they were voiced by 'the enemy', and genuinely seemed to be capable of working together on things (which was small businesses in this instance).

The question therefore, is are most MPs like this in private and the childish back and forth is reserved for public (and if this is the case, why on earth do they need to do it in public?), or were these three just a (refreshing) bunch of deviants?

...The group I witnessed were on Adam Boulton Sky programme, in the full public glare but bright and ethical. It was refreshing. I suppose time will tell if they change but it would be good to see new faces on the front benches.

 

[Toffeelover]

There are very few politicians nowadays who even have a clue about most peoples lives and hopes. They are far more concerned with their own finances and power. Lib/Lab/Con, they are all the same and all come from the bossy boots school of elitism. I'm sick of the whole charade........

Pete, many have no experience of life having never had a real job. Examples are Ed Milliband, Balls, Boris, May.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

No it's doesn't make me wonder at all. Business owners undercut the working class by paying immigrants a pitiful amount. The Eastern Europeans will work for it because it's more than they can get at home, while the British, quite rightly, won't work for less than the already insultingly low minimum wage. Look at the bigger picture.

The average migrant (certainly from the A8) is more likely to have a degree than the average native worker. I wonder if the difference is that migrants also see low paid jobs as a stepping stone to something better? It's pretty well known that it's easier to find work if you're already in work. Indeed, a study recently found that it's easier to find work with a criminal record than it is if you've been unemployed for over a year.

I know from my own partner that she worked in some interesting jobs when she first came to Britain. Many of her early jobs would pay something like £15 a week, albeit with accommodation paid for (charities usually but also nannying). She'd do extra work on top of that to earn some pocket money until she learned the language enough to get into medical school. Has now been working in the NHS for half a dozen years or so.

It is anecdotal evidence for sure, but I don't think it's that uncommon, and stats do seem to suggest that many migrants enter the workforce at a lower level than their skills/experience suggest they should, but then they work their way up. It may just be the ones I know of course, which I readily accept.

 

[Seanjd]

Quite agree mate, problem is if as Labour want to do push the LMW to £ 10, it will make migrant workers look all the more attractive to employers as they will still work for less.

You're right, which means they need to be solved in different ways. There is no doubt there needs to be a living wage of at least £10, while European low cost labour needs to be tackled also.

 

[Brennan]

You're right, which means they need to be solved in different ways. There is no doubt there needs to be a living wage of at least £10, while European low cost labour needs to be tackled also.

The living wage does not need to be £10, and it's unrealistic to think that kind of figure can happen without significant numbers of jobs being lost.

 

[Toffeelover]

You're right, which means they need to be solved in different ways. There is no doubt there needs to be a living wage of at least £10, while European low cost labour needs to be tackled also.

Until or unless the Country can stop European workers coming here it will always be very difficult, right now the country can't because of the Freedom of Movement with in the EU. The current lot are trying to get a hold on this but it very difficult but back in 2005 is where the problem seeds were sown under Blair when control was thrown out of the window when the policy was open door.

 

[Toffeelover]

The living wage does not need to be £10, and it's unrealistic to think that kind of figure can happen without significant numbers of jobs being lost.

Brennan that is the proposal that is coming out of the Labour camp.

 

[Seanjd]

The average migrant (certainly from the A8) is more likely to have a degree than the average native worker. I wonder if the difference is that migrants also see low paid jobs as a stepping stone to something better? It's pretty well known that it's easier to find work if you're already in work. Indeed, a study recently found that it's easier to find work with a criminal record than it is if you've been unemployed for over a year.

I know from my own partner that she worked in some interesting jobs when she first came to Britain. Many of her early jobs would pay something like £15 a week, albeit with accommodation paid for (charities usually but also nannying). She'd do extra work on top of that to earn some pocket money until she learned the language enough to get into medical school. Has now been working in the NHS for half a dozen years or so.

It is anecdotal evidence for sure, but I don't think it's that uncommon, and stats do seem to suggest that many migrants enter the workforce at a lower level than their skills/experience suggest they should, but then they work their way up. It may just be the ones I know of course, which I readily accept.

I don't think I really understand the point you're trying to make. Absolutely, many migrants will see low paid jobs as a stepping stone to work.

My point was that in many communities, there are a lack of jobs. Traditionally, working class communities depended on industry for work, which paid relatively well. Since these jobs have ,diminished, since mines have closed and dock yards have dried up, the modern day equivalent are low paid call centres or supermarkets. These employ only a fraction of what industry once did.

Many companies get around paying the already insulting minimum wage by employing groups of migrant workers, to which a lower than minimum wage paying job might seem quite attractive when they pay more than your home country. Which in turn, leaves next to no jobs left for working class people in this country.

It is the fault of the companies who employ migrants at such a low cost.